Salvation in Symbols and Signs

The Woman

Three Angels Broadcasting Network

Program transcript

Participants: Ivor Myers (Host), James Rafferty (Host), Jason Bradley, Yvonne Lewis


Series Code: SISS

Program Code: SISS000048A

00:29 We made it...
00:31 I've said that a couple of times and I really mean it this time.
00:33 We are half way through the book of Revelation.
00:36 I think this is program number 48 or something like that
00:39 but I'm so thankful that we are just taking our time
00:43 and moving through this at a steady pace,
00:44 rehashing... re-summarizing... going back over,
00:48 asking questions... answering questions...
00:51 I think that's really important for us... for our Viewers...
00:53 Revelation 12 is a landmark,
00:56 it is... it is in a sense... it is the zenith...
00:58 it is the center...
01:00 it is the height of the book of Revelation,
01:02 it's an incredible chapter, I would say,
01:04 and I think we talked about this a little bit earlier,
01:07 that without Revelation 12... Revelation 13 and on...
01:09 it is almost meaningless...
01:11 it brings insight and explanation
01:13 to everything that's been happening on Planet Earth
01:15 for the last six thousand years and it is the vital testimony
01:19 that has to be given in the case against God, if you will,
01:23 now, Revelation chapter 12 is going to begin with
01:26 the introduction in our fourth prophetic cycle,
01:29 and that's what we're going to be looking at
01:31 so, we want to start with a word of prayer
01:33 and then we want to actually review,
01:35 "What are these prophetic cycles
01:36 that we've been talking about?"
01:37 Because that's been a few programs back...
01:39 and, "How does this qualify as the fourth prophetic cycle
01:42 and how does it qualify
01:44 as the fourth and last prophetic cycle?"
01:45 So, what is a prophetic cycle? How does this qualify as one?
01:48 And how does this qualify as the last one?
01:50 That's what we look at... Yvonne: That's good.
01:51 James: Jason, take us away...
01:52 Jason: All right, "Dear Heavenly Father,
01:54 as we study your word,
01:55 we ask that you would expand our minds
01:57 and prepare us to receive these powerful truths
01:59 that you have for us today,
02:01 send your Holy Spirit to lead us into all truth
02:03 and our Viewers as well and Listeners,
02:06 in Jesus' name we pray, amen. " All: "Amen. "
02:08 James: All right, so we've been looking
02:11 at the book of Revelation as organized...
02:13 and there are different ways
02:15 that you can approach the book of Revelation
02:17 but we've decided that the book of Revelation
02:19 is written with these four prophetic cycles,
02:21 they have a beginning point and an ending point.
02:24 And the beginning point is in the Apostolic Age
02:26 with special reference to Jesus,
02:29 and the ending point is the new heavens and the new earth
02:31 and so, there are four times in the book of Revelation
02:34 when we start in the Apostolic Age with Christ
02:36 and we end it in the new heavens and the new earth.
02:38 The first one is the beginning
02:40 Jesus comes to John in the Isle of Patmos,
02:43 there He is, right there in Patmos
02:44 this is the Apostolic Age,
02:46 this is the time when John was alive
02:47 and there comes Jesus and He introduces Himself
02:50 to John in an Island in this glorified form
02:53 and reveals that He's among the candlesticks...
02:55 it's a reminder of the incarnation of Christ,
02:58 and then... when you get through the churches,
03:01 you find these promises that are given to each church
03:03 that relate to the new heaven and the new earth,
03:05 you get to the end of the churches,
03:07 that prophetic cycle is over
03:08 then you start a second prophetic cycle
03:10 the second prophetic cycle begins in Revelation chapter 4,
03:13 4 and 5... introduce us again to the Apostolic Age.
03:17 How do we know that?
03:18 Well, first of all, in chapter 5
03:20 the slain lamb is introduced in heaven,
03:23 He's introduced, in chapter 4,
03:25 the seven spirits are before the throne of God,
03:28 that's the Holy Spirit...
03:29 but in chapter 5... they're sent out into all the earth.
03:32 So, you have in this prophetic cycle... the Apostolic Age...
03:35 the lamb... who has just been slain,
03:37 it's presented in symbolic language, of course,
03:40 it's not happening in A.D. 90...
