Participants: Ivor Meyers (Host), James Rafferty (Host), Jason Bradley, Yvonne Lewis
Series Code: SISS
Program Code: SISS000011A
00:31 Well, it's good to be back in the Book of Revelation,
00:34 we have moved through four of the seven churches,
00:37 we have moved from Ephesus to Smyrna to Pergamos to Thyatira
00:43 and now we're getting ready to jump into Sardis,
00:46 so we've made... we've made a lot of progress
00:49 in... in the Book of Revelation
00:51 in the last... oh... few sessions together
00:54 but we still want to make sure that we're not running too fast,
00:59 we want to make sure that we are allowing...
01:02 what did Joseph say... or Jacob say?
01:04 "The women and the children... " you know... "to keep up with us"
01:10 in other words, we consider ourselves...
01:12 Ivor and I were talking last night... we're just like,
01:14 "Oh, we could be in Revelation 21 by now...
01:16 wrrrrrrr... wrrr... wrrr... wrrr... wrrr... "
01:18 Jason: Hey, what are you trying to say?
01:19 Yvonne: I know... I know...
01:21 James: Because we just... we know all the stuff...
01:24 we've gone over all this stuff...
01:25 and that's why I'm just so thankful that you guys are here
01:27 because... we could just be talking
01:29 right over top of people's heads...
01:31 and just be gone... and you're helping us to
01:35 make it clear, to go slowly, to rehash, to recap
01:39 so that it's something that anyone watching
01:43 can get a hold of it and say,
01:44 "Wow, yeah I see that... okay... that makes sense...
01:46 and so you're helping... "
01:48 Jason: Way to clean it up...
01:49 laughter... James: Good take huh...
01:51 Yvonne: And dummy it down... James: You're helping...
01:54 Ivor: We should add in that part of the reason
01:57 why we're going through the seven churches
01:59 so slowly is because if you understand the seven churches
02:05 you have everything you need
02:07 to understand the rest of the Book of Revelation
02:11 and so the seven churches are the foundation, right?
02:15 Everything after that is just laid over the foundation
02:18 so if you can get the seven churches
02:20 and understand the history of the seven churches,
02:23 everything else after that is just more detail...
02:26 James: It's all in your pocket, it's all in your pocket.
02:29 Ivor: Yeah, it's nothing new... just more detail...
02:30 Yvonne: So it's repeat and enlarge...
02:32 Ivor: It's "Repeat and enlarge"
02:33 absolutely... absolutely...
02:35 James: Ivor, pray for us and we'll get started.
02:37 Ivor: Let's pray... "Heavenly Father,
02:38 we want to ask that as we open your Word again
02:41 that you would continue to give us understanding,
02:43 continue to open our eyes
02:46 and Father, may we see Christ and Him lifted up...
02:49 in all these Scriptures, may we become like you
02:53 because ultimately you've given us this book
02:56 that we may receive the revelation of Jesus Christ
02:58 in ourselves that we might become like Christ
03:01 and so, bless us as we open your Word
03:04 is our prayer in Jesus' name amen. "
03:06 All: "Amen... "
03:08 James: All right... pop quiz...
03:09 Yvonne: Oh no...
03:10 James: Let's go back to the first church
03:13 and just tell us what you've learned so far
03:16 and Ivor and I can fill in more details if we want to
03:18 but just tell us... let's progress from there to fore
03:21 and you recap for all of us what we've learned.
03:24 Jason: Okay, so, starting with Ephesus...
03:27 they lost their first love
03:29 so, I remember that part... they lost their first love...
03:33 Smyrna... which means bitter sweet, is it myrrh?
03:39 James: Hmmm... hmmm... Jason: bitter sweet... myrrh...
03:41 Smyrna and Philadelphia...
03:43 they were the only two
03:46 that didn't have anything that was "negative"
03:48 said about them,
03:50 Pergamos... is that when the compromise started?
03:59 That's when the compromise began...
04:00 and then Thyatira... was when Jezebel... the false...
04:08 the "prophetess" came about and was teaching false doctrines
04:13 and also we learned that persecution purifies the church
04:18 and Smyrna was under heavy persecution.
04:22 James: Hmmm... hmmm... all right Yvonne,
04:24 add to it... what else you've got?
