Perfecting Me

Character Perfect In Gods Eyes

Three Angels Broadcasting Network

Program transcript

Participants: Wintley Phipps (Host), Adly Campos, Dr E T. Stoddart, Ruthie Jacobson

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Series Code: PFM

Program Code: PFM000003A


00:27 Hi, I'm Wintley Phipps,
00:29 and welcome to our program
00:30 Perfecting Me, Becoming More Like Jesus.
00:34 I'm so glad you joined us.
00:36 My guests today on our program are Ruthie Jacobsen,
00:39 Head of Prayer Ministry of the North American division
00:41 of Seventh-day Adventist, Pastor Errol Stoddart,
00:45 Senior Pastor of The Church
00:46 of the Oranges of Seventh-day Adventist
00:48 in Orange, New Jersey,
00:49 and Mrs. Adly Campos, Speaker and President
00:52 of Family Well-Being International.
00:55 You'll hear from them a little later.
00:58 When we surrender to God,
01:01 our characters are like clay in the potter's hands.
01:05 And like clay in His hands, everyday He moulds,
01:09 and shapes us, and fashions us according to His will.
01:14 And just like a potter takes clay and kneads it,
01:16 and works it, he tears it apart,
01:19 and then presses it together,
01:21 sometimes God will wet us, and then dry us,
01:26 and then sometimes leave us there for a little while
01:29 without even touching us.
01:31 And just when He knows we're ready,
01:33 He forms us into a shape and makes of us
01:38 what the scripture calls a vessel of honor.
01:42 When God made us,
01:43 He made us in His image to resemble, reflect,
01:46 and reveal the perfection of His character.
01:51 And what the master potter is shaping in us is our character.
01:57 In Matthew 5:84, it says,
01:59 "Be ye therefore perfect even as your Father
02:02 which in heaven is perfect."
02:05 Now God would never tell us
02:07 to try to be perfect without making provision
02:10 for our perfection.
02:12 And He makes it clear
02:14 that our perfection can only be found in our union
02:17 and relationship with Christ.
02:20 In John 17:23, it says,
02:22 "I in them, and Thou in me
02:24 that they may be made perfect in one
02:30 and that the world may know that Thou has sent me
02:33 and has loved them as Thou has loved me."
02:36 Just as Jesus, the Son of God,
02:38 in human form was perfect in His life,
02:41 so He requires that His followers
02:43 shall be perfect in their lives.
02:46 When you look carefully at the command of Jesus
02:48 and the context in which He spoke these words,
02:51 you will see that He was calling us
02:53 to a life of perfection.
02:55 Now stay with us.
03:01 When Jesus spoke,
03:03 He gave us examples of the kind of perfection
03:06 He was talking about.
03:08 Let's look at it.
03:10 Matthew 5:38, "You have heard that it hath been said,
03:13 'An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth.'
03:17 But I say unto you that you resist not evil
03:21 but whosoever shall smite thee on their right cheek,
03:24 turn to him the other also."
03:26 Many read that and say,
03:28 "I don't need that kind of perfection in my life."
03:32 Or he said, "If anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt,
03:35 handover your coat as well.
03:38 If anyone forces you to go one mile,
03:40 go with them two miles."
03:42 Notice, not if someone requests you to go,
03:45 but if someone forces you to go one mile,
03:49 go with them two.
03:50 And then in Matthew 5:42,
03:52 "Give to the one who ask you
03:55 and do not turn away from the one
03:57 who wants to borrow from you.
03:59 You've heard that it has been said,
04:01 thou shall love thy neighbor and hate thine enemy,
04:04 but I say unto you," said Jesus,
04:06 "love your enemies, bless them that curse you,
04:11 do good to them that hates you and pray for them
04:14 which despitefully use you and persecute you."
04:17 Pray for those who persecute you?
04:21 "Yes," said Jesus, Matthew 5:45,
04:23 "that ye may be the children of your Father
04:27 which is in heaven."
04:29 So it is in this context that Jesus holds before us
04:33 this lofty goal to which He wants us
04:35 to aspire and achieve.
04:38 He says, "Be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect."
04:43 Now why would Jesus tell us to be, what because of sin,
04:48 He knows we could never be.
04:51 I think it is because Jesus' view of perfection
04:56 is very different than our view of perfection.
05:00 Most people when they speak of perfection,
05:02 they think of what I might call total perfection,
05:05 they think of flawless,
05:07 faultless, never have, never will make a mistake,
05:11 because we've all made mistakes.
05:14 We are no longer candidates for that kind of perfection.
05:19 None of us can stake any claims to that kind of perfection
05:24 because we've all made mistakes.