03:41 and the Holy Spirit has been poured out into the earth,
03:44 so that's the Apostolic Age,
03:45 that's the beginning of the first prophetic cycle,
03:47 you move through the horses, the white horse, the red horse,
03:50 the black horse, the pale horse, and you go all the way through
03:53 the fifth seal, sixth seal, seventh seal,
03:55 then you have the sealing of the 144,000...
03:58 and you have this great multitude that no man can number
04:00 that stand around the throne, they say,
04:01 "Praise God, we're saved... "
04:02 they don't hunger anymore, they don't thirst anymore,
04:04 they're led behind rivers of living water
04:07 boom! that's the new heaven and the new earth,
04:09 end of the second prophetic cycle.
04:11 Yvonne: Okay, wait, wait, wait, you kind of lost me,
04:13 so the first one is the Apostolic Age
04:15 and the second one is the Apostolic Age?
04:17 James: Yes, each prophetic cycle
04:19 begins with the Apostolic Age,
04:20 each prophetic cycle ends in the new heaven and the new earth.
04:22 Yvonne: Okay.
04:23 James: So when you start the churches,
04:25 you're starting in John's time
04:26 and you're going all the way to the new heaven
04:27 and the new earth. Yvonne: Right...
04:29 James: When you start the seals, ah, next prophetic cycle,
04:30 start all over again... boom! back to Apostolic Age,
04:33 and then we go all the way through again in history,
04:36 a new heaven and a new earth. Yvonne: Ah... hmmm...
04:38 James: Now we get to the trumpets... boom!
04:39 where are we going? Back to the Apostolic Age...
04:43 and that's really helpful when we get to the trumpets
04:45 because when the trumpets are given to the angels,
04:48 there's a pause and we see another angel
04:49 and he goes to an altar and he take incense from the altar
04:52 and he mingles it with the prayers of the saints
04:55 in the golden altar in heaven
04:57 and then he takes fire from the altar
04:59 and casts it into the earth, we're like,
05:01 "That could mean almost anything"
05:02 there's a censer thrown down to the earth,
05:04 that could mean the close of probation,
05:05 we could be anywhere, well, no...
05:07 because our first prophetic cycle
05:08 begins with the Apostolic Age
05:10 and the outpouring of the Holy Spirit,
05:11 the second prophetic cycle begins with the Apostolic Age
05:15 and the outpouring of the Holy Spirit,
05:16 and by-the-way... seven churches...
05:18 outpouring of the Holy Spirit,
05:19 hear what the Spirit says to the churches...
05:20 hear what the Holy Spirit says to the churches,
05:22 so the third prophetic cycle,
05:23 begins in the same place,
05:24 so do we have something that lines up historically
05:28 with the symbolism of the angel representing Christ
05:32 taking incense from the altar representing His merits
05:35 from the cross into heaven
05:37 to the Sanctuary in heaven and the Holy Place
05:40 to mingle it with the prayers of God's people
05:42 and then fire being cast down out of heaven into the earth,
05:46 yes, we have the outpouring of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost.
05:50 Jesus went to heaven...
05:51 He took His sacrifice with Him in heaven...
05:54 He mingles that sacrifice... His merits...
05:56 with the prayers of the disciples
05:57 who were praying for the outpouring of the Holy Spirit
05:59 on the day of Pentecost
06:00 and when this Spirit is poured out,
06:02 what does it look like? Fire... Yvonne: Hmmm...
06:05 James: Cloven tongues of fire on their heads,
06:07 so we have... again... the Apostolic Age,
06:10 in Revelation 7 trumpets, that's where it begins,
06:12 the first trumpet... the destruction of Jerusalem,
06:14 the second trumpet... pagan Rome...
06:16 then you have the rise of this Papal Power,
06:18 that is given time...
06:20 and judgment is coming against them but it's given time
06:23 before it actually feels the final judgment
06:25 and then we go all the way... last program...
06:26 all the way down to the seventh trumpet or the third woe
06:30 second coming of Jesus, reward to the Saints,
06:33 destroy them that destroy the earth,
06:34 new heaven and the new earth
06:36 those are the three prophetic cycles we've gone through so far
06:38 and they're prophetic cycles,
06:40 because they begin in the Apostolic Age...