04:26 Yvonne: Okay... well... with Ephesus...
04:29 Ephesus... I love the way Jesus dealt with Ephesus...
04:34 saying, "I know your works... I know this... I know that... "
04:38 he's saying, "I see what you've done
04:41 but I have somewhat...
04:46 not against you... " how did He put it?
04:48 James: No, He says, "against you"
04:49 Yvonne: oh! "somewhat against you... "
04:51 James: Yeah...
04:53 Yvonne: "you've lost your first love"
04:54 so He doesn't just say,
04:56 "Bam, you've lost your first love"
04:58 I love the way... again... this is a romantic book,
05:03 this is what appeals to me that Jesus is not...
05:07 is not just criticizing...
05:10 He is trying to bring them to another level,
05:12 and He's saying, "I see what you've done... "
05:15 James: accentuates the positive...
05:17 Yvonne: Yes... yes... and one of the things that...
05:21 that I've read is that... when you're dealing with people,
05:24 you give like a... what's called the "criticism sandwich" right?
05:28 So, you start with the good part...
05:30 then in the middle... you hit them with the issue...
05:33 and then at the end... you close on the positive
05:36 and what Jesus did was He gave them, like,
05:40 "I know... I see your works... but you've lost your first love"
05:44 so He's loving and kind... even though He's disciplining...
05:48 Ivor: And then He offers a reward at the end.
05:50 Yvonne: And then He offers... criticisms...
05:52 He gives them... the positive, right?
05:55 James: Some incentives... Yvonne: Then we move to Smyrna,
05:58 and Smyrna and Pergamos were the interim churches
06:02 and when we talk about the 70 weeks and the 1,260 years
06:05 and the 2,300 days and all that...
06:07 I'm still trying to get that... those principles
06:13 and you helped yesterday to eliminate that for me,
06:18 so, Smyrna... there was heavy persecution
06:22 and Myrrh... which...
06:24 that whole Smyrna has to do with Myrrh...
06:27 Myrrh... in Chinese medicine... was used for pain...
06:30 and Frankincense and Myrrh... they were used for pain...
06:34 and so, this was... there was pain...
06:36 during this time and persecution...
06:39 and so, I got that from that
06:43 and then Pergamos... was elevated...
06:46 the church was elevated in the world
06:50 and yet... there was... that was the church where
06:56 I don't think there was any... no there were some things...
06:59 they had the doctrine of Balaam or Balaam...
07:03 and so, and they had the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes
07:09 and then when I had done some research on the Nicolaitanes
07:12 that I found out about the whole lasciviousness
07:16 that they were trying to cover up
07:18 and say that God's grace covered all that...
07:20 they could do anything that they wanted to do
07:22 and then... there was Thyatira and that was the Dark Ages...
07:27 and that was where there was so much persecution
07:31 and death and killing and so, so it's really...
07:35 to me... this is really interesting because
07:39 you can actually find a personal application
07:42 with each church, that's what I think
07:48 I mean... and again, if you're dealing with pain...
07:53 like Smyrna... Jesus is the balm...
07:56 He is the balm of Gilead so we can...
07:59 we can tie Jesus in with every period
08:02 of... of... of... with every church...
08:05 we can tie Him in and tie us in.
08:09 Ivor: Well, it's like every issue that these churches
08:13 were going through... that were having issues...
08:15 we have faced on a personal level
08:17 one way or another...
08:18 and He offers a solution to those personal issues
08:22 so, idealism...
08:24 even though there are historical applications,
08:28 there is a historical application...
08:30 we don't just leave it at history...
08:32 we are to learn from these very experiences
08:36 and realize, "Well, I'm going through that,
08:40 if I've lost my first love, then...
08:42 yeah... I need to return and here's the remedy," so...
08:46 James: Jesus Christ is saying to me personally...
08:48 and we can find ourselves in the seven churches,
08:51 now, we still have three to go,
08:52 we can find ourselves in the seven churches
08:54 and we can find what God wants for us in the seven churches
08:57 and we're going to see that very clearly
09:00 when we get into Philadelphia because Philadelphia...
09:03 even though that's not the last church...
