3ABN Today

Personal Testimony

Three Angels Broadcasting Network

Program transcript

Participants: Danny Shelton & Yvonne Lewis (Host), John & Angie Lomacang

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Series Code: TDY

Program Code: TDY016002A


09:59 I was not an illegitimate child but I had illegitimate parents
10:03 'cause I didn't do anything.
10:05 That's good. But I just showed up.
10:06 That's good, you just showed up.
10:07 I just showed up. Yeah.
10:09 And the Lord is so gracious that when He saw the journey
10:13 that I was about to take, we've talked about this.
10:17 Excuse me, I keep saying we because we have that
10:19 open communication all the time.
10:20 We talk about our lives together.
10:22 And I can't wait to get to her.
10:23 But it's gonna be amazing.
10:25 But I look back and say before I had to experience
10:30 the traumas of a abandoned child,
10:33 'cause my mom and dad abandoned me,
10:35 left me at a babysitter.
10:36 And to be more specific, at three months old,
10:39 I was left at a babysitter.
10:40 My sister was only three years old.
10:42 They walked away, never came back.
10:44 And when I wrote the book and I'll talk about that later,
10:47 the hardest thing was to look back on
10:49 how I began and where I am today.
10:52 So the Lord allowed me to be in a home
10:55 of an Adventist lady.
10:58 Christian.
10:59 Christian Adventist lady and she became my anchor
11:03 that developed and formed much of my character today
11:07 and I don't believe I would be who I am today
11:09 had it not been for that, God stepped in,
11:12 do you know there is a song I wrote
11:15 on one of my projects called "If He Only Knew."
11:17 You know, "Soft and so small, yet,
11:19 he would call for love to come his way.
11:21 He looked at the eyes of his life
11:23 hoping love was there to stay
11:25 but if he only knew that roads would part,
11:28 you could hear him say."
11:30 And so, I didn't know
11:32 anything about mom and dad not being there
11:34 so when I got to the point of consciously
11:36 understanding my world,
11:37 I had a mom and dad that were there.
11:39 My mama was 50 and papa, the man who raised me,
11:44 Mr. George Haynes and Carmen Haynes,
11:46 Trinidad and Barbados, they were from.
11:48 He was from Barbados, she was from Trinidad.
11:50 He was 49 years old when he decided to raise
11:53 this three-moth old child.
11:54 She was 50.
11:55 So how many people would put their lives
11:57 in that kind of place at that advanced stage
12:02 to raise a three-month old and three-year old.
12:05 Absolutely.
12:07 And so that was a tremendous blessing.
12:08 So the beauty of John's story is that people can say,
12:12 well, you know, you are a Christian because,
12:15 you know, you were born
12:17 with the silver spoon in your mouth
12:18 and you had wonderful parents and you were the,
12:21 you know, raised by Christians and in your case,
12:25 you came into the world with a great disadvantage.
12:27 Two parents who didn't really want you.
12:28 Right.
12:30 I mean, that's you got to deal,
12:31 you have to deal with that the rest of your life,
12:33 your entire life.
12:34 I'm sure that that still comes up from time to time
12:38 and things that you do,
12:39 the way you think, it has to come up.
12:42 And somehow young people turn that on themselves.
12:46 "What about me, I must have not been lovable."
12:49 Three-months old, you are nothing but loveable.
12:52 So as you said, it's your parents
12:54 who were illegitimate, not you.
12:55 That's right.
12:57 But coming from that,
12:58 then to see you today traveling around the world,
13:01 balanced in your theology, you know,
13:03 which is, you know, I hate to say,
13:07 it's almost commodity today,
13:10 even in our church to people who are very,
13:12 speakers who are balanced, not afraid to give the truth,
13:15 we're giving it but we give it with love.
13:17 Somebody who is marriage counselor,
13:19 somebody who is literally sang with Heritage Singers,
13:22 travels around the world singing, you preach, you teach
13:25 and plays basketball very well too.
13:27 But all of those things, it is ripe old age now.
13:30 He's still out there showing up
13:32 the young kids on Tuesday nights.
13:33 I know I'm a witness to it all.
13:35 But you know, to see God bring you
13:38 from where the devil wanted to destroy you,
13:41 he wanted to destroy you. Oh, yeah.
13:42 And then God said, "No, I've come to give you life
13:44 and give it more abundantly."
13:46 That's right.
13:47 So now we want to hold it right there for you
13:50 and we want to go back to Angie.
13:53 Angie, where were you born and tell us about
13:55 your background, your heritage?
13:57 Okay.
13:58 I was born in a place called Derby, England.
14:00 It's in Midlands. Okay.
14:02 English. She's British.
14:05 She's British. Yeah.
14:06 Okay.
14:08 I was born in England, as a matter of fact,
14:09 I went to get a, as I was at the doctor's office yesterday
14:11 and the lady looked at my paper work,
14:14 she said, "Oh, you're born in England."
14:15 I said, "Yeah."
14:17 She said, "What are you doing here?"
14:19 Living. Yeah.
14:21 I said, "Well, I left when I was just a little girl."
14:24 But anyway, my mom and dad, they had eight children
14:28 and I'm the youngest of eight.
14:29 Okay.
14:30 Five were born in Jamaica, and the last three,
14:33 Cliff, Lecie and I were born in England.
14:37 And that's pretty,
14:40 after my father died, we left...
14:43 How old were you then about, when your father died?
14:48 I was three. Okay.
14:49 Yeah. All right.
14:50 I was three years old, just...
14:52 So you don't have too many memories of your father.
14:54 So had single mother. Yeah, yeah.
14:56 One mother, one father all of us.
14:58 Wonderful mother.
14:59 We all got to know and love ourselves
15:01 around her for so many years.
15:02 Wonderful mother. She taught us.
15:03 So you left England, you went to Jamaica?
15:05 No, no.
15:07 My mother's sister lived in New York.
15:10 Okay. And we went to New York.
15:13 You went to New York.
15:14 Yeah. Okay.