05:28 Today, many would rather settle for
05:31 and even flump their flaws
05:33 and defects rather than speak of striving
05:38 and trying to be perfect.
05:40 Some even believe that
05:42 we should not even try to be perfect
05:44 because it is futile.
05:46 "Why should we even try to be something we know
05:49 we can never be?
05:51 We might as well purge that word
05:53 and remove it from our lexicon of spiritual words
05:56 and religious ideas."
05:59 This word perfect represents a state or condition,
06:03 they think, reserved only for God the father,
06:06 God the Holy Spirit, and Jesus Christ the Son.
06:10 Many say, "So don't trouble me or worry me or torment me
06:16 with that command and requirement
06:19 of the word perfect."
06:21 They say, as a matter of fact,
06:23 when the role is called up for perfect people,
06:26 I know that anyone who dares stand in that line
06:29 is a fraud and a flaming hypocrite.
06:32 Anyone who dare say
06:33 they are perfect and error free,
06:35 they are either deluded or they are con artist.
06:39 Jesus is the only one
06:40 who has ever lived a perfect life on this earth,
06:43 and that is true.
06:45 A longtime ago, we were once perfect,
06:48 but look at the world today, we are not that anymore.
06:51 Some have said,
06:53 "This view that the world before television was perfect."
06:57 Oh, no.
06:58 The way they talk, you would think that
06:59 we had societal perfection back in the '40s and the '50s.
07:04 And in some ways things may have been better
07:06 but they were definitely not perfect.
07:09 Let me disabuse you of any such notion.
07:13 The only time we as human beings new perfection
07:17 was for a short time
07:18 before the fall of Adam and Eve in Eden.
07:21 Only before the fall of Adam and Eve were men prefect.
07:27 But God is calling us to a life of perfection,
07:33 and we can be perfect if we follow
07:37 in the footsteps of Jesus Christ.
07:41 Now I want you to know about a friend of mine
07:43 by the name of Dave Blexley.
07:46 Dave has been with us for the last few shows.
07:49 He has a ministry of delivering
07:53 and showing us how God can mould us,
07:58 and make us, and shape us,
08:02 and how God can take our character just like clay.
08:07 Yes, He is our potter.
08:08 God can take our character just like clay
08:12 and work with us and help shape us
08:16 until we are fit vessels for His use.
08:21 Come with me now.
08:23 Let's go to the potter's house.
08:29 Well, at this point, this pot could go, you know...
08:35 I think we're there.
08:36 I think this is pretty good.
08:38 I'm sort of a waste now,
08:42 and then God comes along and says,
08:43 "No, why you gotten into this."
08:45 And I was like, "I don't know, God.
08:48 This is nice, I like it this way."
08:51 And He says, "No, I have much bigger plans for you.
08:54 The calling that I have for you,
08:56 the vocation that I have for you is much larger."
08:59 That's the exciting thing about allowing ourselves
09:04 to be formed in the hands
09:07 of a creating God,
09:12 a God who has great desires for our lives.
09:18 And so I'm gonna began to stretch this pot out,
09:23 give it more form.
09:26 And as I'm doing this, this stretching,
09:30 many of us go through stretching experiences.
09:33 Whenever there is a major transition in our life,
09:36 now that's a stretching experience.
09:39 We don't really know what the outcome will be.
09:42 And if this pot could talk, it might be saying to me,
09:45 "You know, potter,
09:47 the walls of this pot are getting rather thin.
09:50 And I know that it could collapse.
09:53 If you keep stretching me like this,
09:56 I don't know if I can make it.
09:59 And are you sure you know what you're doing?"
10:03 I don't know about you but there had been times
10:05 when I've questioned that with God.
10:07 "God, do you know this about me?"
10:09 I don't know if you've ever wrestled with God
10:11 but I never win.
10:15 Even if I, in a sense,
10:17 win by not going His way, I lose.
10:21 But if I trust in Him, He really knows what's best.
10:26 And I have faith that He can do things
10:28 way beyond my self image.
10:35 I discover all new things
10:38 just like this vessel is gonna discover them.
10:42 It could be really robust, large,
10:48 and someday filled with flowers.
10:51 Someday, sitting in a prominent place in a house
10:56 where everyone can say, "Oh, how beautiful that pot is."
11:01 And there will be times in our lives
11:03 when it just seems like God is all over us.
11:08 He's just bringing about so many wonderful changes,
11:10 and it's very exciting.
11:13 Some of us would call that revival,
11:16 new life in a sense.
