Participants: Wayne Blakely (Host), Thank Chiwaya
Series Code: PC
Program Code: PC000111A
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00:01 The following program discusses sensitive issues.
00:03 Parents are cautioned that some material 00:05 may be too candid for younger children. 00:40 Hi, I'm Wayne Blakely with Pure Choices 00:42 and from Coming Out Ministries. 00:45 Today, I'm here with Thandi Chiwaya. 00:48 And, Thandi, I'm really blessed 00:51 to be able to have this conversation 00:53 with you today. 00:55 We met under some rather unusual circumstances 00:58 and I wondered if you might tell a little bit 01:00 about that to start with? 01:01 I sure will. 01:03 I happened to be watching RPC, the Barry Project. 01:09 It's a church that's in Maryland, 01:10 on Praise Vision. 01:12 I happen to be tuned in this particular Sabbath, 01:15 roughly about a year ago. 01:17 I couldn't make it out to church 01:18 and I was determined to tune into Toronto West. 01:21 And for whatever reason, the connection never made it 01:24 and so I needed to tune in to the RPC, 01:27 Maryland, Barry Project. 01:29 And I saw you presenting. 01:31 I was really excited when I figured out 01:34 what you were talking about. 01:36 And what was the topic of the day? 01:38 The topic was God's saving grace 01:42 towards the homosexual community, 01:44 if I had to encapsulate it. 01:46 I was so excited the moment I saw you speaking. 01:49 I took to my Facebook page and I wrote to my friends, 01:52 LGBTQ family, if you're not busy at 12 o'clock, 01:57 tune into Praise Vision, tune into the RPC Church. 02:01 And they did to my great surprise, 02:03 a few of them wrote me back and said, 02:04 "This isn't something that we would normally do 02:06 but because you asked us we will tune in." 02:09 And they did. 02:10 And I got some positive feedback. 02:11 That's a presentation that I often give 02:15 during the divine hour. 02:17 It's called Engage, 02:19 and it has to do with talking to the congregation 02:23 about reaching out 02:26 and becoming close to the LGBT community. 02:33 We've distanced ourselves. 02:35 At least the church has distanced themself 02:37 so much over the years. 02:39 And so it was surprising when I later found out 02:41 that you had asked your LGBT friends to view it. 02:47 The purpose is actually as an educational tool 02:51 to help the church 02:53 or congregational members recognize 02:57 where their ignorance has been in their lives. 02:58 And when you engaged with me later, 03:01 you told me that your LGBT friends 03:04 were not offended. 03:06 No, they were not. They were not. 03:08 As a matter of fact, 03:09 there are a few that are questioning 03:12 and they even question me to this day. 03:14 And so it was a great opportunity 03:16 to open up a dialog with them. 03:18 And even if they didn't come around 03:19 to seeing things the way that I saw them 03:21 as presented in scripture, there's a chance to pray, 03:24 there's a chance to talk with them, 03:26 and the chance for God to work in their hearts 03:29 even behind the scenes. 03:31 I'm grateful that the message came across 03:33 as loving as it was intended. 03:36 I had no idea that I would have the privilege of meeting you 03:40 almost a year later 03:41 when I came to present in Berrien Springs. 03:44 And you let me know that you were there. 03:46 And what happened as a result was 03:48 you were able to tell me about your own story 03:52 which has really touched me. 03:54 So I wondered if you might tell us 03:56 about the early beginnings in your life? 04:00 Sure. 04:01 I come from an immigrant family. 04:04 My mom is from Georgetown, Guyana 04:07 which is considered part of the West Indies. 04:09 And my dad is from Malawi, Africa. 04:11 Being that they were immigrants, 04:13 they met in England, they married, 04:15 and they settled in the United States in New York. 04:18 They had me and my three younger brothers. 04:21 And my grandmother, 04:23 my mother's mother came up to a sister from Guyana 04:27 in rearing us, taking care of us. 04:31 I know that in many cultures that this topic is not one 04:36 that people bring to the service to discuss, 04:40 also know that as a result of being young 04:46 and the great controversy that is at hand 04:49 between God and Satan that Satan starts very early, 04:54 he looks for the earliest moment 04:56 of which he can challenge a child 04:59 in what they might believe. 05:01 And because of this chaos, 05:04 it seems to be a very vulnerable position to be in. 05:09 King David said that he was born 05:12 and conceived in iniquity. 