Abortion Controversy, The

A Child Saved: Antionette Duck's Story

Three Angels Broadcasting Network

Program transcript

Participants: Steve Wohlberg (Host), Antionette Duck

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Series Code: TAC

Program Code: TAC000003A


00:08 Have you ever met a woman whose mother planned to abort her,
00:12 but changed her mind?
00:13 You're about to meet that person next on
00:15 "The Abortion Controversy"
00:44 Welcome to Part 3 of "The Abortion Controversy Series"
00:48 This is a 13-Part series and in Parts 1 and 2,
00:51 I interviewed Dianne Wagoner, a lady who has had
00:54 2 abortions who struggled terribly as a result
00:58 of the guilt and the pain, but who found healing
01:01 through the love and the mercy, and the grace of God.
01:04 And for Part 3, I'm going to interview Antionette Duck.
01:09 She is an attorney from Georgia.
01:11 She, unlike Dianne, she never had an abortion,
01:15 but she was almost aborted, but her mother changed
01:18 her mind and she is here today,
01:20 and she has quite a story a you!
01:22 So, Antionette, I'll shake your hand as I did Dianne's.
01:27 Glad you're here so much... Thank you
01:29 It's just wonderful, and I have heard your story
01:32 on the internet really, but we've only really met today,
01:35 and I told Dianne that what really crossed me over the line,
01:41 after I had been wrestling with whether we should do
01:43 something on this topic, was hearing your story
01:46 and her story in a hotel, in Oregon on Saturday night,
01:50 out of my iPhone.
01:52 I heard it from a website, and it just... I tell you,
01:56 it just really moved me and that's what brought me
02:00 over the line and I said, we've got to bring you in here,
02:04 we've got to talk to you, we've got to hear more.
02:06 So, it's just great to be here with you.
02:09 I have your little book, "Mafgia"... "gee-a"
02:16 It's always... it's another tongue-twister... "Maf-gee-a."
02:19 Lift up your voice... This is your little book that
02:21 deals with abortion and I've heard a rumor that
02:24 Georgia attorneys are pretty passionate.
02:28 Well, I hope so.
02:30 And I know you are too, so wherever you want to start,
02:33 just start and just tell us your story... Okay
02:37 And, let's just go from there.
02:39 When my mother became pregnant back in 1981,
02:44 she was in an extremely abusive marriage.
02:47 Her husband, my biological father, was addicted to drugs
02:51 and alcohol and the marriage could be quite frightening,
02:56 it could be quite scary and very violent.
02:58 And, when she began to experience morning sickness,
03:02 she did not want to bring a child into that relationship.
03:08 She wasn't a believer and didn't want to bring
03:10 a child into that relationship.
03:11 And she said, "I am not going to stay
03:14 in this relationship, and I'm certainly not going to
03:15 bring a baby into this relationship."
03:17 And so what she decided to do is, she was going to
03:21 save up money; she was going to go back home to California
03:24 because abortions were actually free back in 1981
03:27 in California at that time, and she was going to
03:30 save up her money, get on a bus, go back to California,
03:32 and be done with this relationship.
03:34 Well, she started to secretly give money to a friend
03:39 for safekeeping and she worked over a period of time,
03:44 gave money to her friend and when she thought
03:46 she had enough and she was ready to go back to California,
03:49 she went to her friend and asked for her money.
03:52 And her friend said, "What money, I spent all of it."
03:56 Spent it all... It's gone!
03:58 So she never got the money to go to California?
04:00 She never got the money and she had no way out.
04:05 She had no options, she didn't know what to do.
04:08 Well, my biological father knew that she was
04:11 experiencing morning sickness, and he cut out this ad
04:15 in the paper and the ad said,
04:17 "Hey, I'm alive - voice of the pre-born,"
04:21 Columbus, Georgia, because that's where she
04:22 was living at the time, and it was an advertisement
04:26 from a Baptist Church, and they were running a
04:28 Crisis Pregnancy Center for Women out of the church,
04:32 back in 1981 and so she called, she made an appointment.
04:37 She was hoping actually that they would help her
04:39 have an abortion and when she went in and asked,
04:43 "Will you help me have the abortion?"
04:44 they said, "No, but will you come back for some counseling?"