06:43 that's the evidence in each one of them in the Scripture
06:45 and they end in the new heaven and the new earth.
06:47 So, now we get to Revelation 12,
06:49 and what we're suggesting is
06:51 Revelation 12 begins another prophetic cycle,
06:54 that's number one...
06:56 number two... the prophetic cycle, of course,
06:58 has to be identified...
07:00 how do we know it's beginning another prophetic cycle,
07:02 okay, and number three,
07:04 where does the prophetic cycle end?
07:06 Does it end in the same place the others have?
07:10 And if so, where does the...
07:11 the one we're beginning in Revelation 12,
07:13 where do we find it taking us to the new heaven
07:14 and the new earth? Yvonne: Hmmm...
07:16 James: Okay, so, first of all we want to read
07:18 Revelation chapter 12 verses 1...
07:21 I think we should read all the way through to verse 5.
07:23 What do you think?
07:24 Ivor: Yeah. James: Yeah, one through five
07:26 and we're going to look for the prophetic cycle.
07:28 Ivor: And I want to just... I want to juice that down
07:33 and actually point to something that is very, very powerful
07:35 in Revelation 12, verses 1 through 6,
07:38 when we read it, we're actually going to see
07:40 that Revelation 12:1 through 6 is like the entire Old Testament
07:46 juiced down into six verses... as well as
07:50 the entire history of the Apostolic Church
07:54 down to the Dark Ages to the end of time,
07:58 juiced in these verses, it's amazing,
08:01 but those cycles that are... that James is talking about,
08:07 we can see it... we can see that same cycle
08:10 in the pattern of the Sanctuary
08:11 and you'll remember that we talked about
08:14 how the priest, right, when he went in on the...
08:16 during the daily services,
08:19 he would go in among the Seven-branched Candlestick,
08:21 the Altar of Incense and the Table of Shewbread,
08:24 it was a simultaneous ministry
08:26 and so, this is what he was doing on a daily basis
08:30 and when he attended to one, he was to attend to the other,
08:34 so we know these three cycles of churches, seals and trumpets
08:38 are all occurring in the context of the daily ministration,
08:42 right, but in connection with that daily ministration
08:46 was something called the yearly ministration,
08:48 that was, when the High Priest moved into the Most Holy Place,
08:52 on the Day of Atonement
08:54 and on the Day of Atonement,
08:56 he moves into the Most Holy Place,
08:58 the Sanctuary, in a sense, he enters into this veil,
09:02 okay, inside the Most Holy Place
09:06 the veil is opened and he enters in,
09:08 the next time the veil is significantly opened,
09:13 is when he comes out to bless the people,
09:15 when he comes out to bless the people,
09:17 the Day of Atonement is basically ended
09:20 and those who had not made themselves right with God,
09:23 were cut off after the High Priest
09:26 moved out of the Sanctuary,
09:28 so, we're going to see that Revelation 1 through 11,
09:31 is all... day... mostly... 80 percent
09:35 because remember the sevens of each... six... seven...
09:39 bring into Most Holy Place View
09:43 but most of these churches, seals, are occurring
09:46 in the context of the Daily... okay...
09:49 when we get to Revelation chapter 12,
09:52 there's suddenly a shift... we're transitioning
09:55 because remember 1119, the temple was opened...
09:58 James: In heaven...
10:00 Ivor: The temple was opened in heaven and now,
10:01 the understanding of God's people
10:04 is... "Wait a minute... this is Most Holy Place stuff,
10:07 the third woe... Jesus is coming again...
10:10 and there's a judgment going on
10:12 and those who are unprepared for the judgment,
10:14 guess what happens in Revelation chapter 15,
10:17 the temple is opened one more time,
10:20 it's the third time the temple is opened
10:23 in the book of Revelation
10:25 but this time, when the temple is opened,
10:27 you have the seven last plagues that are coming out,
10:31 those seven last plagues are what we would call
10:34 the last set of sevens, there are seven churches,
10:37 seven trumpets, seven seals,
10:40 and then the seven last plagues, now notice this,
10:44 the seven last... because you would think,
10:45 well, why don't we just parallel the seven last plagues
10:48 to the time periods of the seven churches
10:49 but no, you're dealing with different times
10:52 one is Holy Place the other is the Most Holy Place
10:55 so we know that these seven plagues
11:00 don't start the same time as the seven churches or...