05:15 And so as you were young, tell me a little bit about 05:20 what happened as you were stepping off 05:24 into your young childhood. 05:27 Being that I was raised in Queens, New York 05:29 with an immigrant family. 05:32 My parents weren't what we call an equal match. 05:35 My mom was raised Adventist, my dad was not. 05:38 My mother's mother was Adventist, 05:41 when they settled and got married, 05:42 my mom wanted to do things a particular way 05:45 and my dad had other ideas 05:46 and so that brought some tension to the home. 05:49 And my grandmother did her best to be able 05:51 to be that stabilizing force. 05:53 But you can't be everywhere. 05:56 One of the ways that my grandmother 05:57 used her sisters in generating income was 05:59 she would babysit. 06:01 And in babysitting, she'd watch children 06:03 that were a lot older than me 06:05 and you can't be everywhere as you're watching children. 06:08 And so I remember being out in the backyard one day 06:11 with these children that were a lot older than me. 06:13 I was about three years old at this point in time. 06:16 And these children were probably about nine and ten, 06:18 they were sort of siblings. 06:20 And I was playing in the yard with them 06:21 and we have an enclosed back staircase. 06:24 And I remember they invited me into that back staircase. 06:26 And at three years old, 06:28 I saw them performing oral sex on one of the other. 06:31 And that was my first introduction to sex 06:34 at the age of three. 06:35 That must have been an incredible shock to you. 06:40 I can't imagine what a child goes through 06:42 when they see something, 06:44 you know, that they haven't been told about 06:46 or talked about, 06:47 and actually is supposed to be preserved 06:49 until another point 06:50 in our lives many, many years later. 06:52 But not only did you encounter someone 06:55 in their young adolescent years, 06:58 engaging in sex, 07:00 but then you made discoveries inside your home. 07:04 I did. So, I was six years old. 07:06 And my brothers, and I, 07:08 and our friends in the neighborhood were playing. 07:10 We were playing in the basement of our house. 07:13 And we came across a huge stash of pornography. 07:17 It included VHS tapes at the time 07:21 and very hardcore illicit magazines. 07:25 And so as children, 07:26 you don't know how to process that, 07:28 you don't know what to do with that when you see it. 07:30 And so we started to practice and engage in the things 07:34 that we saw are for us and our friends 07:37 that were there in the neighborhood. 07:39 Wow. 07:40 I'm guessing that because usually pornography 07:44 is most often heterosexual in its nature, 07:48 so your experimentation was awful. 07:51 It was probably also a heterosexual, 07:52 is that right? 07:54 Actually no. 07:55 Because in my younger days, 07:57 little girls usually played with the little girls 07:59 and little boys with little boys, 08:00 I don't know how it is today. 08:02 But most of my playmates were of the same gender 08:05 and so the experimentation that took place 08:07 were with my playmates that were of the same gender. 08:11 Okay. 08:13 So there must have been 08:14 a fair amount of secrecy around this, I'm guessing. 08:17 Absolutely. 08:19 My family was not the one to have that discussion with. 08:22 It's very taboo in our culture, homosexuality. 08:25 Just the topic of it... 08:26 It's not something that's readily discussed 08:29 in the black community. 08:31 And so I wasn't going to risk getting a whipping 08:34 for what I was into. 08:37 It felt good but I knew that it wasn't good. 08:40 And so I wasn't going to try to explain, 08:43 "Mom, I was doing this or I got involved in this." 08:47 I just kept it to myself. 08:49 Were there discussions in your home 08:51 about sex of this nature, 08:54 or about same sex relationships at all? 08:58 Very much so. 09:00 Not just in my home but in our general community 09:03 so in my home, yes, specifically. 09:06 It wasn't uncommon to hear comments of the like of, 09:11 God would rain down fire 09:12 and brimstone on those types of people, 09:15 and Sodom and Gomorrah going straight to hell 09:17 that wasn't unusual. 09:18 Not just in my home 09:20 but as I stated in our community, 09:22 in our church. 09:24 So I really, it wasn't something 09:26 that I wanted to try to sort out 09:28 with the adults around me. 09:29 I really kept it to myself 09:31 and it was a really ugly secret. 09:32 And yet, you seem to maybe have had some kind of moral compass. 09:38 Well, my grandmother served as that moral compass. 09:42 My grandmother was the stabilizing force 09:43 in our home. 09:45 She was Christian, she was Seventh-day Adventist, 09:47 she took us to church with her every Sabbath. 