04:47 So, she goes back for counseling and when she went in for
04:50 counseling, she picked up a magazine, when she was in
04:53 her session and back in 1965, a photographer had taken
05:00 photos of the baby in utero and it was the first time,
05:04 back in 1965, that was the first time the world had
05:06 seen pictures of the baby in utero,
05:09 and it showed all these different stages of development
05:11 from just throughout the gestational period.
05:14 And, she saw fingers and toes and arms and legs,
05:17 and hands and feet.
05:19 She had no idea that the baby inside of her was alive.
05:22 I'm not sure you've seen that picture of a little
05:25 hand coming out... Yes!
05:27 It was "Life Magazine" cover with the little hand
05:28 coming out... showing a surgery - right,
05:31 and the little hand grabbed the hand of the surgeon
05:34 and that picture went around the world. Yes
05:38 And just showed that there's somebody in there!
05:40 Yes, absolutely!
05:42 Well, and she had thought the baby was just
05:43 a mass of protoplasm, that's what she had been taught.
05:45 It's literally just a mass of protoplasm,
05:47 so when she saw the formation, when she saw
05:52 not just how it developed, but that it was a human being
05:54 inside, the Holy Spirit just fell on her and she knew
06:00 no matter what happens,
06:01 I'm going through it with this baby. Wow
06:04 Well, that baby was me, and so over 30 years later,
06:07 here I am because other people interceded for my life.
06:14 They believed in her value, they believed in my value,
06:16 and they weren't willing just to stay silent,
06:20 and that was the story of my beginning.
06:24 And you're still close with your mother today, right? Yes!
06:27 Because she's still alive and you have good contact
06:30 and talk on the phone and how often do you see her?
06:32 Yes, well as often... Atlanta isn't too far away from
06:36 Columbus and so whenever I'm able to get down there...
06:38 I have 3 brothers as well; all who are adopted.
06:41 Their mothers were all in crisis pregnancy
06:44 situations the way that my mother was,
06:45 and they were adopted into our family.
06:47 And I'm assuming your mother knows that you're here
06:49 today... right? Oh yes!
06:50 So she's probably praying
06:52 so we'll give her a good report when this is over.
06:54 Yes, absolutely! Very excited, very excited about it.
06:57 Now tell me a little bit about your
06:58 church background as you were growing up.
07:01 Sure, sure... Or any church background.
07:03 I'll preface it by saying that what I want people to
07:07 understand is... You know, there are many concerns
07:10 about women who are in these crisis pregnancy situations,
07:13 and their circumstances being terrible,
07:16 and in my story, it's important to know that our circumstances
07:21 did not change, and so when my mother chose
07:26 to have me and raise me and love me so very much,
07:29 but our circumstances didn't change.
07:30 My father was still my father,
07:33 and life could be very frightening
07:36 and it could be very scary, and I began to...
07:44 I got very angry; I was hurt;
07:48 I was wounded and became very angry as a child
07:53 that the Lord would allow me to live life in this way.
07:58 I really... I got to a point where I thought
08:02 "You owe me... I shouldn't have to...
08:05 I'm angry at You that I had this childhood."
08:07 And I was... How old were you
08:09 when you were thinking those thoughts?
08:11 I think it was sort of a progression.
08:13 I don't know that I ever... Well, may I did
08:15 say it out loud, I made a decision
08:18 to accept the Lord at 8.
08:19 I was raised in a Southern Baptist Church.
08:22 The church that had started the Crisis Pregnancy Center,
08:25 they just embraced my mother and I.
08:28 They literally wrapped their arms around us,
08:30 and loved us so very much.
08:33 They didn't just love us in the crisis pregnancy,
08:35 they loved us throughout my growing up there.
08:41 But the anger and the resentment, the ingratitude,
08:45 really did take root in my heart,
08:46 and it was a process... it didn't happen overnight
08:50 because I loved...
08:52 And that's because your home was not... Right
08:54 Things weren't together and you were having problems and...
08:57 And my father was very wounded.
08:59 He had been very wounded as a child,
09:00 and so there was a whole history
09:03 of why he was the way that he was.
09:05 And I loved him so deeply, so very much.
09:08 Is he still alive? He is, yes.
09:09 You still have relations, you talk to him?
09:12 I pray for him and I've reached out to him.
09:14 We don't have much communication.