11:04 they're starting after
11:06 something is done in the Most Holy Place,
11:07 which means they're going to be a much shorter duration
11:11 than the other sets of sevens,
11:14 so that again just gives us... we step back and we say,
11:17 "Okay, this is what we're looking at"
11:18 we're looking at the whole book of Revelation
11:20 is based upon this theme of the Sanctuary diagram.
11:23 Yvonne: Hmmm... hmmm...
11:25 Ivor: So that's just kind of...
11:26 bringing around what we were first discussing
11:28 in our first program,
11:30 so we know we're not losing sight
11:31 of where we are... what we're looking at...
11:33 Yvonne: Right... right...
11:35 James: And it's really interesting isn't it
11:36 that this four... of these different parts of the Sanctuary
11:39 in the Holy and Most Holy Place there's the Candlestick...
11:42 there's the Altar of Incense and there's the Table of Shewbread
11:45 and then there's the Most Holy Place
11:46 that's four articles... four places...
11:48 and then there's this four prophetic cycles,
11:50 in the first prophetic cycle... Jesus is among the candlesticks
11:53 which is in the... Holy Place... Most... in the Holy Place...
11:56 and the second prophetic cycle,
11:58 there's is this book... or this roll... the scroll...
12:00 that's the center that's being unsealed
12:02 and that would represent the Word of God
12:04 which is the Table of Shewbread
12:05 and in the third prophetic cycle the angel has the censer
12:09 and he's offering his righteousness before
12:12 the golden altar which is before the throne
12:15 and that's the Altar of Incense, so all of the articles
12:18 in the Holy Place are implied
12:22 in the three prophetic cycles so far,
12:24 the first one with the churches, the second one with the roll,
12:27 and the third one with the Altar and incense,
12:30 and then when you enter the fourth prophetic cycle
12:32 which we're entering right now,
12:33 you enter it by going into the Most Holy Place.
12:35 Ivor: Right, that's right...
12:37 James: The Ark was opened in the Most Holy Place
12:38 so now we're going into the Most Holy Place
12:39 and here is where we're seeing a picture of this
12:43 phenomenal of the whole great controversy,
12:46 from beginning to end,
12:47 God is just kind of distilling it down bringing us to...
12:50 like Ivor said in verses 1 through 6 of Revelation 12,
12:54 God distills the whole history of this church and Christ
12:58 and the transition from
13:00 Jerusalem church to the Christian church...
13:03 all down into the six verses, so let's read them,
13:06 let's read them and get into it.
13:08 Yvonne: Okay.
13:09 Jason: Sure, "And there appeared a great wonder in heaven;
13:12 a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet,
13:15 and upon her head a crown of twelve stars;
13:18 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth,
13:22 and pained to be delivered.
13:24 And there appeared another wonder in heaven;
13:27 and behold a great red dragon
13:29 having seven heads and ten horns,
13:31 and seven crowns upon his heads.
13:33 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven,
13:36 and did cast them to the earth:
13:39 and the dragon stood before the woman
13:41 which was ready to be delivered,
13:42 for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
13:46 And she brought forth a man child,
13:48 who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron:
13:51 and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.
13:54 And the woman fled into the wilderness,
13:57 where she hath a place prepared of God,
14:00 that they should feed her there
14:04 a thousand two hundred and threescore days. "
14:07 James: Whew... there's a lot here...
14:08 there is a lot here.
14:09 Ivor: Do you see the whole Bible?
14:12 James: Yes, it's there, yeah...
14:14 Ivor: In 1 through 6, how's that going to happen?
14:17 I can just juice the Bible down in six verses...
14:20 the whole history...
14:21 James: I like the way he says that,
14:22 "Juice it down, juice it down... "
14:24 because I could say, "distill it down... "
14:26 but "juice it down... " is just that...
14:27 there's a lot of minerals and nutrients in the juice.
14:29 Yvonne: Exactly...
14:31 James: You've taken everything out to distill it
14:32 but you put everything in... here's the deal...