09:51 And in so doing, I started to learn a lot of 09:54 what she believed. 09:57 And I didn't necessarily... 09:59 I knew in my heart that that's not something 10:01 that I should be doing. 10:03 But I wasn't comfortable to have the discussion 10:05 with her or my mother. 10:07 And so I have this inner battle that was going on. 10:11 And I didn't know how to fix it. 10:14 I wanted to stop. But I didn't know how to stop. 10:17 And I didn't know who to talk to, 10:19 to help me to stop. 10:22 I'm guessing that there was 10:24 a lack of a demonstration of genuine love in the home. 10:29 And so that this might have been the reason 10:32 that you were engaging or continuing engaged 10:35 in what had felt good. 10:37 Whoa, that certainly did meet a need 10:39 even if it was in the wrong way. 10:41 Okay. 10:43 Was there an event that caused you to think 10:46 that maybe something was wrong with this behavior? 10:50 Couldn't say it was an event. 10:52 I could say that it was just our general overall culture, 10:55 and the comments that we would hear, 10:56 and even in the music. 10:59 It wasn't uncommon to hear that homosexuals need to die, 11:04 and people aren't like that... 11:06 That we're not like that, 11:07 so it was just a well-known factor 11:10 in our community that this was not a discussion. 11:13 It was beyond taboo, 11:15 somebody might have been that way 11:16 but it certainly didn't happen in our house. 11:18 And I wasn't going to let the cat out of the bag 11:20 that it was me. 11:22 Wow. 11:23 So you were carrying a sense of guilt. 11:26 You felt bad about the situation. 11:28 You didn't feel safe in your home 11:30 or your church to discuss it. 11:34 What interrupted your life? 11:37 You know, God is so faithful. 11:39 Going through elementary school, 11:40 I remember being teased and bullied 11:42 and the name calling, 11:45 I always struggled with my hair. 11:47 Being that I'm African-American 11:49 and I remember we reached a point in my family 11:51 where we had to cut it off, and... 11:54 I think you shared something with me 11:55 that when you say we cut it off, there was a... 12:00 Excuse me, there was an incident that took place 12:03 where it wasn't just you cutting your hair off. 12:06 No it wasn't. 12:09 My mom, working really hard as a nurse, 12:12 working as a night nurse 12:13 didn't have a lot of time to be at home to... 12:16 I guess for us to bond, 12:18 for me to develop those finer female comb qualities. 12:22 And so it wasn't uncommon for me 12:24 to go to school with my hair uncombed, 12:25 and it wasn't uncommon for the children at school 12:27 to pick on me because my hair was uncombed. 12:30 And I remember her sister saying, 12:32 "You know, you really shouldn't have had girls. 12:34 You should have had all boys 12:36 because you don't know what to do with a girl" 12:37 to my mother which started questions inside of me. 12:41 I started asking, "Well, did God make a mistake? 12:44 Was I supposed to be a little boy 12:45 instead of a little girl?" 12:47 And so my Aunt wanted to fix the situation, 12:49 she wanted to help out. 12:50 And I remember my mom sent us off 12:51 for spring break one year with her. 12:54 And I was turning seven, and my Aunt thought 12:57 that she would help out by giving me 12:58 what's known as the jheri curl back then. 13:01 And it was fun for the moment that I had it, 13:03 my hair was flowing, 13:04 and all of the classmates were talking about it, 13:07 and it was fun. 13:08 But my mom didn't know how to take care of it. 13:10 And so I returned home 13:12 and it looked good for about three months, 13:14 and then we finally did make it into the hairdressers 13:16 to have it touched up. 13:18 My hair was breaking 13:19 and so the hairdresser looked at my mom 13:21 and said I can't do anything else 13:22 but to trim my hair. 13:23 And so she trimmed and it was a choppy haircut. 13:26 And I got home. 13:28 And my dad was still living with us 13:30 at this point in time. 13:32 And my dad looked at it and in his culture, 13:34 they didn't do that, they just cut their hair short 13:36 because he is Malawian. 13:38 And so my dad cut my hair down to less than an inch. 13:44 Oh, my. 13:45 And this is the day before I'm starting second grade 13:48 for the second time because I had gotten left back. 13:50 I was already humiliated because I had been left back 13:54 and having to start school again 13:56 as a little girl with no hair. 13:58 I hid under the bed. 14:01 My dad told me to get out from under the bed 14:04 or I could risk a whipping. 14:05 And so I got off from under the bed 14:07 and very tearfully went to school. 