15:15 So we, after my father died, we all left like two at a time
15:19 because there's too many of us to leave all at once.
15:21 So we at different years, one left,
15:25 two of them left early and then another three with my mom
15:28 and then the other three.
15:29 So we left in pieces I would say.
15:32 So anyway, we moved to Brooklyn.
15:33 My aunt owned a eight, eight family, yeah,
15:39 house in Brooklyn.
15:40 Oh, wow. Yeah.
15:41 She owned it and we all lived in that house and...
15:46 And was your mom a Christian at that point?
15:47 She was an Adventist, a wonderful, loved the Lord.
15:51 She taught us how to keep yourself as a young lady,
15:56 how to carry yourself, how to, how to pray
16:01 and I always saw my mother praying.
16:04 So I love that and so I got that from her,
16:07 watching her pray and that's why I'm always praying
16:09 for this man next to me.
16:10 That's right.
16:12 How did you meet John?
16:13 Oh, that's nice. Wow.
16:15 We could both tell the story. You start.
16:16 Me?
16:18 Yeah, sure. Okay.
16:19 We're used to hearing him. We want to hear you.
16:21 There you go. Okay, okay.
16:22 Let's see.
16:23 Here we are in a, I'm in Brooklyn
16:25 and we went to the same church, Bethel Church.
16:28 And all, 'cause I came to this country
16:31 when I was just seven and we went to that church so did he.
16:34 But we didn't know each other then.
16:36 We went up in the same church but you know,
16:38 Bethel was huge, 1200 members.
16:40 Big church and so one Sabbath afternoon,
16:44 I saw this guy and I said to, I saw him and so,
16:48 I said to my friend. I was about 16.
16:50 And I said to my friend, "Who's that guy over there?
16:53 Oh, oh.
16:54 And he says, "His name is John," Stop it.
16:57 And he had afro, pretty curly afro, big afro,
17:03 he had a dungaree, a jeans jacket
17:05 and like a little bag on his shoulder and I said,
17:08 I want to meet him.
17:09 And I said, oh, I can't wait to meet him.
17:13 So Chris introduced me to him.
17:14 And...
17:16 Let me tell the other side of that.
17:17 Okay. Go ahead.
17:18 'Cause this is really funny.
17:20 We'll make sure we get a picture up with that afro
17:21 and we'll make sure we get that.
17:24 And so when we,
17:27 so this friend, we had mutual friend named Chris.
17:29 The context of that, I had been looking at her
17:31 for since I started hitting teenage years,
17:34 maybe about three years earlier and I thought,
17:36 "Don't even try it 'cause she ain't gonna give you
17:38 the time or day.
17:39 You're knucklehead, she's too fine."
17:41 And you look at both of her sisters, you know,
17:43 she has hazel eyes, her sister blue eyes
17:45 and they always came to church.
17:46 It was during the era Yvonne
17:48 where girls are wearing the maxi dresses.
17:49 Okay.
17:50 And they always come to church looking like queens.
17:52 She and her sister hook them up like something royal.
17:54 So they come to church, her older sister,
17:56 so they come to church and guys like,
17:58 "Whoa, did you see Lecie in there?
18:00 I don't even know their names.
18:01 So when her friend said, "Hey, this girl wants to meet you."
18:04 I said, "Well, who?" He said, "Her"
18:05 I said, "Yeah, right." Yeah, really.
18:08 And he said, "No, really, seriously.
18:10 She does."
18:11 So it was like a major butterfly moment for me
18:15 because she was, is, still today...
18:18 Fine. Fine.
18:20 Cute and young and cheerful and so you know, 16 years old,
18:23 it's like girls in their prime, and but go ahead
18:27 and take it from there.
18:28 Oh, okay.
18:30 So anyway, we met.
18:33 But my cousin liked him. Oh, okay.
18:36 The cousin that introduced you?
18:37 No.
18:39 It's the guy who introduced us but I was with my cousin.
18:40 But she is really flirty. She liked him.
18:42 I'm like and she always got all the guys
18:44 'cause she had that real nice shape.
18:46 She always got all the guys.
18:49 And I'm like "how dare she?"
18:50 I didn't notice.
18:52 Anyway she just didn't get anywhere.
18:56 That's right. Yeah.
18:57 So we connected and but I had five brothers he really,
19:02 I wasn't allowed to date. She had five Jamaican brothers.
19:06 There's a difference altogether.
19:07 Five brothers and five Jamaican brothers.
19:09 It's a different story.
19:11 And they protected her like a Fort Knox.
19:13 Oh, I bet. I don't blame them.
19:15 I don't blame them either because I look back
19:16 and I think, "Why are they tripping like that?"
19:18 But then now as I got older, I'd say, here I said,
19:21 "I would do the same thing."
19:22 I would really be the same.
19:24 But I just invite him over, the only way
19:26 he could come to my house is for worship
19:28 'cause I wasn't allowed to date.
19:30 My mom would always have Friday night worship and she says,
19:33 I said, "Mom, can I have a friend come over?'
19:35 And she says, "Who is it?
19:37 I said, "A guy."
19:39 And she says, "Okay, for worship only."
19:41 So he came over for worship. Yeah, that was smart.
19:43 Yeah.
19:44 So every Friday night my mom had family worship
19:47 and he would come over for worship.
19:49 Where were you spiritually at this time, John?
19:52 I was a mess. I was...
19:54 You, what, 16, 17, 18?
19:56 Sixteen when I first...
19:58 First met her.
19:59 He's probably about 17.
20:01 You started going to worship, you maybe 17,
20:02 where were you, spiritually?
20:03 I was worldly.
20:05 I was a partier, I was a gambler,
20:07 I was a pool hustler.
20:08 I was the guy that probably mothers in churches say,
20:12 "stay away from that young man. He is no good."
20:14 Now why were you going to church if you...?
20:16 Because, you know, I had the foundation.
20:19 There's a truth in the Bible
20:20 that I need to insert right here.
20:23 "Train up a child in a way he should go,
20:24 and when he is old, he will not depart from that?"
20:26 I want to add a caveat.