09:20 Even though I loved him though,
09:21 I really struggled with feelings of anger and hatred
09:24 that my life had been the way that it was,
09:26 and I found myself, as I got older, it was in that
09:31 mindset of just an ingratitude, I couldn't see
09:36 all that the Lord had saved me from.
09:38 I couldn't see all that He had spared me from.
09:41 I couldn't see past my anger, past the resentment,
09:43 past the pain and it was in that mindset that I began to date.
09:47 It was in that mindset that I began to experiment
09:51 sexually and I made many mistakes
09:56 that were just extremely regrettable.
09:59 What's phenomenal and so reflective
10:05 of who the Lord really is though,
10:07 is that He didn't leave me there.
10:09 He remembered me in my darkness.
10:13 And, He came for me, He rescued me.
10:16 You had asked me earlier what my favorite verse was,
10:19 and one of them is Micah 7:8 where it says that,
10:24 "Do not rejoice over me my enemy, when I fall, I will rise"
10:29 I know that verse... When I sit in darkness,
10:31 the Lord will be a light to me."
10:33 And that is genuinely true of my experience,
10:37 my relationship with the Lord.
10:39 So He was with you in the darkness of the womb,
10:43 and He brought you out! He rescued me again.
10:45 And He was with you in the darkness from 8 and onward,
10:50 and even before that and you know that no matter
10:53 what you've been through, He's been there. Absolutely!
10:56 And that's an important message for the world...
10:58 is that God doesn't leave us very easily... Yes, absolutely.
11:03 And it was after I came back to the Lord that
11:07 my mother actually had passed on some information about
11:10 the Sabbath day; I was raised in a Sunday-keeping church,
11:13 and had never really studied the Sabbath day,
11:18 and when she gave me that information,
11:20 I really began to study it and read up on it.
11:23 And as I did, I just became convinced that
11:26 I needed to keep Sabbath.
11:28 And so, I actually started worshipping in a
11:32 Messianic Synagogue which was a tremendous amount of fun
11:35 because there's a lot of celebration there,
11:37 in the singing and the love, the love of the Word.
11:42 So that's a Jewish congregation that believes in Jesus... Yes
11:46 I have a Jewish background, not very secular,
11:48 but became a believer when I was 20 years old.
11:51 And I loved it, I absolutely loved it.
11:54 But I was still seeking in terms of where my ultimate
12:00 church home would be.
12:01 And my mom, actually, had suggested,
12:03 "Why don't you consider the Seventh-day Adventist Church?"
12:06 And I said, "Okay," so I went to a couple;
12:11 I was in law school at the time, and I started searching
12:13 around when I was in Virginia Beach, up there.
12:16 And I started attending the "Chesapeake Church."
12:21 "Chesapeake Seventh-day Adventist Church"
12:22 in Virginia Beach, and I fell in love with the church,
12:26 and the people there.
12:27 They were real - just like me.
12:31 They were working out their salvation - just like I was,
12:36 but they were REAL in terms that they loved the Lord.
12:41 And they were committed to Him and they wanted to
12:45 spend forever with Him, and they just embraced me.
12:48 It was phenomenal the way that they literally
12:51 just embraced me.
12:53 Was it you and your mom going to the church?
12:54 No, I was in Virginia, yes, so she was still in Georgia,
12:57 and I was just going on my own.
13:00 She was attending church down in Georgia.
13:05 When I... I studied for about 1-1/2 years while I was in
13:09 law school... just I began just soaking up all of the different
13:13 information about - just the word and had really
13:21 became convinced that this is where I needed to be,
13:25 the Seventh-day Adventist Church.
13:26 And how long ago was that, what year are we talking about?
13:28 That was about 2009, I was just about to finish law school.
13:34 One afternoon, I had wondered what the
13:38 church's position on abortion was.
13:40 I had no ever actually looked or investigated it at all.
13:44 And when I read what the position was,
13:49 I really struggled.
13:52 There were inconsistencies there that I really
13:56 struggled with, given my background, given my heart
14:00 for the unborn; given my desire to see our church
14:04 be one that magnifies the Lord and glorifies the Lord
14:08 is the standard bearer in every possible way.
14:12 And did you have any kind of a ministry for the unborn
14:17 or for the value of life or anything like that prior to
14:20 your checking out the Adventists?
14:22 No, no not at all.