14:34 and I want you to notice the parallels
14:36 and Ivor's brought it up,
14:37 in Revelation chapter 12, there's a woman,
14:39 in the book of Genesis, there's a woman,
14:42 in Revelation chapter 12, there's a serpent,
14:44 in the book of Genesis, there's a serpent,
14:46 in Revelation chapter 12, there's deception,
14:49 in Genesis, there's deception,
14:51 in Revelation chapter 12,
14:52 the woman is clothed with light,
14:56 you know, a lot of artists,
14:58 when they depict Adam and Eve
15:00 in the Garden of Eden before they sinned,
15:02 they picture them naked, and, of course,
15:04 no one paints naked Adam and Eve,
15:07 so they're always covered by an animal or by a branch
15:09 or something like that, but when you look, you're like,
15:12 if it weren't for the branches and animals, they'd be naked,
15:14 but that's not Biblical... that is not Biblical...
15:17 the Bible tells us very clearly that God, Himself,
15:21 is clothed in light, He's clothed in light
15:25 and He made us in His image,
15:26 see, the reason why Adam and Eve, weren't ashamed...
15:29 when they were naked is because they were clothed with light
15:31 and the reason why they were ashamed
15:33 and realized they were naked
15:35 is because they lost the robe of light,
15:37 they lost it... it was gone... it was like...
15:38 "Oh, we'd better cover ourselves"
15:40 before that time, they were covered with light
15:43 so, you have this woman clothed with the sun
15:47 light... you see the...
15:49 God is borrowing out of the book of Genesis,
15:52 all of the symbols, all of the language,
15:54 He's... the woman has been restored,
15:56 she's again... and you know where she's standing,
15:59 she's not standing in the suppositions of the serpent,
16:01 "Well, you know,
16:02 did God say, well, God's trying to... "
16:05 she's standing on the moon,
16:06 which is a symbol of the Word of God
16:08 and she's clothed with the light, standing...
16:11 so, what God is doing is,
16:13 God is basically giving us a big picture...
16:14 just in verse 1, He's giving us a big picture
16:16 and He's saying, "Guess what?
16:17 Everything is going back to the beginning of Creation,
16:21 I'm restoring... what you're about to read
16:23 is the process by which restoration has taken place... "
16:26 Yvonne: Hmmm...
16:28 James: If you had only one chapter
16:29 in the book of Revelation,
16:30 if you had only one chapter in the Bible,
16:32 Revelation 12 would be the chapter
16:33 because it brings us the whole story,
16:35 Revelation 12 bring us stuff
16:37 you won't find anywhere else in the Bible,
16:39 like, for example, where this all started,
16:41 we're not going to get that far ahead
16:43 but here's the first thing we want to prove,
16:45 remember... Ivor started the program by saying,
16:46 "this is the fourth prophetic cycle,"
16:48 so what we need to do is,
16:49 we need to prove that we're starting...
16:51 this is starting in the Apostolic Age,
16:52 tell me, how do we know
16:53 that this is starting in the Apostolic Age,
16:55 any clues to how do we know
16:56 that this is staring in Christ's day?
16:58 How do we know that this isn't something that took place
17:02 in 1844 or something that took place in 1969
17:06 or something that took place in back in Babylon somewhere?
17:10 Who is this woman, who is this child?
17:12 What happens to the child?
17:15 Yvonne: The child is...
17:18 the woman always represents the church,
17:20 right, and the Son here, Son... would represent Jesus.
17:28 James: Right... so obviously
17:31 this is the birth of Christ.
17:33 Yvonne: But here's my question. James: Yes.
17:34 Yvonne: The church did not give birth to Christ,
17:38 Christ actually gave birth to the church, did He not?
17:41 I mean, not gave birth...
17:43 James: But when Christ was born, He was born of the Jewish church
17:45 that's where He came from.
17:47 Yvonne: Oh, from the Jewish church.
17:48 Ivor: Listen to this, verse 2,
17:50 it says, "And she being with child cried,
17:52 travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered. "
17:54 So, here's the question, does it talk about... juicing?
17:57 Like, when... this is the...
17:59 this is the church... and the Old Testament church...
18:02 Yvonne: Okay. James: The Old Testament Church.