20:27 The lady raising me, she passed away when I was 13.
20:31 And, but the foundation she laid was so instilled in me
20:35 that even, I was on the basketball team
20:37 and the football team in high school.
20:39 Well, the football teams, they had their celebration,
20:42 were given out all the jackets
20:44 and the trophies on a Friday night.
20:45 She had already passed away.
20:47 There was no one to tell me not to go and I could not go.
20:50 I just couldn't go.
20:52 But the crazy thing about that is, I couldn't go to,
20:54 I would not go to the basketball game,
20:56 wouldn't go to the football dinner
20:58 but I'd go party instead.
21:00 So figure that out.
21:01 That's the confusion of worldliness.
21:03 So when we met, I was very much in the world.
21:06 Afraid of the Lord. Okay.
21:07 So what did you see in him?
21:08 Why weren't you looking for the clean cut guy with a,
21:12 you know, nice hair do and all that stuff, Angie?
21:14 What was you thinking?
21:16 Because, I had, in my mind, I knew who I wanted.
21:19 I had a guy in my mind who I wanted.
21:22 He fit the description.
21:23 He did. Okay.
21:24 So you knew beyond what you saw on the outside
21:28 that God had a plan for him.
21:30 Was that what you were thinking?
21:31 Yeah, well, yeah, actually it was.
21:34 I knew.
21:36 I'm like well, he would come to church sometimes
21:38 and I would see him and I'm like,
21:40 oh, he's nice looking.
21:41 He had the nice, I always wanted a guy
21:42 with the nice hair, nice curly hair.
21:45 And he had that real soft curls and I'm like,
21:47 and then tall so he fit every description in my mind.
21:51 That's why I wanted to meet him.
21:53 So he came over that Friday night for worship.
21:57 And all my brothers were watching him.
21:59 Except Cliff.
22:01 Cliff and I hit it off right away.
22:03 He tackled me right away and we were wrestling on the floor.
22:05 Yeah, the moment I met him.
22:07 All right, oh, yeah.
22:09 'Cause he was a joker.
22:10 Yeah, he was a joker.
22:12 So anyway, he came over and he was, you know,
22:17 he'd-- you'd be okay.
22:19 you'd be quiet. I was cool.
22:20 You were cool.
22:22 And I kept inviting him over,
22:23 inviting him over Friday nights.
22:25 One particular Friday night I said, my mother said, "John,
22:29 would you read the Scripture in the Bible?"
22:32 I can't remember what scripture it was.
22:34 Maybe Psalms 23, I don't know. This was him.
22:38 He opened the Bible, " The, the, Lo, Lord is, my, my,
22:42 shepherd, I, I...
22:45 and I'm like he can't read.
22:47 Beads of perspiration was pouring on the Bible.
22:49 I was nervous.
22:51 It's hard to get a devil to read a God's word.
22:52 Yeah.
22:54 I was just so, I was like,
22:55 "Don't have me reading the Bible."
22:56 I'm thinking about the party I got to go to later."
22:58 Have mercy.
23:00 What did your mom think of John as a date for you,
23:03 as a potential, as a suitor for you?
23:05 She liked him.
23:07 But she didn't see him as, me and him together
23:10 'cause I was too young.
23:11 I was 17 then.
23:13 We met at 16 but at 17, you know close to 18, okay.
23:17 Okay, 18 or 19, are you guys still together now,
23:20 you're old enough to start dating
23:22 and other than just worship.
23:24 Yeah.
23:25 Well, listen to what happened.
23:27 That Friday night...
23:29 Oh, yeah. Yeah, you forgot.
23:30 I kept inviting him over for worship,
23:33 and that one particular Friday night,
23:35 I said, "John, have you seen the book,
23:37 The Great Controversy?
23:39 He said, "Yeah, when mama was alive,"
23:41 I said, "Let's read it." He said, "Okay."
23:44 So we went, where did we go?
23:46 You want to get a chapter that would take you from the world
23:49 to Jesus in a heartbeat.
23:51 The first chapter we read was The Time of Trouble.
23:56 That will take you, "World is coming to an end.
23:59 The rivers are rolling backwards,
24:01 the mountains are quaking, fire coming down of heaven,
24:04 people running for their lives."
24:05 I'm thinking, "I'm on the wrong team."
24:09 And literally I broke down and cried that night.
24:12 I remember how old I was.
24:13 I was 19 at the time 'cause I just started,
24:15 I was working
24:16 at Bank of America at Wall Street.
24:17 Okay.
24:19 And earlier that day, this is the context of it,
24:20 earlier that day, somebody at work
24:22 who used to go to the same church
24:23 I went to moved to Miami, Florida and started a disco.
24:26 Remember those words, "The discotheque?"
24:28 Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.
24:29 And they said, we're looking for a disc jockey
24:31 and I was a really good disc jockey at the time.
24:32 They said, we're looking for a disc jockey
24:34 to be the person to lead out in our club.
24:37 All you have to do is say, yes,
24:39 we start you off with $500 a week.
24:41 This is in 1979.
24:43 Wow. That's a lot of money.
24:44 Start you up with $500 a week, we'll give you a place to stay,
24:46 we'll pay for you to come on down here.
24:48 All you have to do is say yes.
24:49 So the devil made it so sweet.
24:51 But the Lord impressed me, I said, "You know,
24:53 let me think about it.
24:55 I'll give you my answer on Monday.
24:57 That Friday night was when we read The Great Controversy.
25:00 And then the next chapter we read was about
25:02 the Second Coming of Christ.
25:04 And that Friday night I put down
25:06 my pool stick and my boom box.
25:09 And I traded it with Bible and The Great Controversy.
25:11 And on Monday morning, I went work with the Bible
25:13 and The Great Controversy,
25:15 hardly had any instruction on how to give Bible studies
25:18 but I was looking for people to give Bible studies
25:20 with on Monday morning.
25:21 Okay. My first Bible study.
25:23 So you had a conversion experience that Friday night.
25:26 That's right.