09:05 is the goal for our Christian experience,
09:07 it's the church of brotherly love,
09:08 so we started in the church of Ephesus,
09:11 just filling in a couple of gaps here on the timeline,
09:13 so the church of Ephesus is the Apostolic Age,
09:15 All: Hmmm... hmmm...
09:16 James: Apostolic age... we're going to find
09:18 as we nail this down... this "church age" down...
09:21 Apostolic age...
09:23 then pagan Roman persecution in the Smyrna age...
09:26 and then the development of the compromise
09:30 of Pergamos and Constantine,
09:32 and in Thyatira... full compromise
09:35 under the false prophetess, Jezebel...
09:37 which is a symbol or representation
09:39 of the mixing of the church and state,
09:41 and leading people in the wrong direction
09:44 we're going to find this history then...
09:46 of the seven churches...
09:47 it's going to be the same history
09:49 that we see in the seven seals
09:50 and the same history that we see in the seven trumpets
09:53 and the same history that is recapped for us
09:56 in Revelation 12 and 13
09:57 and then boom... off we go... into end-time prophecy
10:01 so all these layers build and bring us into end-time prophecy.
10:05 Yvonne: And when you say Apostolic Age...
10:07 some might not really realize that it has to do with "Apostle"
10:11 the time of the apostles, the early church...
10:15 James: Yeah, the first church...
10:18 so, once we have the seven churches understood,
10:21 all of the other epics... what I mean by that is...
10:24 the seals and the trumpets and the last portion...
10:27 they're all in our pocket... they're all in our pocket,
10:29 we get it... so that's why... when you get to...
10:32 we talked about this... when we get to Revelation 14,
10:34 you've got the everlasting gospel
10:35 the everlasting gospel is not a new idea
10:37 in the Book of Revelation,
10:38 the everlasting gospel is all through Revelation,
10:40 it's right here,
10:41 we've been talking about the everlasting gospel,
10:43 the everlasting gospel is introducing Jesus
10:45 in Revelation 1:1, it's when Jesus says,
10:48 "I've loved you
10:50 and I've washed you from your sins in my own blood,"
10:51 it's when Jesus says,
10:53 "Even though you've got major issues, I'm with you,
10:55 I'm standing among the candlesticks all seven of them,
10:58 that's the everlasting gospel
11:00 so the Book of Revelation
11:01 is saturated with the everlasting gospel,
11:03 and we're going to see it more
11:05 and more and more... not less and less,
11:07 so when we get to Revelation 14, it's like,
11:09 "Here's the summary
11:11 of everything we've been talking about
11:12 it's the everlasting gospel,
11:14 it's going to go to all the world,"
11:16 what a beautiful picture.
11:17 Yvonne: Amen, it's beautiful.
11:18 James: All right, are we ready to move to the next church?
11:20 Yvonne: Yeah... yeah...
11:21 James: Okay... Sardis...
11:22 Jason, take us away with chapter 3
11:24 beginning with verse one,
11:25 and we're going to read all the way through to verse six,
11:27 one through six... chapter 3.
11:29 Jason: All right...
11:30 "And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write:
11:34 These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God,
11:37 and the seven stars: I know thy works,
11:42 that thou hast a name that thou livest, and art dead.
11:45 Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain,
11:49 that are ready to die:
11:50 for I have not found thy works perfect before God.
11:54 Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard,
11:58 and hold fast, and repent.
12:00 If therefore thou shalt not watch,
12:04 I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know
12:07 what hour I will come upon thee...
12:10 Thou hast a few names even in Sardis
12:12 which have not defiled their garments;
12:14 and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy.
12:18 He that overcometh,
12:20 the same shall be clothed in white raiment;
12:22 and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life,
12:27 but I will confess his name before my Father,
12:29 and before his angels.
12:31 He that hath an ear, let him hear
12:33 what the Spirit saith unto the churches. "
12:37 James: Amen... so what we're doing now,
12:40 if we're following the sequence, the historical sequence,
12:43 is we're moving now into the time of reformation.
12:46 Now we... we closed out our last church in our last session
12:50 we closed out that last church pretty quickly
12:53 but if we go back now to these last verses
12:57 in Revelation chapter 2, it says, verse 25,
13:00 well, I'll start with verse 24,
13:02 "But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira,
13:05 as many as have not this doctrine,
13:08 which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak:
13:10 I will put upon you none other burden.