18:04 Ivor: This is the Old Testament Church, okay,
18:06 but when did the Old Testament Church
18:08 get pregnant with Christ, go back to Genesis 3:15,
18:12 in Genesis 3:15, God says, "I'm going to give you a seed
18:15 and that seed is going bruise the head of the serpent,
18:18 the serpent is going to bruise his heel. "
18:20 James: And He's talking to the woman.
18:21 Ivor: He's talking to the woman. James: Yeah.
18:23 Ivor: Right, so, the whole Old Testament
18:25 is the woman travailing in birth
18:27 waiting for the Messiah to come,
18:30 this is... verses 1 and 2...
18:32 is literally... James: The whole Old Testament.
18:34 Ivor: I'm going to throw this bottle of water,
18:37 I'm just want to... what! this is the whole...
18:40 the whole thing, right, this is the... Israel...
18:42 God's people... the 12 stars...
18:44 God's people... Yvonne: Okay, it's Israel...
18:46 Ivor: This is Old Testament Israel.
18:48 Yvonne: That would make more sense to me.
18:49 Ivor: But these verses bring us right up to the cross,
18:52 where you'll see, in... when we get to verse...
18:56 is it verse 6? Where He's born, yeah...
18:59 James: Oh, where He's born... so, He's born...
19:00 yeah that's in verse 6, yeah.
19:02 Ivor: Where He's born, travailing to be born,
19:04 and... so this is the Old Testament church
19:06 waiting for the coming of the Messiah, right.
19:08 James: Verse 2... verse 2...
19:09 Ivor: And, you'll see what happens when the Son is born
19:12 and then it takes on a whole new dimension, but...
19:14 verses 1 and 2... Old Testament church...
19:17 waiting for... travailing in pain...
19:19 that's the whole Old Testament, they're waiting...
19:23 travailing in pain... they're in labor...
19:25 waiting for this Messiah, who would it be?
19:28 James: Love it... love it.
19:30 Ivor: Yeah, so this is literally taking us back to...
19:33 it's not just symbolically pointing us back to Genesis...
19:36 this is... and guess what? The dragon is like...
19:40 from Genesis 3, the dragon is like,
19:43 "All right, I'm standing before this woman... wait...
19:45 I don't know when the child's coming...
19:47 but I'm standing here and I'm waiting...
19:49 because whoever it is... I'm taking Him out"
19:51 and he thought it was Cain... James: Yeah.
19:53 Ivor: Right, thought... "Is this the child?"
19:56 well... deceives him... wins him over to his side,
19:58 then it's Abel... "Oh, another one...
20:00 James: "I got Cain, now I'll get Abel... "
20:02 Ivor: She's got another one! all right... I will kill... "
20:04 And she just keeps bringing, you see... so,
20:05 Satan is looking... waiting...
20:08 who's the child... who's the child?
20:09 when they come... the Magi had come looking for Jesus,
20:13 it's like, "Okay, this is Him, this is Him... "
20:16 Yvonne: Hmmm... hmmm... hmmm...
20:18 James: And here's another confirmation here
20:20 in these verses of how Satan's working, so,
20:21 we talked about Satan,
20:23 we talked about all these Nations and...
20:25 and we've implied that Satan's come,
20:27 he's the fallen angel... he's this... he's that...
20:28 and yet we've identified nations
20:30 well, here, it becomes very clear
20:32 because it says here as you look in verse 4,
20:35 it's talking about the dragon in the context,
20:39 a great... "another great wonder"
20:41 in verse 3... "the dragon" and it says,
20:42 "And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven,
20:44 and did cast them to the earth:
20:46 and the dragon stood before the woman
20:48 that was ready to be delivered,
20:50 to devour her child as soon as it was born. "
20:53 So, how did he do that? Was this some red dragon
20:56 standing in the manger there, no, so how did he do it?
20:59 He's working through Herod, so this... this interpretation,
21:03 this application of Christ can be verified now
21:05 in the history of the Bible itself,
21:07 you go back to the Bible and you find that
21:09 when the Magi came looking for the Messiah in Jerusalem,
21:12 they're just like... "Okay, we'd better get there early
21:15 because everyone's going to be...
21:17 the front row is going to be full,
21:18 the back row... the second row...
21:19 we're going to have to sit up in the balcony somewhere
21:21 because everyone's going to be like,
21:22 'The Messiah is coming and we're all here'"
21:23 and he's like, "It's real quiet around here,
21:26 what's... what's going on...?"