25:27 I bawled my eyes out, I mean, I literally knelt on the floor.
25:30 He knelt and we prayed together.
25:31 It went back to your foundation
25:33 because the same thing I noticed
25:35 when he said that he wouldn't go to the basketball
25:38 that's because you knew your mom had totally
25:40 disapproved of it.
25:42 Right. And she wouldn't be happy.
25:43 The other world she may not known about or been there so
25:46 you've justified but you did not want to disappoint her
25:49 'cause she had laid such a good foundation.
25:52 And so now you're reading this, you know it's true,
25:55 you know that that's what you've been taught.
25:57 And it kind of brings you then to repentance.
26:01 It was amazing and so that really opened the door.
26:04 We need to just back up a moment.
26:05 Sure.
26:06 Before that 'cause you used to go to all these parties
26:09 and I used to go to your house.
26:11 I remember that.
26:12 I used to, he lived on the third floor
26:14 and I used to take these pebbles
26:15 and throw it in on the window trying to hit the window
26:18 to wake him up.
26:19 The Sabbath morning.
26:21 Sabbath morning, sorry, Sabbath morning.
26:22 Yeah, Sabbath morning. Yeah.
26:24 To getting him to come to church.
26:25 Getting him come to church. 'Cause he'd be out all night.
26:26 And I was like, "Who is that?"
26:28 His father let me in the house finally.
26:31 He let me in and I said, "Hey, John, come on,
26:33 now you're going to church."
26:35 He said, I just got home
26:36 from a party at 4 this morning."
26:37 I said, "I don't care.
26:39 You're going to church with me."
26:40 So I pulled out his clothes and started pressing him
26:45 and I said, "Go shower."
26:46 And he went, showered and he came in the room,
26:49 I left the room so he could change and next thing I said,
26:52 come on we're going to church.
26:54 We went to church.
26:55 He sat in church and he slept.
26:57 His head was breaking, just sleeping.
27:00 I slept on Pastor C.A.'s sermon.
27:01 Now he sleeps on mine. Yeah.
27:05 You know what's interesting to me
27:07 as I listen to you is to see how God
27:10 at every juncture intervened like when your parents left,
27:15 but He provided other parents, you know,
27:19 and then provided, gave you a love in Angie
27:24 that just undergirds all that you do.
27:29 And to me, it's just, it's so bespeaks
27:32 of a loving God with a plan.
27:35 That's right. A plan for your life.
27:38 So though you might have felt abandoned,
27:40 you weren't abandoned because at every juncture God
27:42 had something for you.
27:44 Matter of fact, that's why the book
27:46 is called Abandoned But Not Alone.
27:49 And as of this interview where we're updating it.
27:54 I'm revamping it to bring it up to some new details
27:57 I want to add and then republish it.
27:59 But in this there is quote I want to share toward
28:01 the ending of the program.
28:02 But you know, before we were girlfriend and boyfriend,
28:06 her brothers were my brothers.
28:08 Her mom became my mom.
28:10 At a point where I had no mother,
28:12 and papa who raised me,
28:15 his wife had died in 1971 she died,
28:21 and so he kind of gave up on life
28:23 and was recluse at times
28:26 and looking for love and he got remarried.
28:27 So it was quite different.
28:30 So I just had no anchor.
28:31 And she became my new anchor in my life
28:35 and had a relationship with the Lord
28:36 that she wouldn't let me compromise.
28:39 That's the thing that was wonderful.
28:40 I never forgot this and I tell this in--
28:43 And this is a good message for the young people today.
28:45 You know, I still have it today.
28:48 It's a little cupid doll with a little red heart on it.
28:51 And she wrote in that, it had,
28:53 "I'll give you my heart
28:54 but you'll have to fight for the rest."
28:56 Okay. All right.
28:57 She said, I don't want anybody that's not in the church,
29:01 I don't want anybody that doesn't have the relationship
29:02 with the Lord.
29:04 And so at every inch of all,
29:05 like when I had a party one Friday night,
29:07 I was at the World Trade Center on 44th floor
29:09 disc jockeying and lo and behold,
29:11 through the dark room,
29:13 you know, I'm looking at the window,
29:14 they were all the way, through the dark room, this,
29:17 "Who is that?" "John."
29:18 "What? Who is that?"
29:20 "Hey, what are you doing here? How did you find out?"
29:23 I'm gonna look at the camera.
29:25 Guys, don't try to hide
29:28 'cause your girlfriend has connections to find out
29:31 where you are.
29:32 If you think she doesn't know, then you are fooling yourself.
29:36 So she shows up. She tracked you down, right.
29:38 She tracked me down.
29:39 I'm on the 44th floor on the World Trade Center.
29:40 "How did you find?"
29:42 She didn't even tell me, I never found out
29:43 how she found out but anyhow,
29:45 she said, "You know
29:46 it's Friday night is the Sabbath,
29:48 you should not be here.
29:50 This is wrong." Holy boldness.
29:51 That's all I could see.
29:53 I said, "Would you get out of here?
29:55 I'll be at church tomorrow. Just get out of here."
29:56 And I never forget.
29:57 I recall this, just one or two years ago I recall this,
30:00 one of my speakers started to smoke.
30:02 Okay.
30:04 And I thought, I looked back on that, Lord said,
30:06 "I could burn this thing down right now."
30:07 And He and His mercy and the very next day
30:11 I had to fulfill my end of the agreement.
30:13 I was at church.
30:15 And she would never let me not be at church.
30:18 And so...
30:20 But Angie, didn't you, I mean, growing up
30:22 everybody goes through spiritual struggles.
30:24 Was there a time in your life that you thought well,
30:26 maybe I don't want to be Adventist Christian.
30:29 Maybe I want to go out in the world
30:31 and try some of the things.
30:33 Was there ever a time in your life
30:34 that you wanted to go a different direction?
30:35 Yeah.
30:37 Actually, I used to go to the, I'm Jamaican,
30:41 the "reggae" parties.
30:42 We used to go with my cousins, yeah.
30:44 I did that.