11:22 And I think of other people who watch us
11:25 when we're going through a growing time in our lives,
11:31 a high mountain experience in a sense with God
11:35 which doesn't happen every single day of our lives,
11:39 at least not for me.
11:41 But it does happen.
11:42 I think of others, for example, this pitcher over here,
11:46 I'm gonna call her...
11:49 I think I'll call her Suzy today.
11:51 And Suzy is a wonderful pitcher.
11:56 I formed her earlier today, and she's sitting over here,
12:00 and she can't help but looking at Joseph here.
12:03 Joseph's enormous vase is being formed.
12:06 And she's really quite excited
12:08 about the fact of what's happening to Jo.
12:11 I mean, Jo is just a hunk of mud a short time ago.
12:14 And now, look at him.
12:16 He's developing shoulders, he's robust, and tall,
12:20 and really becoming quite magnificent.
12:22 And there's part of her is going,
12:24 "Oh, I remember what it was like
12:26 when the potter hands were all over me
12:28 and shaping me and forming me and it was so exciting.
12:32 And now I've come off to the side.
12:37 And I hate to say it, but I always wonder,
12:41 has the potter forgotten me?
12:44 Because I'm feeling a bit dry at the top."
12:48 And some of us will go through times like that
12:51 where we're watching other people just developing,
12:54 becoming more and more like Jesus in their lives,
12:57 becoming beautiful that way,
12:59 becoming matured, it's exciting to watch them.
13:03 And yet with ourselves, it seems quite still.
13:05 Quite quiet, like not much is happening.
13:09 And has God loved us?
13:11 Did we do something wrong? No, not at all.
13:15 You see the reality is that,
13:16 in order for this pitcher to be complete,
13:18 it needs a handle coming off of the back.
13:21 And if I try to put a handle on it earlier, even right now,
13:25 it's still quite soft.
13:27 And I would totally deform the shape.
13:30 So I am going to wait
13:32 until this pitcher is mature enough
13:34 that stiffen off up here
13:37 that I can attach the handle without deforming it.
13:40 But my eye is very attentive to this pitcher.
13:43 I've not forgotten it.
13:45 Nor has God forgotten you.
13:47 There may be something that He's waiting on,
13:49 maybe something in someone else's live,
13:51 or some other situation that He's waiting on,
13:53 or it may even be you that He's watching,
13:56 and waiting until something has become true in your life,
14:01 and then He's ready.
14:08 Joining us again are my guests Ruthie, Adly, and Errol.
14:13 Ruthie, let me start with you.
14:17 The Bible says that God made us
14:19 in His image and in His likeness.
14:23 Does that mean He made us perfect?
14:27 I think He did at creation,
14:29 because if we were made in His image,
14:32 and He said it was very good,
14:35 He must have been very happy with the creation of mankind.
14:39 Why will He make anything that wasn't perfect?
14:44 That's right.
14:45 I mean, you know, why would a perfect God
14:47 make anything that wasn't perfect?
14:49 So yes, He made us perfect.
14:52 And why do you think? And He's happy with it.
14:55 You said, He was happy with it. Absolutely.
14:57 He said it was very good.
15:00 Sister Campos, why do you think He made us perfect?
15:04 Why do you think He made us to reflect His image?
15:11 What was He doing? What was He trying to do?
15:12 Because we were made unto His own image,
15:14 so the fact that we were made unto His own image
15:19 made us perfect as He was.
15:22 Right. Well, why do you think He did that?
15:24 What was He trying to say something
15:27 to the rest of the universe, you think?
15:30 Why do you think He said,
15:32 "I'm gonna make man in My image"?
15:36 Why would He do that?
15:37 Is that for His own glory, for His own love,
15:39 because of His love?
15:41 Pastor Stoddart, what do you think?
15:43 Why do you think He made us perfect?
15:46 I do believe it because God is love,
15:49 and His love was demonstrated in His creation of humanity,
15:55 and His creation of humanity was free will.
15:59 I think that was the part of the perfection
16:01 that God created us with, is the power to choose
16:06 so that we weren't forced to do something.
16:09 He gave man the power to choose good or evil.
16:13 And I think that's a big part
16:14 of what the whole discussion of perfection is all about.
16:17 This business of free will,
16:18 man being able to make his own choices.
16:19 Right.
16:21 And, Sister Campos, He made us free,
16:24 gave us free will.
16:26 And He also, it appears,
16:30 made sure that our perfection was provisional,
16:35 meaning that if we would have to pass some tests
16:38 to before that that perfection was permanent.
16:42 Tell us what you know about that?
16:44 Yes.
16:46 As long as they remained obedient to Him,
16:51 they were going to have total absolute perfection,
16:55 exactly like God.