21:27 They find nobody... in fact, what they find is
21:30 they find people who are irritated by them even asking
21:33 the question about it...
21:34 the religious leaders are indifferent,
21:35 Herod is so upset about that because he's like,
21:37 "Here is going to be someone
21:39 that's going to threaten my kingdom,
21:40 I need to find out who He is and where He's going to be born. "
21:41 Yvonne: Right...
21:43 James: So he pretends... his political face is on
21:44 but behind the scenes he's steaming...
21:46 and he sends them on their way to Bethlehem
21:49 and he tells them,
21:50 "As soon as you find the child, let me know... "
21:52 and then he doesn't hear from them, why?
21:53 The angel warns...
21:55 and so, finally he realizes, "I've been duped... "
21:57 and he sends soldiers in there to kill Christ...
21:59 he kills all the children under three years' of age.
22:02 because he's trying to kill Christ,
22:03 that's how the dragon does it,
22:04 so that's our second indication right here,
22:06 first is Genesis 3, "the promised Messiah is coming
22:09 you're going to have... the woman's going to give birth"
22:11 and then we have Satan trying to destroy the child
22:13 as soon as it was born and then what happens?
22:16 Look at here... at verse 5...
22:18 "And she brought forth... " go ahead...
22:21 Ivor: Just a minute... because I'm thinking back to Moses,
22:22 and exactly what happened to Jesus at the age of 2
22:26 is what they tried to do with Moses,
22:28 yeah, you see here this parallel of the dragon...
22:32 has been doing this,
22:33 just uncertain... unsure... okay, well,
22:35 "Could Moses be the one? We don't know... go... "
22:38 James: And he was a mighty deliverer...
22:40 Ivor: Absolutely, he was a deliverer, right?
22:42 But you see this pattern
22:43 both in the Old Testament and the New Testament,
22:45 it... the Bible is... these verses are literally showing
22:49 the warfare between the woman and the dragon and the seed.
22:53 James: What about Job? Ivor: What about Job?
22:55 James: Perfect man... he's the one...
22:57 he's the... God says,
22:58 "Hey, you can't have the earth yet... look at Job"
22:59 So Satan's like, "I got to take his kids out"
23:01 he takes them all out.
23:03 Ivor: Yeah, yeah... it's amazing...
23:05 the principle reveals that this conflict
23:08 has been going on but it culminates when Christ is born.
23:12 James: And here's the deal... what we need to understand
23:16 as we get into Revelation chapter 12
23:18 is that the picture we're laying out here, the Biblical picture
23:21 is what the whole universe is interested in seeing,
23:23 character is being revealed,
23:25 God's character and Satan's character is being revealed,
23:28 God is giving... He's loving... He's forgiving...
23:30 and He gives Himself,
23:31 and Satan is seeking to kill, destroy and steal,
23:34 to kill, destroy and steal, and the whole unfallen universe
23:37 is looking down and seeing this great controversy
23:39 unfold before their faces, so when it's finally settled...
23:42 when Jesus finally dies, they're like,
23:44 "Yeah, salvation to our God and to His throne, yeah... "
23:47 and then they're like,
23:48 "but woe to the inhabitants of the earth...
23:51 that's going to be tough,
23:52 they've got to deal with this for a little while longer
23:55 until they figure this out, I'm so glad we figured it out
23:58 but they've still got to figure it out. "
24:01 Yvonne: Yes.
24:02 James: Okay, in verse 5...
24:03 "And she brought forth a man child... "
24:05 okay, so there we have the birth of Christ...
24:07 "who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron... "
24:09 that's how we know...
24:11 only Christ is the one that's going to rule all nations
24:13 okay, and it says,
24:15 "He's caught up to God and to His throne"
24:17 so there we have the resurrection of Jesus,
24:19 there we have Christ going into the heavenly Sanctuary again
24:23 there we have His confirmation again of our prophetic cycle
24:27 you see that? Yvonne: Hmmm...
24:28 James: What in the world...? We've come all the way through,
24:31 through three prophetic cycles...
24:32 all the way to the new heaven and new earth
24:33 and now we're going all the way back again
24:35 to the birth of Christ, so, this confirms again,
24:37 "Oh, there's another prophetic cycle" and by the way...