30:45 And this is before John,
30:47 I used to do that and after that
30:49 I'm like there's nothing in this life.
30:51 Okay.
30:53 You know, I saw my friends and some of my cousins.
30:58 All they do is get drunk and I'm like,
31:01 I don't want this life. Okay.
31:03 And so, you always say, learn from other people's...
31:05 Learn from other people's mistake.
31:08 Don't repeat yourself.
31:10 And so I saw, what I said, I want the man that
31:14 would love the Lord more than me.
31:16 And if I could get John to do that, love the Lord,
31:19 then I got a good man.
31:21 Yeah. And that's what happened.
31:23 After a while he started taking over
31:25 our Friday night worship, after the conversion.
31:27 I started leading out.
31:29 He was leading out in the worships.
31:31 And then we got involved in prison ministry together
31:33 before we were married.
31:34 Her brother gave her a little car that only had a--
31:37 it didn't have reverse.
31:39 Only went forward. It only went forward.
31:41 Okay. That's good.
31:42 Isn't that amazing providentially?
31:44 Only going forward. I love it, going forward.
31:45 Blessings on the go. Forward.
31:48 Amen. All right.
31:50 And we go to prison ministry, we go to Sabbath school,
31:52 then we go 'cause church is so huge,
31:54 we go to Sabbath school.
31:55 You just get, you know better, you just get lost in the crowd.
31:57 So we got involved in prison ministry
31:59 all throughout New York, Rikers Island,
32:00 we go to prison ministry together
32:02 before we were married.
32:03 And it was her car and every time I got to tell her,
32:05 "This car only had forward so when we visit friends
32:09 and they say, well, "Goodnight."
32:10 We used to go outside, smile, we're waiting for them
32:12 to close the doors so we can push the car backward.
32:14 We always try to park it so that we could just drive out.
32:19 But sometimes, somebody, "man, they blocked us in."
32:22 We were waiting for people to leave so we could, okay,
32:24 you go and drive, I'll push it back and you pull over,
32:26 push it back you go over.
32:27 It was a small little Toyota.
32:29 I'll sit in and he'd push it back.
32:30 And thank the Lord it was old Toyotas that were tiny.
32:31 Yeah.
32:33 And they also had a spring in the seat.
32:34 Oh, man, I had three suits that spring in the seat
32:37 went through the car seat
32:38 and it tore my pants three times.
32:40 I had three suits, but, but that car was just,
32:43 it was a testimony of our lives going forward.
32:45 And we even said this.
32:47 We would always use it for prison ministry
32:48 and one day we decided to use it
32:50 to go to great adventure in way up in New Jersey.
32:52 And we said...
32:53 Amusement park.
32:55 Amusement park and that's the day it broke down
32:56 on the George Washington bridge
32:58 at the toll booth.
33:01 Oh, that's awful.
33:02 So we said the Lord did not intend
33:03 for this to be a pleasure car, only for ministry.
33:05 Absolutely.
33:06 Tell us a little bit, you mentioned earlier
33:09 that C.A. Murray, was of course,
33:12 is with 3ABN for many years now C.A. was your pastor.
33:15 My youth pastor. Back then.
33:17 What impact did he have on you?
33:18 Now was he aware that you were out
33:21 doing the party deal and disc jockeying
33:23 all that kind of stuff?
33:25 I mean, did he come down on you like Angie did?
33:28 Did he follow you to the, where you were and get on you?
33:30 How did deal with you as your pastor?
33:33 Well, we had so many young people in our church.
33:36 I mean, we had like 500 young people in our church.
33:38 It was like churches in New York
33:40 were packed with young people.
33:41 Yeah.
33:43 There are so many activities but the caveat was,
33:44 if you don't come to church, you can't play basketball.
33:46 Oh.
33:47 You cannot play basketball.
33:49 You can't be on the basketball team.
33:50 So he had that head dangling over us.
33:51 If you don't come to church, you are not playing basketball.
33:53 But he was our pastor.
33:55 He'd preached to us and our youth church
33:57 while he was there, had grown so large
34:00 that the senior pastor of the church,
34:01 Lord rest him now, I won't mention his name,
34:04 the youth church had grown so large that it became a threat
34:07 to the adult church.
34:08 And he decided to shut down the youth church
34:10 so that we could have a bigger adult service.
34:12 Oh, my. But Pastor C.A.
34:14 was a young man, he played basketball with us.
34:17 That's back in the day when he had his afro.
34:20 Oh, yeah, he did.
34:21 Yeah, he was a wonderful youth pastor.
34:24 Yeah, but he passed the ball.
34:26 He says, right?
34:27 Oh, he had a good shot.
34:28 Yeah, but he would pass.
34:30 He accuses John and me of not passing.
34:32 I don't know where that come from.
34:34 You don't win by passing.
34:36 He said, yeah, whoever puts the ball
34:38 in the hoop the most wins.
34:39 That's what my dad used to tell me.
34:41 But anyway, C.A. will pass, he actually will pass.
34:44 We will once in a while, John and I, we used to do,
34:47 we do a lot of shooting.
34:48 Let's head to another part of my life
34:50 'cause now that we got
34:51 this spiritual thing going together,
34:53 and I wanted to just say for the caveat, we met at 16,
34:56 dated for, off and on, off and on for nine years.
34:59 We broke up, got back together, broke up, got back together.
35:00 Both selfish. We were both selfish.
35:03 So for the young people that are listening to this program,
35:05 you know, we were selfish.
35:07 But I think one of the reasons to the success of our marriage
35:10 is the Lord gave us time to get all those selfish ways out
35:12 and still, through the course of growing up
35:16 as husband and wife,
35:18 every now and then we have the residue.
35:21 But we got baptized, remember Pastor James LaMar?
35:24 Oh, sure. Yes.
35:26 Well, we got baptized together at 19.
35:27 At 19.
35:29 At an evangelistic series at good old
35:30 tent meeting in Brooklyn.
35:32 And I never forget what one of our brothers said,
35:34 you remember what they said about us
35:35 getting baptized together?
35:37 Are you gonna get married?