14:09 And had all the little girls call, 14:11 the little kids in school call me, 14:13 "Boy" and "Lesbian" and all sorts of things. 14:17 So that just started me down a path that 14:19 "Well, it obviously must be true." 14:21 And so I kept the horrible secret 14:22 and it was rough. 14:24 And I endured a lot of bullying in school from I would say, 14:28 the age of 7 until I got to academy at 13. 14:32 And as you mentioned, 14:34 you asked me about the turning point. 14:35 The turning point was when I was 13. 14:37 My mom... 14:39 Just first... 14:41 You in this experimentation that was taking place, 14:45 how long did the experimentation go on? 14:46 I would say from the ages of 7 until I was 13, 13.5. 14:51 Okay. So wow, you've endured years of this. 14:55 You haven't talked about it in the home. 14:56 You know in your heart that it's not right, 14:59 and something happens at school. 15:02 So I go to school and I know I have this problem. 15:04 And it's my first year at Greater New York Academy, 15:08 a Christian high school, 15:10 Seventh-day Adventist high school 15:11 in Queens, New York. 15:12 And I knew this but I was keeping it 15:14 because I just didn't trust anybody around me 15:16 with this horrible secret. 15:17 I didn't think anybody could help me 15:19 and I didn't think that they cared. 15:21 So I went to school and I'm just feeling like 15:22 this is just me 15:23 and I'm the only person in the world 15:25 that this is happening to. 15:27 And I got to the end of my freshman year. 15:29 And we didn't have a good religion teacher, 15:30 we had a great religion teacher. 15:32 His name was Pastor James Clark at Greater New York Academy. 15:38 The end of my freshman year at about April is 15:40 when we have our senior class trip. 15:42 Though I wasn't in the senior class 15:43 there were two girls that were caught experimenting 15:47 with one another on the senior class trip. 15:49 And we were a fairly small academy 15:51 about 150 students in the big city. 15:54 So it didn't take long for that to be all over the lunchroom 15:58 and all over the school. 16:00 The moment we got back to class, 16:01 you know, everybody was talking about 16:03 these two girls that got caught. 16:07 Our pastor took the opportunity to address it, 16:09 but he didn't address it in the way 16:11 that you would think he would address it. 16:13 He didn't wait for chapel, 16:15 he didn't call it out from the pulpit, 16:17 he didn't name call, he didn't shame these girls. 16:20 He met with our classes one by one 16:21 and I happened to be 16:23 in the religion one class that year. 16:25 And I remember he met with our class 16:28 and he gently and he lovingly opened the scriptures. 16:31 And he pointed out that homosexuality was 16:34 not part of God's original plan for the family. 16:40 He pointed out that scriptures stood very opposed 16:44 in Leviticus 18 and 20 and 1 Corinthians 6. 16:50 But he didn't stop there in the discussion. 16:53 And as you can imagine, 16:54 I'm there at the edge of my seat 16:55 and I really want to know. 16:57 Because I want out of this too, but I just don't want to have 17:00 to share it with anybody. 17:01 All right. 17:03 And he said, "You know, you don't have to stay there, 17:07 'There's one God and one mediator," 17:09 1 Timothy 2:5, "The man Christ Jesus." 17:13 And that was so important for me to hear 17:15 because I had a world view that told me 17:18 that my dead relatives were floating over my head, 17:21 very disappointed in me, but unable to help me, 17:25 unable to talk to me, 17:26 unable to get me out of my situation. 17:29 And that God was angry with me and that the sky would open up, 17:34 and rain fire on me, 17:36 and destroy me at some point in time 17:37 because God had no use for a person like me. 17:41 And so when he said, 17:42 "The only person you need to tell it to was God." 17:44 That was so important to me 17:46 because I was not going to confess this to a priest 17:48 or to anybody else. 17:50 But he didn't stop there, 17:51 he said, he talked about an adult lesbian couple 17:56 that found themselves in the situation. 17:58 And then he studied with them, that he prayed with them, 18:01 that he presented these same principles 18:03 from the scripture, and they believed. 18:06 And not only that they believed but they separated as a couple. 18:10 One went on to become married to husband and have children. 18:14 The other one at that point in time was still single, 18:16 but serving the Lord with all of her heart. 