13:12 But that which you have already hold fast till I come.
13:15 And he that overcometh, and keep my works unto the end,
13:18 to him I will give power over the Nations:
13:20 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron;
13:22 and the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers:
13:24 even as I received of my Father.
13:26 And I will give him the morning star.
13:28 He that hath an ear,
13:30 let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches. "
13:32 This is referring to reformers...
13:34 this is referring to honest people
13:36 that were within the medieval church.
13:38 During the time of apostasy, there were men,
13:41 there were women who stood for the truth,
13:43 Wycliffe is understood to be the Morning Star of the Reformation
13:47 and there were many others,
13:49 we have Calvin and Luther and Huss and Jerome,
13:52 we have many of these reformers...
13:54 all of them were in the church, the church...
13:58 the Christian church then was one big colossal system,
14:01 where there was no other church,
14:04 it was just one church and they were part of this
14:06 and when they saw the truths of the Bible...
14:11 they were raised in a system where they were taught...
14:13 and I understand this because I was raised in the same system
14:15 where you understand... you're taught certain things
14:18 and you're not really aware of what the Bible teaches
14:21 and when I was 21,
14:23 I got my hands on the Bible for the first time
14:25 and began to read the Bible,
14:26 and I began to see a major difference between
14:28 the religion I was raised...
14:29 the Christian religion I was raised in
14:31 and the things I was taught to do
14:32 and what the Bible actually taught,
14:34 what the Book actually said
14:36 and so many of these people in this system
14:39 came in contact with the Bible...
14:41 Martin Luther found one chained to the pulpit,
14:43 the Bible wasn't available as much back then,
14:46 but he... and as he started reading it,
14:47 it was amazing
14:48 and he just couldn't wait to share with the church
14:50 because he knew all the Leaders...
14:51 they'd say, "Oh, yeah, that's what we need to do... "
14:53 but they didn't... and so the Reformation begins
14:56 and that what it's leading now into the church in Sardis.
14:59 Just a quick overview of the church in Sardis,
15:02 what we have is... we have Reformers
15:05 that are coming out into this light
15:08 and they're learning... they're growing...
15:09 but they're stopping... they're stopping...
15:11 their works aren't made perfect before God
15:13 they're not going further...
15:14 and if they don't go further and strengthen that which remains
15:18 and which is ready to die, it says here,
15:21 "You're not going to know what hour I'm going to come upon you"
15:23 now, God is not being arbitrary here,
15:26 basically, the Reformation has never stopped,
15:30 it's never stopped,
15:32 the Reformation from darkness had to continue on
15:34 and God could only give...
15:36 Jesus says to His disciples at one point, he said,
15:38 "I've got so many things I want to tell you
15:39 but you can't bear them all right now"
15:41 and I remember that with me... when I was coming out...
15:43 I was learning so fast
15:45 but there were things that I didn't understand
15:47 and then God says, "I can't... whoa... hold on... "
15:50 because sometimes, we want to dump...
15:51 we just want to back up to someone
15:53 and just dump the whole truck load on them,
15:55 everything... can't bear it... it's too much,
15:57 and this is what happens with the Reformation
15:59 so God is saying basically, "Keep moving forward... "
16:02 and, but they stop, many of them stopped, Luther never wanted...
16:05 Ivor: They started splintering.
16:06 James: Yes, into their little groups,
16:08 Luther... he didn't want a Lutheran Church,
16:10 he wanted them to keep going...
16:12 but they're stopping and what happens then?
16:14 If you stop... see what's... what God is leading them to
16:17 is, He's leading them to the end of the 2,300-Day Prophecy,
16:20 He's leading them to 1844,
16:22 He's leading them to the judgment,
16:23 He's leading them to a message of judgment,
16:24 that's where we're going,
16:26 "Well, I'm going to come on you on a day you're not aware"
16:28 if you... if you stop... if you are satisfied...
16:31 if your works aren't perfect and you are satisfied,
16:33 when that judgment message comes,
16:35 you're not going to be aware of it,
16:36 you're going to turn against it
16:37 and that's what a lot of these churches did,
16:39 God's people had to come out of them eventually
16:41 because... when the judgment came...
16:43 and then He says, He promises...
16:45 He says now, "If you overcome...