16:56 The moment they cross the line, disobeyed God,
17:01 then it was limited to us, limited to us.
17:06 And, Ruthie, that provisional perfection was lost.
17:12 Tell me what you know about how it was lost?
17:17 Well, it was lost because God trusted the human race,
17:23 and He didn't want robots.
17:26 He said, "I love you, I trust you.
17:29 I'm going to allow you to cooperate or not."
17:33 And because of the forces of the evil,
17:37 here in the Garden of Eden, they were deceived
17:40 and they chose to walk away from God.
17:44 And of course, we have suffered as a result of that ever since.
17:48 But God could have prevented that,
17:51 He could have prevented our sinning,
17:55 but I'm so glad He didn't.
17:58 He gave us the power of choice because of His love.
18:01 Yes.
18:02 You know, it all began...
18:03 Go ahead, Pastor.
18:05 Yeah, I was going to say, the association,
18:08 the word association of obedience and perfection,
18:12 I think that is a great word, association,
18:15 because perfection does not happen
18:18 outside of obedience.
18:20 And I'm sure we're gonna come back to that time
18:23 and back in,
18:24 it's another word that a lot of people
18:26 feel very uncomfortable, obedience.
18:28 Just like perfection, yeah.
18:29 And yet obedience is so crucial
18:32 to the whole business of serving God,
18:34 to the whole business of growing into perfection.
18:38 You can't be perfect unless you are lined up to obey
18:42 what instruction God has given to us.
18:45 I have always marveled
18:46 and studied to try to understand
18:50 how that perfection was lost
18:52 and it seems like it was lost beginning
18:56 in heaven with Lucifer
18:59 and it began with a distortion
19:03 and misrepresentation
19:04 of the true loving character of God.
19:08 When you think about it, He went to the angels.
19:11 A third of the angels said, you know, God,
19:14 He's not all that you think He is,
19:16 He is really not as nice as He says He is,
19:20 He is a tyrant, He is a dictator.
19:22 And the third of the angels bought that,
19:25 and as a result His perfection was lost.
19:30 Isn't that incredible?
19:32 And then he went to the Eve in the Garden of Eden
19:35 and he said, "You know,
19:36 you don't know God like I know Him.
19:40 He has an integrity problem.
19:42 He doesn't always tell the truth," you know.
19:45 And with that distortion and misrepresentation
19:48 of the character of God, perfection was lost.
19:52 So react to that.
19:54 Tell me what you think of
19:57 when you think about that perfection being lost
20:00 because of the enemy sowing discord
20:04 and sowing distress in the hearts of man
20:09 and human beings.
20:13 Ruthie, what do you think about that?
20:15 Well, I think...
20:16 And I'm glad that you backed up
20:18 and put this in the context of heaven.
20:21 I think that if Satan,
20:24 if Lucifer had kept his eyes
20:26 in the right place at that time,
20:29 this whole thing could have been avoided
20:31 if he could have kept his eyes on the Father,
20:35 and worshipped Him, and sought to bring Him glory,
20:40 but he chose to look at himself and to be prideful.
20:44 And I think we have the same responsibility,
20:48 the same opportunity today.
20:50 We can look up or we can look around us,
20:54 and this is why we're told,
20:55 "Don't look at your circumstances.
20:57 Don't look at the things that are going on around you,
21:00 but keep your eyes focused."
21:03 What a privilege. Absolutely.
21:04 Pastor Stoddart, what do you think about that tactic
21:07 that the devil has so effectively used
21:11 to bring destruction, and to sow discord,
21:15 and to cause us to lose our perfection?
21:18 What is so powerful about that tactic of distorting
21:22 and misrepresenting the character of God
21:25 that is so effective?
21:27 Well, we know that all distortions began right there
21:32 with the devil misrepresenting
21:33 and distorting the character of God,
21:34 and who God is, and who God was,
21:38 but his tactic worked as you can see.
21:42 The Bible makes it very clear
21:44 that one third of the angels were...
21:46 And you imagine, the one third of the angels,
21:50 they were perfect themselves.
21:52 And imagine, one third of the perfect angels in heaven
21:56 who had never known sin,
21:57 who had never known unrighteousness,
22:00 who had never known deceit,
22:03 Lucifer was so effective
22:05 that he was able to trick them to following his sophistries,
22:09 and let them astray and away from God.
22:11 Yeah.
22:12 Sister Campos, I think it is his most effective weapon
22:16 throughout history, confusing people
22:21 about the true loving character of God.