18:19 And I believed him, 18:20 I just believed him with everything, 18:22 because your character isn't completely molded 18:24 as a young teen. 18:26 You can still be molded, your mind can still be changed, 18:29 and so I wanted that change 18:31 because I didn't want to go to a burning hell. 18:33 And so when I left class that day and I went home, 18:36 I just prayed. 18:37 And I took God to task. 18:39 So you didn't take opportunity to talk to the instructor. 18:42 Well, why? 18:43 He said, "There is one God and one mediator 18:45 between God and man." 18:46 Why do I need to talk it through with him? 18:48 And you and I both know that at this particular point 18:50 in our lives, 18:52 while we were seen in the church 18:53 with condemnation, nobody was talking about it 18:55 from a point of love and forgiveness, right? 18:58 That's correct. 19:00 And so you're having an experience just from 19:03 what he said and how he represented by contrast 19:05 in the school classroom to the church environment. 19:09 You saw the love of Jesus Christ convict 19:12 in your heart and you went home, 19:14 and did what? 19:15 Prayed. I prayed. 19:17 I took it to God in prayer 19:18 and I said, "Lord, I really don't want to 19:20 go to a burning hell." 19:21 I don't want the sky to open up on me, 19:23 I don't want to be lost, 19:25 and I certainly don't want to be lost like this. 19:28 Only you can help me to stop this." 19:30 And, you know, he did. 19:33 I don't know how he did it. 19:34 But the next thing I knew a year went by 19:37 and I looked up. 19:39 What it was, was 19:40 he just provided no opportunities for me 19:42 to engage that type of behavior. 19:44 So would you say that the change then came, 19:46 it wasn't fear that brought about the change in your life, 19:49 it was actually love. 19:51 It was hope. Yeah, yeah and hope. 19:52 Because if those adult lesbians could change, 19:55 certainly my 13 year old self could change. 19:59 And so walking forward, what happened? 20:01 Did all the same sex attraction just totally disappear? 20:05 No, it didn't, no it didn't. 20:07 I was fine for about the first year 20:09 after that happened. 20:11 And then I had two friends enrolled in academy 20:14 that were also struggling with same sex attraction. 20:17 And though I presented the truth of what I had learned 20:20 in Pastor Clark's class. 20:22 They weren't going for it. 20:23 I hadn't been introduced to a gay culture 20:26 as we know it today at that point in time. 20:29 All I knew was what I was experimenting 20:31 with behind closed doors 20:33 and what I saw in those VHS tapes. 20:36 But the devil doesn't want to just leave the story as it is. 20:40 And so those friends took me to Greenwich Village 20:44 which back then in the 90s was the safe haven for the gay, 20:49 the lesbian, the transsexual, the bisexual. 20:52 We didn't have LGBTQ high schools. 20:54 But we did have the Hatchet Martin Institute. 20:57 And so they introduced me to those places 20:58 and it would be the first time 21:00 that I would actually see gay culture in practice. 21:03 But I don't know how God did it, 21:04 but he did keep me in the midst of it. 21:06 I just... 21:08 I believed what I heard and I just determined 21:10 that I would continue to walk with Jesus. 21:13 And 23 years later, here I sit talking with you. 21:16 Wow. 21:18 Thandi, you know, when we surrender 21:23 and when we give our life over to Jesus Christ there, 21:27 I know that there are many, from the gay perspective, 21:30 that think that in the call back to church 21:32 and looking at 21:33 what the Word of God has to say about 21:36 not following through with the carnal flesh desires. 21:40 The fear is that they're going to be left alone 21:42 for the rest of their lives 21:44 and that and it's going to be a lonely life. 21:46 Is that what you've experienced in these years 21:48 that you've walked with God? 21:50 You know, there was a time after I walked away from this 21:53 that I really want to 21:55 and I still want to be married to this day. 21:58 But what I have found is in walking with God, 22:02 He fills that void. 22:03 He fills it so much with His love, 22:07 and you are so busy working for Him, 22:11 and trying to serve Him every day, 22:13 that I don't even feel 22:15 that I'm not even thinking about it. 22:17 I'm just excited about loving Him 22:19 and being able to serve Him in whatever it is I'm doing. 22:22 What are you doing today, Thandi? 22:24 Well, I'm in school. I work at a clothing store. 22:27 What kind of school? 22:29 I'm in school for ministry at Andrews. 22:31 You sure are. 22:33 And so God really has touched your heart. 22:36 Yeah. 22:37 And through the course of study at Andrews 22:42 as you're walking with God, 22:43 I would imagine that it gives you a certain hope. 22:46 And what's on your heart about 22:49 what you want to do with ministry? 