Participants: Steve Wohlberg
Series Code: HVT
Program Code: HVT000021A
00:07 Will the Nation of Israel become the center
00:12 of end-time Bible Prophecy?
00:14 Yes or no?
00:16 That's our topic on His Voice Today.
00:22 Welcome to another His Voice Today
00:24 with Steve Wohlberg.
00:30 "All Eyes on Israel," that's our subject.
00:33 This is actually the beginning of a four-part series
00:36 dealing with "Israel Issues... "
00:39 very controversial issues.
00:41 Let me just start out with a Jewish joke.
00:43 What do you get when you cross two Jews?
00:46 The answer is: 3 opinions
00:48 and I can tell that joke
00:50 because I'm Jewish, Steve Wohlberg...
00:52 that's my last name, "Wohlberg" I grew up in a Jewish home
00:55 in Los Angeles and I have wrestled with Israel Issues
00:59 especially since I became a Christian
01:01 and began studying Bible prophecy.
01:03 It's no secret that Christians around the world
01:07 their eyes are on Israel,
01:09 their eyes are on the Jewish State.
01:11 They strongly believe that Bible prophecy
01:14 was fulfilled in 1948,
01:16 that Israel is now back in the land
01:18 that there will be a Temple there
01:21 rebuilt on the Temple Mount and that the Battle of Armageddon
01:24 will be a final, bloody, military war against Jews
01:29 during the seven years of tribulation.
01:31 These are dominant teachings in the Christian world.
01:36 I looked with interest, a number of years ago,
01:40 when an issue of Newsweek came out,
01:42 I've got it in front of me, Newsweek, November 1, 1999,
01:46 the front cover said it was on Prophecy.
01:50 It said: "PROPHECY WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS
01:53 ABOUT THE END OF THE WORLD" was the sub-title
01:56 and on page 73 of that particular issue,
01:58 and I quote, it said that
02:01 "The predominant emphasis in Christian prophecy
02:04 is on the return of the Jews to the Holy Land"
02:07 and the rebuilding of the Jerusalem Temple.
02:10 Now, even though that quote is over 10 years old,
02:13 it's definitely true today when it comes to the predominant
02:17 emphasis in Bible prophecy.
02:18 If you go on Amazon. com and do a search
02:21 you'll find lots of books such as: John Hagee's book,
02:25 "Jerusalem Countdown A Warning to the World"
02:28 there's another book by Dave Hunt
02:30 "The Final Battle for Jerusalem Israel Islam and Armageddon"
02:34 here's another one:
02:35 "The Latest Developments in Bible Prophecy" by Randall Price
02:39 the book is called: "The Coming Last Days Temple"
02:43 and the list goes on and on.
02:44 There are television programs, movies, novels, books, websites,
02:49 radio shows, that are zeroed in on the Middle East
02:54 they're looking at events over there
02:56 and they've got their eyes on the Bible,
02:58 they're looking at Revelation, they're looking at Ezekiel,
03:01 they're looking at Zachariah,
03:02 and they're looking at the newspapers,
03:04 they're looking at what's happening in Israel,
03:06 with Iran and the nuclear threat and they are firmly convinced
03:11 that end-time Bible prophecy would swirl
03:15 around the Jewish Nation
03:18 and what we're going to do in this series
03:25 in Part I: All Eyes on Israel,
03:27 and then Part 2, Part 3 and Part 4,
03:30 is we are going to take a close look
03:33 at these Israel issues,
03:35 I know that... again... this is very controversial,
03:39 I'm well aware of this,
03:41 I've been wrestling with these issues for a long time,
03:44 I've written numerous books that reveal my findings,
03:49 based on the New Testament, my study of the book of Daniel,
03:53 of the book of Revelation, and so I'm just going to share
03:56 my thoughts with you and I hope that you will grab
03:59 a Bible and that you'll follow along with me,
04:01 and we will take a look at some of these issues
04:04 and just try to unravel the controversy
04:06 and find out very carefully, what does the New Testament
04:10 and eventually, what does the book of Revelation
04:14 have to say about Israel and Bible prophecy.