16:46 you're going to be clothed with white robes... "
16:48 that's judgment talk...
16:50 and your name is not going to be blotted out the Book...
16:52 that's judgment talk.
16:54 Ivor: So, what you can see here is...
16:55 remember where we are in this period,
16:57 remember, time and location, right?
16:59 time... 1,260... location... Holy Place...
17:04 you're seeing language now being introduced,
17:08 that's pointing us forward
17:10 to the next of the three time prophecies
17:13 the 2,300 days...
17:15 you see, so now we know that the 2,300 days are coming up,
17:19 after the fifth church,
17:20 we should be looking for events to occur,
17:23 that will involve 1844, right, and the Most Holy Place
17:29 because we're being introduced to language...
17:32 now I'm looking forward to that and saying,
17:35 "All right... since we're in the 1,260,
17:38 I know that indicators must be coming up
17:41 that are going to point me to the 2,300."
17:42 Yvonne: Hmmm...
17:44 Ivor: So that's why we say that these three time markers
17:47 are crucial to understanding, they're the... you know...
17:50 when you washed clothes back in the old days,
17:52 you would hang them on the clothesline,
17:55 the time prophecies are the clothesline,
17:58 and everything in the Book of Revelation
18:01 hangs within the context of one of those three time prophecies.
18:06 Yvonne: Hmmm... hmmm... it's good...
18:09 James: So the language we have here about "coming as a thief"
18:12 about the white robe,
18:15 about not being blotted out of the book...
18:17 are all pointing forward to... to judgment,
18:20 strengthening those things which remain which are ready to die,
18:23 Yvonne: Yeah, look at verse one,
18:26 "These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God... "
18:32 what are the "seven Spirits of God?"
18:35 Why is it seven Spirits as opposed to the...
18:39 just saying "the Holy Spirit of God?"
18:41 What are the seven Spirits?
18:43 Well, one of the things that we can look at here
18:46 is Isaiah chapter 11...
18:47 Yvonne: Okay...
18:49 James: Isaiah chapter 11 points this out also...
18:50 it's a prophecy... the whole chapter can be divided in half,
18:55 the first half is a prophecy of Christ... Isaiah chapter 11...
19:00 and the second half is a prophecy that would apply to us
19:06 in the end of time to... what we call "the loud cry"
19:09 and the outpouring of the Holy Spirit in the end of time
19:12 and the reason why we can turn to Isaiah 11 is because
19:15 this chapter is going to help us
19:17 as we move into the next section of Revelation seals
19:20 because there's a reference to this again in the seals,
19:23 in Isaiah chapter 11 verse 1,
19:27 "And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse,
19:30 and a Branch... "
19:32 now does your Bible have a capital "B" for the Branch?
19:35 Yvonne: Yes... James: Okay, because that's
19:36 referring to Jesus... " a Branch shall grow out of his roots,"
19:40 now, Jesse was the father of...?
19:43 Yvonne: David...
19:45 okay... so the "Branch" that comes out of this root of Jesse,
19:52 the root of Jesse... is referring to David...
19:55 it's coming out... but really it's referring to Christ
19:58 because Christ is the root of David...
20:01 the bright and Morning Star, okay, so...
20:05 the "Branch" that's coming out here is referring to Christ
20:08 and that goes on in verse 2
20:10 to describe what would be Christ's experience,
20:13 it says, "The spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him... "
20:16 okay, that's number one, "the spirit of God,"
20:18 "the spirit of wisdom" two...
20:21 "spirit of understanding" three...
20:22 "of counsel" four... "of might" five...
20:24 "the spirit of knowledge" six...
20:25 and "of the fear of the Lord" seven...
20:27 what it's talking about here is that the seven-fold spirit
20:33 is simply the complete spirit of God,
20:36 the complete spirit of God,
20:37 now Isaiah picks it up and breaks it down...
20:40 the spirit of knowledge, the spirit of understanding,
20:43 the spirit of counsel, the spirit of might,
20:46 he breaks it down and he says...
20:47 "But really, it's just the full-fold Spirit of God
20:52 is going to rest upon Jesus... "
20:53 He was filled with the Holy Spirit, okay, so,
20:57 He is the one that's being referred to
20:59 in Sardis, it says here...