14:24 I was just a law student and I was thinking about the bar,
14:26 I need to pass it to become a lawyer.
14:29 And you wanted to know Jesus better? Yes, yes!
14:31 And you learned about the Sabbath, and you showed up,
14:33 you liked the people, and loved the people
14:35 I did, I loved the people. Yes
14:37 This though, I really sort of had a crisis of faith
14:41 because I loved this church, I knew that it was like
14:44 coming home and if I couldn't be a part of this church,
14:49 there really wasn't anywhere else for me to go.
14:51 You're a member of the Adventist Church now. Yes
14:53 Now, were you going through the struggle before
14:55 you became a member or after you became a member? Yes
14:57 Before I became a member, yes.
15:00 So this was a struggle for you to choose to continue
15:04 to go forward and to be a member. Yes
15:07 Because you found out that there are, I think, probably
15:10 the way to say would be, there are some pro-choice
15:13 elements within the church.
15:15 How strong they are, I don't know.
15:17 I've been researching this topic for some time,
15:20 and I'm sure there's a lot of people, as in any church,
15:23 you know, it's a mixture of different people
15:26 feeling different ways, but you discovered
15:29 that there was a pro-choice element,
15:31 and you wrestled with that.
15:32 I did, yes.
15:35 My last Sabbath in Virginia Beach,
15:37 before I was about to go back to Georgia
15:39 to study for the bar, there was a visiting couple
15:42 who was at church, and over Sabbath potluck,
15:45 I was just explaining my dilemma really seeking out
15:48 counsel from various people, and the wife of the
15:54 couple said, "You don't not join, you join,
15:58 and you seek to change it."
16:02 That's good advice. Absolutely!
16:04 I think that's great advice.
16:05 And in September of 2010, that year,
16:07 I became a member of the Adventist Church,
16:09 and the next year, early 2011, the "Mafgia" began.
16:15 Okay, now tell us more, "Mafgia." Yeah Mafgia.
16:19 Mafgia is a Hebrew word and it means, "intercessor."
16:23 And it comes from the verse, Isaiah 59:16.
16:26 Okay, I'm going to read that verse, unless you want to
16:28 read it - unless you have it. Oh, go ahead.
16:30 You can keep talking about it and I'll find it.
16:31 Isaiah what - 59:16, 59:16 okay.
16:36 All right let's see... 59:16, it's talking about God looking
16:41 down on the earth. He saw that there was no man,
16:45 and wondered that there was no intercessor.
16:48 Therefore, His own arm brought salvation for Him
16:51 and His own righteousness, it sustained Him. Yes
16:54 So that's your motto verse. Yes, yes.
16:57 And so "Mafgia," that comes from.. is it "gia?" "Maf-gee-a"
17:01 "Mafgia" and that's from the word "intercessor"
17:03 right here in this text... Intercessor right there. Okay
17:05 We are committed as an organization to interceding
17:09 for the value, for the sanctity of human life
17:11 from conception to natural death.
17:13 From our very beginning to natural death.
17:15 And we're also committed to interceding as you've
17:18 heard in Dianne's story, for the reconciliation
17:21 and redemption for women and for men
17:24 who have experienced the tragedy of an abortion.
17:27 It's very much a holistic view.
17:31 We don't just think the unborn is valuable,
17:34 or just think the woman in crisis is valuable,
17:37 we think life, human life, all of humanity
17:41 bears the image of the Lord, and are extremely valuable
17:44 as established by the Lord.
17:46 And so that is truly who we are seeking
17:48 to reach and minister to.
17:50 And we'll get into this more later.
17:52 We have 10 more programs to do,
17:55 and we're going to get into one of the biggest issues
17:57 from what I've observed, and just in the last
17:59 few months I've been studying this and that is when is
18:01 a person a person?
18:04 There is conception to birth, and there are some
18:08 that believe that as you're developing, you're really not
18:11 fully a person yet until you take a breath when you come out.
18:16 And there are certain verses that are quoted to
18:20 support that and we'll look at that.
18:21 We'll look at those verses because this really...
18:23 I mean, this is a big issue. Yes
18:25 Was it really you... Were you you only when you
18:29 popped out? Or were you you when
18:32 you were first conceived?
18:34 That's part of the controversy that we'll have to
18:37 explore... Yes but go on...