04:17 The first text that I'd like us to zero in on
04:21 is in the New Testament,
04:22 it's in 1st Corinthians chapter 2 verse 14,
04:28 1st Corinthians 2:14, let me put my glasses here
04:31 and make sure that I'm quoting it correctly.
04:34 1st Corinthians 2 verse 14, Paul is writing and he's laying
04:41 a foundation, he's dealing with a principle
04:44 that is extremely important.
04:45 Paul wrote:
04:58 Now, in this text,
05:00 Paul is talking about two groups of people
05:02 that the natural man which basically represents
05:06 a large portion of humanity and the predominant portion
05:11 of people that... they're just natural...
05:13 and they don't understand the things of the spirit of God.
05:17 Things that come from the Holy Spirit
05:19 and that's just typical to the way
05:21 people are generally these days.
05:23 In the next verse, verse 15, Paul said,
05:29 So you've got "natural man" who sees through natural eyes,
05:33 and then you've got the "spiritual man"
05:35 who sees through the eyes of the Holy Spirit.
05:39 I want to develop this thought, as we go along.
05:43 Now, if you have a Bible, follow me in the book of John.
05:47 John is an amazing book, it's the fourth gospel book,
05:51 there's Matthew, Mark, Luke and John,
05:53 John, certainly was Jewish and in the book of John,
05:57 we find a conflict, as in the other gospels
06:01 between Jesus Christ and...
06:03 and many of the Jewish leaders not all of them but many of them
06:06 and there are some amazing principles that are brought out
06:10 in the book of John concerning the issue of natural man
06:13 and the spiritual man.
06:15 So, I'd like to look up four texts with you.
06:18 John chapter 2 is the first section
06:23 in verses 18 to 21, we find Jesus having a dialogue
06:27 with certain Jewish leaders, and He told them in verse 19,
06:31 that if... He said,
06:37 That's what He said, "Destroy this temple,"
06:40 Jesus told them in verse 20:
06:53 And then verse 21 says,
06:56 "But Jesus spoke of the temple of His body. "
06:59 Now in this particular instance, Jesus used the word "temple"
07:04 when he said, "Destroy this temple
07:06 and I will rebuilt it in three days... "
07:07 He used it in reference to himself.
07:09 The Jewish people that were listening to Him,
07:13 they were natural men,
07:15 they didn't understand spiritual things
07:17 and when they heard what Jesus said,
07:19 they immediately thought about the physical temple
07:21 and they thought, "How is this possible
07:24 that this man can destroy the temple
07:26 and rebuild it in three days?"
07:27 So, they were natural men who understood...
07:30 who only understood
07:32 and saw through natural eyes but Jesus, of course,
07:35 is the ultimate spiritual man,
07:37 and He was talking about a Spiritual Temple...
07:39 the temple of His body.
07:40 So that's example number one, that's in John 2.
07:45 In John 3, Jesus talked to a Jewish man named Nicodemus
07:49 Nicodemus came to Him at night
07:52 and he wanted to ask him some questions
07:54 and Jesus responds in verse 3, Jesus said to this Jewish man,
08:01 He said "Nicodemus, you have to be born again,
08:04 and you're never going to understand anything
08:07 that I have to say, unless you are born again. "
08:10 Now, Nicodemus, at this point was a natural man
08:13 and in verse 4 he responded and said,
08:24 So, Nicodemus... as a natural man,
08:27 heard the sayings of Christ,
08:29 and thought that when he said "you must be born again"
08:31 He was talking about physical birth.
08:33 Natural people tend to see
08:35 things only literally on the surface
08:38 and they don't see the underlying spiritual meaning.
08:40 And so, Nicodemus said,
08:41 "How can I go back into my mother's body
08:43 and be born again?"
08:45 But that's not what Jesus was talking about.
08:47 In verses 5 and 6, Jesus clarified...
08:50 in verse 6 he said,
08:58 Marvel not that I say to you, you must be born again. "
09:00 So when Jesus talked about a new birth,
09:02 He was talking about a "Spiritual Birth"
09:05 through the Holy Spirit
09:07 and then Nicodemus, if that had happened to him,
09:09 he would be able to see through spiritual eyes.
09:11 So, that's example number two.