21:01 "And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write;
21:03 these things saith he that has the seven Spirits of God... "
21:06 well, who is that? That's Jesus...
21:07 Yvonne: Hmmm... James: that's the Branch...
21:09 He's got the seven Spirits of God,
21:11 He's got the completeness... He's filled with the complete
21:14 fullness of God's Spirit.
21:16 Yvonne: "In Him was the fullness of the Godhead... "
21:20 James: Yes... yes...
21:21 now you know, we have the Spirit of God,
21:23 Peter had the Spirit of God
21:25 when Peter said to Jesus when he asked,
21:29 "Who do men say that I am?"
21:31 Peter said, "They say... "
21:32 Jesus said, "Well, who do you say I am?"
21:35 Peter said, "You're the Messiah"
21:36 and Jesus said, "Oh, flesh and blood hasn't taught that to you
21:39 but the Holy Spirit has been teaching that to you"
21:41 and then a few verses later Jesus says,
21:43 "I have to go to the cross and Gethsemane... "
21:47 and Peter says, "No, far be it from you Lord"
21:49 and Jesus said, "Get behind me, Satan... "
21:51 so we have the Spirit of God, the Spirit of God teaches us...
21:55 we have the Spirit of God that teaches us knowledge...
21:57 but we also have some issues...
21:59 we have some issues... but Jesus doesn't have any issues...
22:02 see, He's got the... in fact... in the context of this verse...
22:06 it says, verse 3,
22:08 "And shall make him of quick understanding
22:10 in the fear of the Lord: and he shall not judge
22:12 after the sight of his eyes,
22:13 neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:
22:15 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor... "
22:17 so, when the woman is caught in adultery... in the very act,
22:20 and she's brought before Jesus
22:22 and the Pharisees quote the Bible and say...
22:24 "Moses said she should be stoned... what do you say?"
22:27 And He has the Spirit of God... see... and so He says,
22:30 "Let me just pause here,
22:32 I just want to write something out in the sand... "
22:33 He starts writing down in the sand...
22:35 because He knows the whole situation...
22:37 He's filled with the Spirit...
22:38 and it's the same with us,
22:40 God wants to fill us with the Spirit
22:41 so we can take in the whole situation
22:43 and not just a little bit of what we see with our eyes...
22:46 or a little bit of what we hear with our ears,
22:48 so we can judge righteously... that's what...
22:50 so when we look at Sardis now, the person that's...
22:53 that's looking... he's looking at the Reformers,
22:56 this is a great... you know...
22:58 how can we find fault with the Reformers?
23:00 But Jesus has the full Spirit of God,
23:02 so He can say, "You're doing good...
23:04 you've got some areas... we...
23:06 but I haven't found your works perfect,
23:07 there are some areas where you're slipping... "
23:09 the same thing he said to Peter
23:10 now He's saying it right here
23:11 so the reference to the Spirit of God
23:13 is helping us to understand that Jesus sees everything,
23:15 He's got full wisdom, full knowledge, full might...
23:17 He's able to discern the whole picture,
23:19 we look up at their performance and say,
23:20 "Oh, they were great people... "
23:22 well yeah, but they had some problems
23:23 and Jesus is point out those problems.
23:25 I'm going to try to share something here that
23:31 if we don't cover it fully here,
23:34 we'll pick it up in our next program...
23:35 but we want to cross check...
23:38 remember how we've been cross checking with history
23:42 so, this power entity that Sardis is described
23:48 as coming out of, right...
23:50 is symbolically represented as Jezebel which is Babylon...
23:54 and so what you have here is...
23:56 the Reformers are coming out of Babylon
23:58 and they are bringing the process of reformation
24:02 okay, so let's go back to what we saw in the churches...
24:08 first church... we saw pointed us to the perfect church
24:14 that eventually fell from their first love,
24:17 reminds us of Adam and Eve,
24:18 second church... persecution reminds us of the next book...
24:21 the Book of Exodus...
24:22 the children of Israel in captivity,
24:25 the next church... compromise...
24:27 we saw that that's exactly what happened
24:29 when the children of Israel entered the Promise Land...
24:31 they began to compromise,
24:32 fourth church... Jezebel... Babylon...
24:35 we saw that right in line with Old Testament history,
24:39 the children of Israel... because of their compromise
24:42 ended up in Babylonian captivity...