18:40 Well what's been really incredible is the impact.
18:43 Since Mafgia began, the response has been profound,
18:49 and the themes that we've encountered...
18:51 I encountered in the beginning and then now that Dianne
18:53 has come onboard as my partner in ministry.
18:56 The themes that we've encountered together
18:57 have been tremendous.
19:00 The first would be the frequency of abortion.
19:03 The number of abortions that are happening;
19:06 women are experiencing;
19:07 statistically, we know that's true, but literally
19:10 every single time, I would say virtually every single time
19:13 I've spoken about this, and all of the audiences
19:17 have been church audiences.
19:19 We haven't spoken in secular environments,
19:21 or just secular audiences.
19:23 Woman, after woman, after woman, after woman has had an abortion,
19:27 and we see it's happening generationally
19:30 where a woman and her mother or daughters
19:33 will have had an abortion.
19:35 It's happening within family and extended family unit
19:38 where a woman and her sister and cousin and aunt
19:41 will have also had an abortion.
19:43 The frequency of abortion, the way that it's affecting
19:47 women is phenomenal.
19:49 Statistically, it's over one-third of all women will have
19:57 experienced an abortion by the time she reaches age 45,
20:00 and that's in the church,
20:01 and out of the church, that's all churches.
20:03 It's not specific to denomination.
20:04 And Dianne mentioned the statistics,
20:06 she, based on her research,
20:07 and I'm assuming yours, she said,
20:09 "Somewhere around 45 million abortions are occurring
20:13 worldwide."
20:14 She mentioned that since 1973 to 2011,
20:18 it's approximately 53 million and they were speculating
20:21 based on the numbers that by today,
20:23 it's somewhere around 57 million,
20:25 but that's just in the United States.
20:27 And you look at around the world and we're
20:30 I mean, we're dealing with a topic that is just incredible,
20:35 and I have children and that's another reason
20:38 why I wanted to be a part of this series,
20:41 and wanted to learn about it,
20:42 it's because I love kids.
20:44 I just really... I love Abby, I love Seth,
20:46 and there's so much to this that I think
20:50 it's worth taking it out of the closet,
20:54 and looking at it and going deeper into the Bible
20:57 to say what does the Bible say and listen to
21:00 stories like yours... it's incredible. Right
21:02 The second thing that we've seen is,
21:04 we've actually had a lot of people really
21:06 wonder why isn't it talked about more
21:09 when it's affecting so many people,
21:11 why aren't resources there; why is it something that
21:15 we're not dealing with?
21:16 And that there's been so much gratitude expressing
21:21 "thank you, thank you, I'm so glad someone - finally."
21:25 And that's been just incredibly profound for us,
21:29 as a ministry team.
21:31 The third theme that we've really seen is the
21:34 condemnation and shame that people are carrying
21:38 10, 20, 30 years later, when they haven't found
21:42 freedom and forgiveness at the cross.
21:45 And, that is not the way we were meant to live.
21:48 The Lord died to set us free so that we could experience
21:53 freedom and life and wholeness here.
21:56 And, we believe that He died so that we could walk
22:01 in His redemptive grace.
22:03 The question is: "Who is going to reach these people?"
22:06 Well, that's us, that's our job.
22:10 And if we're not speaking, who is going to speak to them
22:15 because the world is ready and waiting to speak to them.
22:19 And isn't it that it's the mission of God's people
22:23 to try to help people to know Jesus,
22:26 and to deal with the issues that are deep in their hearts
22:29 where they are hurting and if you have 57 million in America,
22:34 and 45 million around the world every year,
22:38 there is just a huge, I don't know exactly what the word is,
22:43 it's not an untapped resource, it's a vast pool
22:49 of pain that needs to be reached out to
22:54 with loving hands and compassionate hearts.
22:57 And that's what you're doing, that's what your life is about.
23:00 You have a life, you're thankful that you're alive,
23:03 and you want to help people as much as possible
23:05 and that's what we want to do too, that's what
23:06 "White Horse Media" is all about ...that's why you're here.
23:08 Well and you know, the primary difference between
23:11 my story and Dianne's story, is that people believe,
23:13 not just in my value, but in the value of my mother.
23:16 They believed in her value as a woman in crisis.
23:20 And, it was through their intercession,
23:24 through their pleading that my life was spared.