09:14 Example number 3 is in the next chapter... in John chapter 4,
09:17 where Jesus had a dialogue with a Samaritan Woman
09:20 at a well... and Jesus told this woman
09:23 that if she knew the gift of God and who He was,
09:27 she would have asked Him
09:28 and He would have given her "living water. "
09:31 Jesus said, "I want to give you living water. "
09:33 And in verse 11... John 4:11, "The woman said, to Him,
09:37 "Sir, You have nothing to draw with,
09:42 Now, this woman was a natural woman.
09:44 She didn't understand when Jesus said,
09:46 "I want to give you living water"
09:47 she looked down and she said,
09:49 "How are you going to get down there
09:50 and where are you going to get this living water?"
09:52 And so, she just saw on the surface of things
09:56 but Jesus didn't mean real water,
09:59 He meant the water of life
10:01 through the Holy Spirit that He would give her
10:03 if she believed in Him as the Messiah.
10:06 So, that's a third example.
10:08 In John chapter 6 we find Jesus having a dialogue
10:11 with a group of Jewish people and He told them in verse 54
10:16 that they needed to eat His flesh and drink His blood
10:19 or they would have no life in them.
10:21 In verse 52, John 6:52 says,
10:32 Now, these Jews were natural Jews,
10:34 they only saw on the surface of things,
10:37 they took Christ's words literally
10:40 and they didn't see the spiritual meaning
10:42 so when Jesus said,
10:43 "You have to eat my flesh and drink my blood... "
10:45 they thought He was talking about cannibalism.
10:47 They thought He was talking about, you know,
10:49 putting a little salt on his arm
10:51 and saying, "Here, take a bite"
10:52 and they thought, "You know, this is impossible...
10:54 how can we do this,
10:56 is this man teaching cannibalism?"
10:57 But Jesus was not teaching cannibalism,
11:00 in verse 63, He said, "the words that I say to you-
11:03 they are Spirit and they are life. "
11:05 And when Jesus said, "eat my flesh and drink my blood"
11:07 He means, take His Word into your life.
11:11 So, in John 2,
11:15 we find a group of Jewish people
11:17 misunderstanding what Jesus meant about the Temple.
11:20 It wasn't a literal temple... in that verse,
11:22 it was the temple of His body,
11:23 in John 3, Jesus talked about the new birth
11:26 and Nicodemus thought it was a literal birth
11:29 but no... it was a spiritual birth...
11:31 being born again by the Holy Spirit.
11:33 In John 4, we have a woman who understood Christ's words
11:37 about living water to mean water in the well...
11:40 but it was spiritual water of the Holy Spirit
11:43 and in John 6, you have a group of Jewish people
11:46 who understood Christ's words
11:47 about eating His flesh and drinking His blood,
11:49 as applying to cannibalism but it was actually "His Word"
11:54 that He wanted them to eat.
11:55 So, there are four examples in the book of John
11:59 where natural people understood Jesus Christ's words
12:07 in a surface... literal sense, but Jesus did not mean that,
12:13 He was using these words in a deeply spiritual sense
12:18 and they didn't understand what He was saying.
12:21 Now, this is very important,
12:23 I've been studying this for years so...
12:25 at least... hear me out.
12:27 Those four examples of John chapter...
12:30 in John 2, 3, 4 and 6,
12:32 have lessons for us in the book of Revelation.
12:38 The book of Revelation is the last book of the Bible.
12:42 The book of Revelation
12:44 is the greatest book on prophecy ever written.
12:47 The book of Revelation, contains prophecies
12:51 about something called "Mystery Babylon"
12:55 that deceives the whole world.
12:57 It also talks about Israel and the tribes of Israel
13:02 in Revelation chapter 7
13:04 who are sealed in their foreheads
13:06 and also talks about a battle... a final battle
13:10 in Revelation 16:16 called Armageddon
13:13 and it's obvious that the contestants in Revelation
13:17 are Babylon and Israel, and we have an Armageddon
13:22 and we also have prophecies about a beast
13:25 with seven heads and ten horns
13:27 and about a woman who rides a beast
13:30 that has seven heads and ten horns
13:34 so, here's a question.
13:35 Is it possible... well first of all... let me ask
13:39 who wrote the book of Revelation?