24:39 never happens again in the book of Revelation...
24:42 that's why this is the final one
24:43 there is never a time again in the book of Revelation
24:46 where in the storyline...
24:47 we go back all the way back the Apostolic Age,
24:49 from now on... it's all going forward...
24:51 we rehearse history in Revelation 13,
24:55 for example, and right here...
24:56 but then Revelation 13 takes us right into the eschatological
24:59 final crisis... 14 reveals a little bit
25:02 and boom! three angels' messages...
25:04 judgment... 15... judgment...
25:06 16... judgment... 17... judgment...
25:07 18... judgment... 19... judgment...
25:09 20... judgment... and the reason why
25:11 God has to give us Revelation 12, 13 and 14
25:15 is because... judgment is coming...
25:16 and He's got a... He's all out right now...
25:19 He's reviewing everything,
25:20 He's finally... in Revelation 12 He's finally speaking up
25:23 He's finally giving a testimony and then in Revelation 14,
25:27 He's giving the message that's so powerful
25:28 it lightens the earth with His glory
25:30 because He's got to close this up.
25:32 Ivor: Imagine Revelation 12 as... God is our teacher,
25:36 He's been taking us through
25:38 chapter 1, chapter 2, chapter... "Are you getting this sure...?"
25:41 4, 5... at 12 He says, "Okay, now...
25:44 before we get into the meat, meat, meat, meat, meat...
25:49 I want to review with you and make sure you got...
25:53 make sure you understand the history we've just covered
25:55 okay, in all these 11 verses so, Revelation 12...
25:58 is Revelation 11... 1 through 11 juiced...
26:02 Revelation 12 is Revelation 1 through 11 recycled
26:08 or just condensed down into one chapter.
26:13 Everything we're reading here, we're going to be like,
26:15 "Okay, yeah... okay, yeah, because
26:17 I remember that... I remember... hmmm... hmmm...
26:19 yes, yes, yes, got it, got it, got it,
26:20 okay, you got it... all right...
26:22 now, we move into Revelation 13,
26:24 this is where I'm going to reveal to you
26:26 so that you know without a shadow of a doubt
26:29 your interpretation of 13, 14, 15, 16...
26:32 all the way onward is correct
26:34 because you got the first half of the book right
26:37 and 12 is me just making sure you got it right...
26:40 before we move on. "
26:41 Yvonne: Hmmm...
26:43 James: Yeah, and what you see here really is... is that
26:44 Revelation chapter 12 is this transition
26:47 where we move... in the first half of the book...
26:49 the first three prophetic cycles,
26:50 have been primarily... past history to us...
26:53 living in the end of time
26:55 most of those prophetic cycles have dealt with pre-1844...
26:59 even in the 6th trumpet... you remember that 2nd woe?
27:02 It was the voice coming from
27:04 the four horns of the golden altar
27:07 but Revelation chapter 12 and onward...
27:08 is flipping it the other way,
27:10 Revelation 12 and onward is primarily going to be
27:12 end-time prophecy...
27:14 post-1844... and, of course, we see that in the transition
27:16 in verse 19, we're in the Most Holy Place,
27:19 so we review the history...
27:20 but most of the stuff that's taking place here,
27:22 is just before us...
27:24 Ivor: Right. Yvonne: All right...
27:25 James: All right, what about questions,
27:27 what about questions as we end this session?
27:28 Jason: Oh, that should be submitted to: sss@3abn. org
27:31 so you guys can answer them.
27:33 James: Yes, and I know you're going to help us with that
27:35 because I know you answered one just recently...
27:36 you answered a question... I don't know if you remember that,
27:39 Jason: You will have to refresh my memory.
27:41 James: Well, it was more like a technical question,
27:45 like... but we're going to move you in that direction
27:48 that's a heads up and a warning. Jason: Yes...
27:50 James: All right, so we're going to close this up,
27:52 we've run out of time for this session
27:53 but we'll pick it up right here in Revelation 12,
27:54 we might spend three or four meetings on Revelation 12
27:56 because there's a lot here in one session...
27:58 there's a lot of info.
27:59 Yvonne: Yeah, good... good.


Revised 2017-01-03