22:52 I really want to help people 22:54 and I want to help people that are like me. 22:57 I'm coming from a navy background. 23:00 When I graduated high school, 23:01 I joined the navy at the age of 18. 23:04 And I met a lot of people like me. 23:07 And at first, I didn't know 23:09 what to do with the solicitation 23:11 when people would come on to me. 23:13 But as I began to walk with God, 23:15 He began to give me answers, 23:16 and if not direct answers certainly strength. 23:20 And I remember a lesbian couple reached out to me. 23:23 And said, well, how do you know 23:25 that this is God's plan for you? 23:27 How do you know 23:28 that you're going in the right direction 23:30 and doing what He wants you to do? 23:33 And I said, "He just opened certain doors 23:35 and He closed a certain doors." 23:37 But I can tell you this, 23:39 He's taking care of me every step of the way. 23:41 And so no, I don't regret 23:43 walking away from the community. 23:45 I don't regret my choices. 23:46 So I would like to help people like them. 23:49 What do you say to our past 23:53 and that we grew up with the ignorance, 23:57 and condemnation, 23:59 in fact, even just not talking about 24:01 homosexuality in the church. 24:03 In fact, now by not talking about it 24:06 in the silence the pendulum has 24:08 now swung to the other extreme 24:10 and that we can continue to remain silent. 24:13 But we'll just show basically endorsement 24:15 that it doesn't really matter, 24:17 what kind of relationship you have, 24:19 it's love and it's not anybody's business to say, 24:23 "You know, what kind of love that is?" 24:25 How do you go about helping people 24:28 that have lived in this ignorance? 24:31 I love Pastor Clark's approach with me. 24:34 He really pointed out the love of Jesus 24:37 and it wasn't a love that was accepting of everything. 24:40 It wasn't cheap grace, because if it's cheap grace, 24:44 then there's no value to it. 24:46 Right. 24:47 But when you know, you have a loving Savior 24:49 that laid down His life 24:50 and that would do anything to save you. 24:53 Then you want to do everything that you can to serve Him. 24:56 And if you know that there's amnesty for your sins 24:59 and that you're not going to be judged 25:01 then what's the hurt in asking Him to help you? 25:05 Yeah. 25:06 And we've been lacking 25:08 to some degree the female perspective. 25:11 I know that in our ministry for, you know, 25:15 for basically like three and a half years, 25:18 we had just the guys, you know, talking about it 25:21 and now we've been blessed 25:23 with the addition of a female member 25:26 of Coming Out Ministries. 25:28 And I think that you can speak to relationships 25:33 that women deal with men 25:35 and homosexuality often comes from the standpoint 25:39 of a strong carnal desire, 25:41 whereas the fleshly response for women often doesn't occur 25:46 until after an emotional connection. 25:49 So would you say, well, or let me have you say, 25:52 what kind of relationship do you try to encourage someone 25:56 who has experienced same sex attraction to have 26:00 with Jesus Christ today? 26:03 You know, it certainly helps to have an accountability partner 26:06 that you're able to pray with, 26:08 that you're able to be open and vulnerable with, 26:10 it's definitely not everybody 26:13 but God will point you in a direction 26:15 if you ask Him for somebody to be able to talk with. 26:19 I know it's helped me. 26:24 What do you do with same sex relations today? 26:29 How do you see yourself with women in the church? 26:35 I can acknowledge their beauty 26:36 and I don't have to be involved. 26:39 And having come on this journey 23 years later, 26:43 I can look at a sister and say, "She's gorgeous." 26:46 And God has given me the strength to leave it 26:48 just as that. 26:49 Right. 26:51 God calls us to holiness, so I believe that 26:53 we can walk with one another in the church. 26:55 We don't always know the journey 26:57 that each person is on today. 27:00 And I think that your testimony is powerful 27:02 and being able to help other people 27:05 who are dealing not only with same sex attraction, 27:08 but other people in the church who have lived in ignorance in 27:13 how we can reach out with the love of Jesus Christ, 27:15 wouldn't you say? 27:17 I pray so. 27:18 Thandi, thanks for sharing your story 27:20 and your transparency today. 27:22 I really appreciate it. 27:23 Today we're new creatures in Jesus Christ. 27:26 And I just want to thank you for watching Pure Choices. |
Revised 2017-07-31