13:41 Now, it says in chapter 1, that Revelation is...
13:45 in verse 1... it is the revelation of Jesus Christ.
13:49 So, obviously, the book of Revelation
13:52 came from Jesus,
13:53 but who wrote it... who was the physical writer?
13:56 The answer to that is found in verse 4.
13:59 It says, "John, to the seven churches which are in Asia:
14:03 Grace be to you and peace... "
14:06 John wrote the book of Revelation
14:09 and John is the same one that wrote the book of John.
14:14 In the book of John, we find Jesus Christ dialoguing
14:19 with various people who only understood His words
14:23 in a physical sense and who really missed
14:26 what He was really trying to say.
14:28 That's in the book of John...
14:30 the same John... wrote the book of Revelation
14:33 and the book of Revelation
14:35 is the revelation of Jesus Christ,
14:37 and the book of Revelation talks about
14:39 things like the Temple, it talks about Babylon,
14:41 it talks about Israel, it talks about the beast,
14:44 it talks about Armageddon.
14:45 So the question is:
14:47 Does the same issue that we looked at
14:52 in the book of John apply to the book of Revelation?
14:54 In other words, is there a natural way
14:58 that we could read Revelation and see it simply,
15:03 literally on the surface and really miss what Revelation
15:07 is really all about?
15:09 And then is there a Spiritual way,
15:11 through the Holy Spirit, to understand
15:14 the meaning of the book?
15:15 Now, I'm not talking about being a liberal
15:17 because I'm not a liberal, and I'm not talking about
15:20 rationalizing a way or watering down
15:23 what the prophecy is really saying.
15:26 What I'm saying is: "How do we understand
15:31 what the prophecy is really saying?
15:33 What is it really saying?
15:35 Is there going to be a literal, seven-headed, ten-horned beast
15:40 that looks like a lion, a leopard and a dragon
15:45 as described in Revelation chapter 13
15:47 or does that term apply to something else?
15:52 Is there going to be a literal woman named Babylon,
15:55 Mystery Babylon that rises up out of the Mediterranean
15:59 and goes around the world
16:01 riding a seven-headed, ten-horned beast
16:03 and that this is covered in the major news networks
16:06 by CNN and Fox News?
16:08 And when it talks about Israel being the center of the storm,
16:12 and the battle of Armageddon and Babylon and Israel
16:15 and Armageddon,
16:16 are these events that apply to those literal places,
16:21 literal Babylon, literal Euphrates,
16:24 literal Israel, a literal woman, a literal beast,
16:28 or do we need to understand
16:32 Revelation... through the eyes of the Holy Spirit?
16:37 It's interesting in the book of
16:40 Revelation chapter 1, verse 10,
16:42 John starts out by saying, "I was in the Spirit... "
16:45 and then he got the book,
16:47 all throughout this book John makes statements like that.
16:51 In Revelation chapter 17 when he talks about
16:56 Mystery Babylon, and this lady,
17:00 it says in verse 3 that he carried me away in the Spirit
17:05 into the wilderness and I saw a woman,
17:07 so it's obvious when you read the text
17:10 that John was in the Spirit when he got the book
17:14 and he revealed these things through Jesus Christ,
17:18 Jesus Christ gave him the book of Revelation,
17:20 and it's obvious that we need spiritual understanding
17:24 just like the Jews needed spiritual understanding
17:27 in the book of John, we need spiritual understanding
17:30 in order to understand this book correctly.
17:33 We need the Holy Spirit,
17:35 we can't afford to be natural people
17:38 like Paul said, "The natural man doesn't
17:40 understand the things of the Spirit of God. "
17:44 Now, let me put another thought into your head,
17:47 when you study the New Testament carefully,
17:51 it's also clear
17:52 that just like there's a natural man and a spiritual man,
17:54 so there are really two Israel's
17:57 in the New Testament.
17:59 In 1st Corinthians chapter 10 verse 18,
18:04 Paul talked about... he said,
18:06 "Behold Israel after the flesh:"
18:08 there is an Israel after the flesh...