35:38 What, are they planning to get married together?
35:39 And at that point we really didn't planned on that.
35:41 We weren't thinking about it.
35:43 But it was both of us had the spiritual kind of
35:45 "let's commit ourselves together."
35:46 Right. That's so good.
35:48 And that was really, really good
35:49 and we never planned on getting married.
35:50 Now, Yvonne, you, where were you in all of this?
35:52 Were you in New York?
35:53 I was in New York and in fact...
35:54 If you went to church, would you have gone to that church?
35:56 I did go to that church for a while.
35:58 Did you guys know each other then?
36:00 Did you know him back then?
36:01 You know, not really.
36:02 He went to--
36:04 my dad was the principal of Bethel School
36:05 when...
36:07 I have marks to prove it.
36:09 Your dad was his teacher?
36:11 He was his principal. Principal.
36:12 He was his principal. Oh, yeah.
36:14 Now he didn't whip you, did he back then?
36:16 Only once did Mr. Hodge do that.
36:18 What did he do it with?
36:20 We used to call it the wire.
36:23 He said, "Now Lomacang, we got to talk."
36:24 Any time when he said we have to talk,
36:27 we know we're in trouble. He was the principal.
36:31 He was the principal.
36:33 But he never whipped you, did he?
36:35 No. 'Cause she's a good girl.
36:38 And my sister was in John's class.
36:40 That's right, Gloria. So, my baby.
36:43 So she, she was in his class
36:45 and I was out of school by then.
36:49 I mean, I was...
36:50 Your little sister.
36:52 My little baby sister was in his class.
36:53 Binky. Binky.
36:54 But during these years what would that have been
36:56 when you are at 18, 19 years old, what years, 70s?
37:00 Seventy six, seventy seven, seventy eight around then.
37:02 Yeah, what were you doing in the 70s, 76, 77?
37:05 I had just started the music business.
37:07 So you weren't really going to church that much?
37:10 No. No.
37:11 No, I had left the church for about...
37:12 What's wrong with you all?
37:14 I know.
37:15 But you know in so doing,
37:18 and I don't recommend that anybody leave
37:20 and especially, oh, my goodness now
37:23 but I'm thankful
37:25 that the Lord brought me back.
37:27 Yeah.
37:29 So I'm not so happy that I left,
37:30 but I'm thankful that he brought me back
37:32 because while I was out there,
37:34 I appreciate so much more
37:37 the Lord and the whole Christian thing so much more.
37:42 One other things I've learned is that people say, well,
37:45 they went out and they did this, you did that,
37:48 she did this.
37:49 But those of us sitting in the church can be just as lost.
37:51 Absolutely. That's right.
37:53 'Cause we can be there every Sabbath and do take part
37:57 and do all the things that we think we're supposed to do
38:01 and still not have a relationship
38:03 with the Lord Jesus Christ.
38:04 We do it because we think we should and a lot of people
38:07 go to church, whether it's our church, Baptist Church,
38:09 'cause they don't want to be lost.
38:11 And so they say, well, I wanted to do,
38:13 "so the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak."
38:15 So no one can set any judgment of any one else.
38:19 But you guys were out there, you were there and you knew
38:21 when to come back and what you are coming back to.
38:24 That's right. Thankfully yes, yes.
38:26 Yeah.
38:27 With you two, what would you say,
38:31 'cause you've been married for all these years
38:33 and you're not just, you know,
38:34 you see people who are married and their,
38:38 it's kind of like the relationship
38:39 that you just were talking about with the Lord, Danny.
38:42 Okay. It's married in name only.
38:45 So yeah, this is my wife or this is my husband
38:48 but we don't do anything together.
38:50 You know, we just co-exist, we live in the same house
38:53 but you guys are a team.
38:56 What would you say, what are the secrets
39:00 to this kind of relationship, an optimal kind of marriage,
39:04 not just a marriage in name only?
39:06 Okay.
39:08 We have fun together, we pray together,
39:11 but we know how to have fun together.
39:13 We know how to laugh. Oh, good.
39:15 Every single day I get to laugh.
39:18 We know how to, you know
39:19 we don't just talk to each other.
39:21 We talk to each other. Yeah.
39:22 Okay.
39:24 Right?
39:25 Right, about everything. So great communication.
39:27 Communication is huge. Huge.
39:28 Open with each other. Open.
39:30 We go to the store together.
39:31 We share the same, you know, we go to shopping,
39:33 we share the same bank account.
39:34 We are everything as together.
39:36 That's right. Right.
39:37 It's like, it's not mine or hers.
39:39 Yeah.
39:40 How do you deal with conflict?
39:41 Who is the first one usually to apologize?
39:44 He is. He is.
39:47 I'm going to Matthew 5 that said,
39:49 "Blessed are the peacemakers."
39:51 Well, besides, he like to eat her cooking.
39:53 That's right.
39:54 That's probably has a little bit to do with it.
39:56 She could say, "John, I just
39:58 don't feel like cooking, today."
39:59 "I'm sorry, honey. I was wrong."
40:01 "I'm sorry."
40:03 Well, let me tell you this side of that.
40:04 I think that relationships without passion
40:05 is not really a relationship.
40:09 There are a lot of times people say, "Well, we never argue."
40:12 And my interpretation of that is one of you is brain dead.
40:17 Because you have to have differences of opinion
40:19 no matter how long you are together.
40:20 That's right.
40:21 Sometimes you know, we have this funny joke
40:23 we've been doing like last two years is that,
40:24 do you want-- I said,
40:26 "You're gonna pick the opposite, right?
40:27 And we joke about this.
40:28 And she said, "I see, you're thirsty?"
40:30 "No." You want to go on--?"
40:33 "No."
40:35 Then she says, "I want something to drink."
40:37 "But I asked you if you were thirsty?"
40:38 "But I'm thirsty now."
40:41 It is like, sure, that's fine.
40:43 Be on, let it be on your terms.
40:45 A lot of times people don't think
40:46 they had this individuality.
40:47 That's important.