22:25 And one of the reasons that his tactics,
22:27 Sister Campos, I want you to speak through this,
22:29 why this tactic is so effective
22:32 is because he's using a tactic
22:35 that God's character won't let him use,
22:39 if you understand what I mean.
22:41 God's character, His integrity won't let him distort,
22:47 you know, other people's characters.
22:49 So tell me what you think about that, Sister Campos?
22:52 We are by nature self-centered, very self-centered.
22:59 And he knows that when he draws
23:02 the attention away from God's character
23:06 by minimizing,
23:07 deceiving us in regards to his character.
23:10 He knows that we will immediately
23:13 start looking at ourselves,
23:15 that's exactly what humanism has done.
23:19 Never mind the God in heaven, you are a god,
23:23 do whatever you like to do.
23:26 If it feels good, do it, do it, do it.
23:30 So he has succeeded because of that.
23:34 Ruthie, how do you think that our perfection is reclaimed,
23:38 and how do you think the Word of God tells us
23:42 that we can be perfect again?
23:44 What has heaven done to make sure that that happens?
23:50 Amen.
23:51 What an invitation! What an invitation!
23:55 You know, the Lord doesn't throw anybody away.
23:59 Elder CD Brooks used to say,
24:01 "When people feel like they are at the very bottom,
24:05 they don't see hope anywhere."
24:08 Christ is there, saying, "I'll take you.
24:10 I'll take you," because of His shed blood.
24:14 There's power in the blood.
24:17 And by beholding, we become changed.
24:20 We don't have hope in ourselves,
24:23 but we have a God for whom nothing is impossible.
24:27 It's just mind blowing.
24:29 Yes, it is.
24:30 Pastor Stoddart, before we go, we just have a few moments.
24:33 I want you to speak to one important thing.
24:36 And that is, when God looks at all of us,
24:39 as Ruthie was saying, when God looks at all of us,
24:43 right, He sees not just the way we are,
24:47 but He sees us in perfection.
24:53 That's His vision, that's His dream for us.
24:58 Tell me about that before we go.
25:01 Well, I love the fact that, first of all,
25:04 He sees me through the lenses of Jesus.
25:08 When God sees us,
25:10 once we've accepted Jesus Christ as our savior,
25:12 when God looks at us,
25:14 He is looking at us through the lenses of His Son,
25:17 Jesus Christ, our advocate.
25:19 And I thank God everyday for that.
25:21 I praise God that in spite of my self,
25:22 in spite of my best self,
25:27 and I want to make that clear, my best self,
25:30 with my striving and sometimes my not measuring up
25:36 that Jesus Christ is my intermediary.
25:40 God sees me through the eyes of His Son, Jesus Christ.
25:44 And I praise God for that, because through that,
25:46 I am justified.
25:48 I love Elder EE Cleveland used to say,
25:50 "We are justified before we are qualified."
25:53 That's right, that's right. And it is so beautiful.
25:56 It is so beautiful that Jesus sees us as perfect
26:02 while we're growing,
26:04 because He covers us with His grace.
26:06 Thank you for being with us today.
26:12 When Adam was created by God in His thoughts and actions,
26:16 Adam and Eve were perfect in character, in temperament,
26:22 in attitude, and nature.
26:24 They were perfect.
26:25 It's hard to imaging it now,
26:27 but when we came from our creator's hand,
26:29 we were perfect.
26:31 Not only in stature and physique,
26:33 we were perfect in mind,
26:35 in character, and in personality.
26:38 When God created us, He created us to resemble,
26:41 reflect, and reveal His perfection.
26:45 We were made in the perfect image
26:48 of our perfect God in conscience,
26:50 moral makeup, man was perfect.
26:54 But his perfection was provisional and limited.
26:58 Perfection was dependent upon
27:00 obedience and faithfulness to God.
27:03 Adam's perfection was conditional on his loyalty
27:07 and devotion to God.
27:09 His perfection was qualified and temporary.
27:13 His perfection was tied to a time of test
27:16 and examination.
27:18 It was conditioned upon his faithfulness to God's commands.
27:23 As long as he remained obedient,
27:25 man would retain his perfection.
27:28 But Adam sinned, and for the last 6,000 years,
27:31 true perfection has not been seen by mankind.
27:35 Thank God, Jesus Christ came.
27:37 And by His sacrifice,
27:39 He restored to us perfection as a gift of grace.
27:45 All are lost through Adam.
27:48 Our only hope is a transformation of character
27:52 through repentance and faith in Jesus Christ
27:56 as our personal savior.
27:59 I'm Wintley Phipps.
28:00 And until next time, remember,
28:03 to be a Christian
28:06 means to be Christ like.
28:11 God bless you.


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Revised 2018-01-18