18:10 in 1st Corinthians 10:18,
18:14 when you go to the book of Romans,
18:15 especially chapters 9 to 11
18:19 that really deal with these "Israel issues,"
18:21 in verse 3, Romans 9:3, Paul wrote,
18:25 "I wish that I were accursed from Christ for my brethren,
18:30 my kinsmen according to the flesh:
18:33 who are Israelites;"
18:34 so Paul loved the Jewish people so much
18:36 and he knew that many of them were rejecting him,
18:38 rejecting Jesus,
18:40 and he even wished that he could be separated from Christ
18:43 if they could be saved,
18:44 he was so sacrificial in his love.
18:47 And in verse 4, again,
18:49 he talked about Israelites according to the flesh.
18:51 So there are Israelites according to the flesh.
18:54 Now, in verse 6, Paul drops a bomb
18:58 and in verse 6 he says,
19:00 "... they are not all Israel which are of Israel... "
19:02 they're not all "the Israel of God"
19:05 who are of Israel of the
19:06 literal Jewish Nation,
19:08 so, he really says, "there are two Israel's"
19:10 just like... I've got two eyes and two ears,
19:12 two hands, Paul said in verse 6 there are two Israel's.
19:16 And he said, "they're not all Israel...
19:19 meaning... God's Israel who are of Israel,
19:21 verse 7 says,
19:22 "neither, just because they're the seed of Abraham,
19:24 are they all children:
19:25 but in Isaac your seed will be called. "
19:28 Now in verse 8, Paul wrote,
19:29 "That is, they which are the children of the flesh,"
19:33 those which are just children of the flesh,
19:36 natural descendants of Abraham,
19:37 he said, "these are not the children of God;
19:41 but the children of the promise they are counted for the seed"
19:46 counted as the seed of Abraham...
19:49 the children of the promise.
19:51 Now who are the children of the promise
19:53 that are counted by God as the seed of Abraham?
19:56 The answer to that is in the book of Galatians
20:00 and I've done an extensive study on Galatians.
20:04 In Galatians chapter 3 verse 14 Paul makes it clear
20:11 who he's talking about.
20:12 Paul said that,
20:24 So in Romans 9 verse 8, he said
20:26 the children of the promise are counted as the seed
20:30 and in Galatians 3:14, he talks about the Gentiles
20:33 and the Jews, together, who believe in Jesus Christ,
20:37 who receive the promise, there's the promise...
20:40 the children of the promise are counted as the seed
20:42 and we receive the promise of the spirit of the Holy Spirit
20:47 through faith.
20:48 So, gentiles can be part of that promise through faith
20:53 in Jesus Christ.
20:55 In Galatians 3:29, Paul drops another bomb
20:59 and he wrote, "If you... "
21:02 and Paul is writing to Gentiles,
21:04 and I'm assuming that most of you who are watching
21:07 or listening to this Program are Gentiles,
21:09 Paul wrote in verse 29, Galatians 3:29 that
21:22 You are an heir of the promises of God that were given to Israel
21:26 to the seed of Abraham, Paul says that,
21:29 "You can be an heir to those promises,
21:32 and you can be part of the seed of Abraham
21:34 through Jesus Christ. "
21:36 So, Paul is clear in Galatians, that Jews who believe in Jesus
21:41 and Gentiles who believe in Jesus,
21:42 are all counted as the seed,
21:45 they're all part of the seed of Abraham.
21:48 Now, in chapter 6, at the end of the book,
21:52 Paul wrote:
21:54 "In Christ Jesus" verse 15...
21:57 "circumcision doesn't avail anything,"
21:59 and that applies to the Jews
22:00 "nor uncircumcision... " that applies to the Gentiles.
22:03 But what really counts is a new... a new creature.
22:06 And verse 16 says,
22:07 "As many as walk according to this rule,
22:09 peace be on them and mercy,
22:11 and upon the Israel of God. "
22:13 The Israel of God...
22:15 so in 1st Corinthians 10:18, Paul said,
22:18 "there's an Israel of the flesh"
22:20 and in Galatians 6:16, he said, "there's an Israel of God"
22:24 in other words, there's a "natural Israel"
22:27 and there is a "spiritual Israel"
22:28 and the Israel of God is an Israel that is composed
22:33 of Jews who believe in Jesus, like Matthew, Mark...