40:49 So they lose themselves to please the other person.
40:51 Don't lose yourself. Exactly.
40:53 Because if I wanted to marry somebody exactly like me,
40:56 then one of us will be unnecessary.
40:58 That's good, that's good.
41:00 Now you don't want people to think exactly like you
41:03 at no point in your life
41:04 because you don't have a check in balance.
41:06 I sink, she doesn't.
41:08 You know sometimes she says, "Would you stop singing
41:10 and come and watch the show with me."
41:11 Hey, cool, you know.
41:14 And sure, you need that balance and so we have a lot of things
41:19 that, but I want to point, I want to go back a little bit
41:21 really quickly because as she talked about our conversion,
41:24 you know, after that point of that Friday night
41:28 awakening with God, I still partied.
41:32 And I still, it as a little bit of hesitation, "Okay, Lord,
41:35 I know I'm going to the wrong direction
41:37 but I hadn't given up the world yet."
41:39 I periodically partied or do house parties
41:41 or wedding parties or disc jockey in house clubs
41:44 and then along the way,
41:46 the Lord continued to battle with me and shortly,
41:48 little by little He would say to me, "No more."
41:52 And I'd say, "Okay, I got it."
41:53 And I remember going to a house party
41:55 on one Saturday night to somebody's place
41:58 who strangely enough and I say this in context,
42:01 partied together.
42:05 We had a whole lot of sinners in our church.
42:08 But praise God, we look back on them now
42:09 and they all come back to the Lord.
42:11 Amen.
42:12 You see, if young growing up, we can't argue with that.
42:14 A lot of people, they, they have to find their way.
42:16 Tell them what you used to do with the flyers.
42:18 And oh, this is terrible, God, thank the Lord for His mercy
42:21 because when I was a junior usher,
42:25 my time came to pass our bulletins,
42:27 I would put party flyers in the bulletins
42:31 for my friends so they'd know
42:32 where the party is after Sabbath.
42:34 Now if I was the Lord, I would have kill him
42:35 on aisle three or two.
42:37 But God was patient...
42:38 Have mercy. Yeah.
42:40 And...
42:41 Where the party was tonight and they would go to the party.
42:43 And they would go to the party, you know, celebrate,
42:45 you know, Kool and The Gang and all that stuff back then.
42:48 But our real turning point was when we had an accident
42:50 one Sunday, both in a car together.
42:52 It was when Hondas were small enough, were very, very small.
42:56 It was full of a sound equipment,
42:57 records and all.
42:58 And I said this statement which you got to be careful.
43:00 I said, "Okay, Lord, this is the last time."
43:02 They were hurt and he tried to kill us.
43:04 We had a terrible car accident with this Honda.
43:06 We both got injured
43:08 and I knew at that moment if we had died,
43:11 we both would have been lost.
43:13 At least that was my interpretation
43:14 and that was the last time.
43:16 I get rid of all my records,
43:17 covered everything that was disc jockey connected
43:19 and then our lives began to turn around.
43:21 She went to Oakwood. I waited till she came.
43:23 Even when she went to Oakwood, I waited.
43:25 I didn't date anybody.
43:27 We kept in communication back and forth.
43:30 We kept the communication back and forth.
43:32 And then we went to Oakwood together again in 1979.
43:38 We're kind of fast forwarding.
43:40 Yeah, go ahead.
43:41 And then in 1983, I got a, this is funny part, 1983,
43:45 after we dated for nine years,
43:47 her brother who is now deceased came to me in the kitchen
43:50 there in Monroe Street in Brooklyn
43:53 and he said, "How long are you gonna date my sister?
43:55 You're gonna marry her or what?"
43:57 And I thought, you know, he's kidding.
43:58 And he said, "How long are you gonna date my sister?
44:01 You're gonna marry her or what?"
44:02 He was serious. I was 25 years old.
44:04 And I'm 24 and I'm thinking, uh,
44:08 "Are you gonna marry her?"
44:09 "Yeah."
44:10 "When?"
44:12 "Next month."
44:13 We got married in 30 days.
44:15 Yes, we did.
44:16 He was like "You're gonna marry her
44:17 or you're gonna get."
44:19 And we got married in 30 days and the funny joke.
44:21 I'll tell this in concerts.
44:23 The joke is her brother proposed
44:24 and I accepted.
44:27 It's true.
44:29 Now let me give the folks at home
44:31 a little behind the scenes here.
44:33 The producer of this program today
44:35 is Pastor C.A. Murray that was his pastor.
44:39 Just few minutes ago
44:40 John said he used to take these flyers
44:43 and put in the church bulletins, right,
44:45 about parties.
44:46 On the teleprompter just came up,
44:47 it said, "Shame on you, Lomy."
44:53 C.A. is shaming you all these years.
44:55 That's something he just found out.
44:57 See I told you, you'd find out things today
44:59 we didn't already know about you.
45:01 That's pretty good.
45:03 Now we've only got about eight minutes left or so.
45:05 So what I want to do is we're gonna talk about
45:08 quickly about your ministry, about, we know you're pastor
45:12 and a lot of that but we want to find out about your music,
45:15 you have CDs, you've got the book
45:17 you've written and tell us
45:18 how you got into your music ministry.
45:21 In 1983, after leaving New York,
45:23 I got involved in the Christian talent search
45:25 and the Lord worked it out
45:26 that I came in among the top ten finalist.
45:28 While I was doing the concert one Saturday night
45:29 and her mom bought some tickets to a Heritage Singers' concert
45:33 in the Tupperware Auditorium in Kissimmee, Florida.
45:35 Her mother insisted, I said, "Mom,
45:39 I'm 75 miles away doing a concert."
45:41 She said, "You have to come, I bought tickets."
45:44 "Okay, we'll come after my concert."
45:46 So we got there at half time, just in time
45:49 for the announcement Max Mace,
45:51 director and founder of Heritage said,
45:52 "We're looking for a new tenor after the end of this season."
45:56 And so somebody turned to me as I was sitting in the audience,
45:59 he said, "John, you could do that."