24:44 the fifth church...
24:46 Martin Luther basically makes a decree... if you will...
24:51 he nails the theses on the door
24:55 and as a result... people start to leave Babylon
25:01 the support of Babylon begins to dry up, if you will,
25:05 they leave Babylon
25:07 because they're going to begin a work of Reformation,
25:10 well, guess what happens in Old Testament history?
25:11 James: Same thing...
25:13 Ivor: Same thing... a decree is made by a man named Cyrus
25:17 who opens the gates of Babylon to set the captives free
25:21 so that they can go back and begin the work of reformation...
25:25 begin the work of building the house of the Lord,
25:28 so there's just an amazing parallel but guess what happens?
25:31 When they go back to build the house of the Lord,
25:34 Nehemiah... years later...
25:37 wants to know the situation of Jerusalem and guess what?
25:40 He asked, "What about those who have escaped from Babylon,
25:43 what's the situation there?"
25:44 And what does he hear?
25:46 "They're building their own houses
25:48 while the house of the Lord is still in ruins. "
25:51 James: That's what we're seeing right here.
25:53 Ivor: What happened with the Reformation,
25:55 everyone started building their own houses...
25:56 James: All Denominations...
25:58 Ivor: God intended for one house but the Reformers
26:02 they went on with it and they would stop...
26:04 James: They're Followers... specifically...
26:06 Ivor: Exactly... they're followers, exactly,
26:08 they're followers... stop...
26:09 and so now you have all these different houses...
26:12 James: Denominations... Ivor: Denominations...
26:14 James: They all have a little something...
26:16 Ivor: They all have a little something...
26:19 but the house of the Lord is being neglected
26:21 so we know that whatever happens with the next church,
26:24 has to deal with... the house of the Lord...
26:27 bringing everyone into one house...
26:31 Yvonne: Wow! this is giving me chills...
26:34 really, because it's something, it's a way of looking at it
26:39 that I haven't...
26:40 James: That brings the whole Bible together...
26:42 Ivor: Absolutely... Yvonne: Yeah...
26:44 James: So we've just cross checked it...
26:45 Ivor: We know that our interpretation is right
26:46 because it's following the history
26:48 of the Old Testament to a "T... "
26:50 Yvonne: Hmmm... hmmm... James: Hmmm... hmmm...
26:51 Ivor: So if you know the history of the Old Testament,
26:54 you have everything you need
26:55 to understand the whole Book of Revelation.
26:57 And I know people are...
26:59 that going to be listening to this are going to be saying,
27:01 "Yes!" just like you're saying... "yeah, this is great,
27:03 I got to... I got to... but I've got a question...
27:05 I've got a question, I've got a question. "
27:06 Jason: Then they need to send a video of their question
27:10 to sss@3abn. org
27:13 sss... "S" as in Salvation and Symbols and Signs...
27:16 at 3abn. org
27:18 James: Amen, this is really awesome,
27:21 I mean, I just want to say, "I don't use that word for food,
27:24 I don't use that word for people,
27:26 I use that word for the Word of God
27:28 and the truths of God's Word, this is awesome...
27:30 what we're studying is awesome, God is awesome.
27:31 Yvonne: Yes... He is...
27:32 James: And the way this is all coming together
27:34 it's just beautiful to me,
27:35 I think this is definitely a "Holy Spirit work"
27:38 that's working right now,
27:40 helping us to understand these Scriptures
27:42 and bringing them forth in a way
27:43 that ties the whole Bible together
27:45 and gives a meaning to them. Yvonne: Yes...
27:46 James: So we're going to close out our session
27:48 with a word of prayer, Yvonne, would you pray for us?
27:50 Yvonne: Yes... "Father God, what a privilege it's been
27:52 to open your Word and to gain new elements from it,
27:57 I mean, every time we open it,
27:59 there's something new to be gained,
28:00 we can never learn enough and so we thank you God,
28:03 we thank you for your presence, we thank you for your power,
28:06 we thank you for your love,
28:08 thank you God for being in our midst
28:11 and continue to guide us
28:12 and continue to guide these discussions
28:15 so that we might come to an understanding
28:17 of your Word, amen. "
28:19 All: "Amen... "