22:38 not Luke... because Luke was a Gentile,
22:40 but John... and all the disciples,
22:42 Peter, James et cetera, who accepted Christ as the Messiah,
22:47 and then Gentiles,
22:49 like you and people around the world,
22:52 who believe in Jesus, trust the promise,
22:55 they are also counted as the seed,
22:58 so when you study Galatians very carefully,
23:01 the Israel of God, in Galatians is composed of Jews
23:05 and Gentiles together who believe in the Lord
23:09 and who have the Holy Spirit,
23:11 that has changed their lives and they've become children
23:15 of the promise of the Holy Ghost.
23:18 That's what we read in the book of Galatians.
23:22 Now, I'll just give you a little background about myself.
23:27 As I mentioned earlier, I'm Jewish...
23:29 Steve Wohlberg is a Jewish name, my family is Jewish,
23:32 I grew up in the Hollywood Hills in southern California,
23:34 I was born in 1959,
23:36 but my family was, sad to say, very secular,
23:40 we didn't go to the synagogue,
23:43 we didn't read the Bible, we didn't pray,
23:45 even Bar Mitzvah wasn't urged upon us.
23:48 As a teenager, and I was Jewish,
23:51 but as Jewish teenager,
23:52 I just... I followed the flesh, I was of the flesh,
23:55 I got involved in the Hollywood scene
23:56 in the lifestyle... the drugs, the entertainment,
23:59 the Rock 'n' Roll, the Cocaine, the LSD,
24:02 the Marijuana, it's not a pretty picture,
24:05 and that's all behind me now.
24:07 But I was Jewish, but I was Jewish...
24:09 I was part of Israel according to the flesh.
24:12 That's just the way I lived. A fleshy way...
24:15 I was certainly a natural man.
24:17 When I was 20 years old by the grace of God,
24:20 through the goodness of my Lord and my Messiah,
24:24 I began to read the Bible, I read the New Testament.
24:27 I discovered the Garden of Gethsemane,
24:28 I discovered Jesus Christ as my Messiah and as my Savior
24:31 and I was so moved by Jesus suffering for me
24:35 in Gethsemane and the Holy Spirit made a move on me
24:38 as a 20-year-old lost Jewish person in LA, in Hollywood,
24:42 and I finally saw the light, I saw Christ's goodness,
24:45 I saw His grace, I saw that He was my Messiah,
24:48 and I accepted Him as my Savior,
24:50 and I can testify without any question in my mind,
24:55 that when I accepted Jesus as my Savior
24:58 the Holy Spirit came into my life and I was born again.
25:01 I was changed
25:03 and I began to see everything differently through new eyes,
25:05 prior to age 20, I was a part of Israel
25:09 according to the flesh,
25:10 when I accepted Jesus as my Messiah,
25:12 I became part of the Israel of God
25:15 through the Holy Spirit, who had changed my life
25:18 and that's the truth.
25:20 Now, in the next few Programs,
25:22 as we continue on with this series,
25:24 eventually we're going to go deeper
25:26 into the book of Revelation,
25:27 because the book of Revelation talks about a final battle
25:30 between Babylon, God and Israel
25:33 and the beast and the false prophet and the harlot.
25:38 Now the question is, yes, Israel is in Revelation,
25:43 yes, Israel will be part of Bible prophecy,
25:45 but here's the question, the question is
25:47 "Which Israel is the center of the end?"
25:49 Will it be Israel of the flesh,
25:51 just natural Jewish people centered in the Middle East
25:54 or wherever may be...
25:55 or is it the Israel of God in Jesus Christ
25:59 that is composed of Jewish people
26:01 and non-Jews together
26:04 who have the Holy Spirit and who believe in the Lord?
26:07 I will prove to you, when we get there,
26:11 in the days ahead, that the Book of Revelation's
26:14 focus, it's center,
26:17 is definitely Jesus Christ and the Israel of God
26:21 that is centered in Him.
26:23 So, stay tuned... more to come...
26:26 God bless you, and we hope to see you then.
26:29 We hope you've enjoyed this timely message
26:31 from Pastor Steve Wohlberg
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