23:26 And that's what we have the opportunity to do,
23:28 not just to intercede for the life of the child,
23:31 not just to intercede for the life of the woman,
23:33 but to intercede for both.
23:35 That's why we're seeking or that's why we're called
23:40 to share what is true.
23:41 We're all equal at the foot of the Cross,
23:43 every single one of us, and we're called
23:46 to seek out truth and share what is true
23:48 so that others can be set free.
23:50 I'm set free because of the truth that the Lord
23:53 came to die and set me free, that's what sets all of us free.
23:56 And, that's what we have the opportunity to do through
24:01 this message - to point people back to the cross.
24:03 So when you travel, when you and Dianne get speaking
24:05 invitations, which are increasing,
24:08 sounds like you're getting more and more opportunities,
24:09 you're getting just a lot of stories, aren't you? Yes
24:12 People are coming out, it's almost like a dam is
24:15 being broken and like in the days of Noah,
24:18 it says the windows of heaven were opened and the water
24:22 came down... and in this sense,
24:24 it seems like there's a crack and there's an opening
24:27 and the people are coming to you saying...
24:32 "We appreciate that you are willing to talk about
24:35 this taboo subject." Yes
24:38 Well and the stories that we hear are heartbreaking.
24:41 I mean, they are just devastating,
24:43 especially when you consider that the pain
24:45 they're holding on to is decades later...
24:48 Just like in Dianne's story.
24:49 That's not just unique to her story,
24:52 it's really quite typical when an abortion happens
24:55 at a very young age and yet freedom and forgiveness
24:57 isn't found until decades later.
25:00 That's not the way we were meant to live on earth.
25:02 And why do you think there has been such a silence
25:08 on this topic, as far as ministry goes.
25:13 Why do you think that is?
25:15 Well, some people, perhaps they don't know how to
25:17 approach the issue; maybe some people are
25:19 truly afraid of offending a woman who is in that situation.
25:23 Maybe some people really aren't sure how
25:25 they would handle the situation if they were confronted with it.
25:28 I think there are quite a few motivations and undercurrents
25:31 that are at play there.
25:33 What I do know - is that the Lord has told us
25:36 to lift up our voice for women,
25:39 and to encourage everyone to embrace this message,
25:45 women in crisis, men in crisis, parents, pastors, doctors,
25:49 that we would all be honest before the Lord about our value,
25:53 and about our response as believers
25:56 in a situation like this.
25:57 And so you're hoping and praying that this will continue
25:59 to just open up more and more and you'll be able to reach
26:03 out to as many people as possible...
26:04 That's what your book is about,
26:06 that's what your ministry is about,
26:08 and I'm just... I'm in awe; I had no real interest in
26:13 getting into this topic at first when I first
26:15 heard about it, but then as time went on,
26:17 God began to work on me and just impressed me
26:20 that this is something that is really, really important
26:24 to Him and to people.
26:25 It shouldn't just be a side message.
26:29 So I think I'll line this up with the verse that is
26:34 the motto of "Mafgia Ministry" which is in Isaiah 59:15-16
26:42 It says, "The Lord saw it, and it displeased Him
26:46 that there was no justice.
26:48 He saw that there was no man and wondered
26:53 that there was no intercessor; therefore, His own arm
26:56 brought salvation for Him and His own righteousness
26:59 it sustained Him."
27:01 We believe that the time has come for God's arm to
27:05 reach out into the world on this issue
27:07 to help people on this issue.
27:10 And, we invite you to join us as intercessors
27:12 for the church, for people in the world, for everybody
27:15 that God will reveal His love in this crisis.
27:19 Dianne Wagner and Antionette Duck
27:21 share a powerful life-changing information in this
27:24 13-part series, "The Abortion Controversy"
27:27 To order this 6-1/2 hour DVD set for only $34.95,
27:32 call: 1-800-782-4253
27:39 Or, you can write to the following:
27:45 Or order online: www.whitehorsemedia.com
27:51 If you have been blessed by today's program,
27:54 and would like to help White Horse Media
27:56 with your financial support, you can call our
27:58 toll free number listed on the screen,
28:00 or donate online at whitehorsemedia.com
28:03 We solicit your prayers for our ministry
28:06 and we thank you for any gift large or small
28:09 to help us reach people with the gospel.


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Revised 2015-08-26