46:01 So I felt, my voice is warmed up,
46:03 I auditioned and I remember the song,
46:05 Dying with a Broken Heart.
46:06 And I never knew what happened after that audition
46:08 but maybe about seven or eight months later,
46:10 we got a call to join the Heritage Singers.
46:12 Okay.
46:13 And Max Mace, I said, "But I'm married."
46:15 He said, "I wouldn't think of separating you two
46:16 and we both joined the Heritage Singers together.
46:18 We were married a year. We were married just a year.
46:20 In the first month, we went to 19 countries.
46:22 That's right.
46:24 So you were singing too, Ange?
46:25 Everyone ask that. Okay.
46:27 She was on the road
46:29 book keeper, did all the bank deposits,
46:30 all the record sales and you know,
46:32 they paid her the same thing that I got paid.
46:34 And it's beautiful.
46:36 And so we traveled the world together,
46:38 enjoyed that.
46:39 How many marriages would survive
46:41 if your wife is with you in your face everyday
46:44 for two years in a row?
46:45 Just a few feet apart.
46:47 Not a lot of relationships can endure that.
46:49 Yeah.
46:50 On the bus traveling, yeah.
46:52 You have to really like each other.
46:55 Not just love each other but like each other.
46:57 And we worked together twice too.
46:58 Oh, in New York we had two jobs together at the same company.
47:01 So going fast forward quickly,
47:03 in Heritage I met Doug Batchelor.
47:04 Oh, yeah. Pastor Doug Batchelor.
47:06 We became friends, after we left Heritage...
47:08 He was the pastor of the group, remember?
47:10 After we left Heritage, a year later
47:11 I got an invitation
47:13 from the Northern California Conference
47:14 to start evangelism with Pastor Doug Batchelor.
47:16 We moved from Florida and the details are in the book
47:19 as we, we release it.
47:20 And the Lord, our walk
47:22 from the last all of our marriage,
47:28 should I say them how long?
47:29 Sure.
47:31 Thirty two years.
47:32 Praise the Lord. Amen.
47:33 Our marriage has been a faith walk.
47:35 Oh, yeah.
47:36 To tell you the stories of the times
47:38 that we could have turned around
47:39 and God only showed us but what He wanted us to see,
47:42 to see if we trust Him to take up the rest of the way.
47:44 So and so from the Heritage Singers,
47:46 that's when the music ministry began,
47:49 but the first CD that I produced
47:51 was when I was with Doug Batchelor in 1999.
47:54 It's called Surrender.
47:55 That's a part of the first project.
47:56 We have Surrender, Never Alone, and The Call.
47:59 And those are three there.
48:01 They are actually, Surrender was the first,
48:03 Never Alone is the third in the picture.
48:05 That was the second one.
48:06 That's mostly my originals that go with the songs,
48:09 the chapters in the book.
48:10 And The Call was one I did when I was here at 3ABN.
48:14 And really, it talks about.
48:15 I came to the realization that there's a call on our lives
48:20 and so that's the name of that third CD and then,
48:24 so we've been here now, what year we got here?
48:27 Uh, 2003. 2003.
48:30 Wow. We've been here at 3ABN.
48:32 And we've grown up.
48:33 You know, I came here with black hair.
48:35 But let me just kind of left with white hair.
48:37 I was still coloring my hair back then.
48:39 It was a joke 'cause people, well,
48:42 this is a big controversy on the internet
48:43 and all around the world.
48:45 What would people say?
48:46 A man with the plastic hair. Plastic.
48:48 'Cause I've used black hair dye and shiny hair spray
48:51 and they said, "I think it's toupee, it's a hairpiece."
48:53 No this is real.
48:54 Everywhere we go, they always want to touch his hair.
48:56 So I've decided let it go grey
48:58 so we could get rid of that myth.
49:00 And-- but here we are ministering.
49:04 My wife also, when we came here,
49:07 the Lord called us to 3ABN, Danny,
49:09 and literally and I want to say this quickly.
49:11 When we left California, went to Iowa Missouri Conference,
49:15 after about nine months there, when we realized that
49:19 the vision that we had was not with the vision,
49:21 the vision that God had.
49:23 We sat down and I literally sat on the edge of my bed and said,
49:26 "Lord, what do you want us
49:27 to do with the rest of our lives?"
49:29 And two days later, Danny called me.
49:31 I didn't have that kind of relationship with him.
49:32 I didn't put out on the internet,
49:34 I didn't call anybody, I didn't make any phone calls
49:36 or letters, who needs help.
49:38 He called and said "We're building a new church
49:41 and your name came on our list.
49:43 Are you interested?"
49:44 And we've been friends. There you go.
49:47 I'm so grateful to Danny,
49:49 so grateful for allowing us to be a part of this ministry.
49:52 I'm thankful for you all.
49:53 You've been such a blessing, not only to the ministry,
49:56 but me personally for so many years.
49:59 And I just appreciate so much you guys' friendship
50:03 and as a pastoral team because you're actually a team.
50:07 She is a minister
50:09 as he is because she ministers to all of us
50:12 and what a great example of loving, caring people.
50:15 They have people at their house constantly.
50:17 I know 'cause we're some of those who go there.
50:20 We were there.
50:21 Most of the church, probably all the church
50:23 has been there sometime or other.
50:25 She kind of takes turns with all of us,
50:27 invites us over, a wonderful cook.
50:29 Everybody gets excited when we, you know,
50:30 we're going over there 'cause she can cook.
50:33 She is the vegetable scallop queen right there.
50:35 She knows how to do that so when I go over,
50:38 she'll usually make some of those for me.
50:41 But, John, tell us a little bit about the book.
50:43 It's about our life story together,
50:45 not just mine, but Angie's also
50:47 and because of the road together.
50:49 I want to just wind up with this statement
50:51 on the back of the book.
50:52 "When it was done, I didn't know how to end it."
50:53 But here is what I said, "My life is a miracle,
50:55 not because I've learned to adjust
50:57 but because I am a part of a divine plan.
50:59 I am moving upward and onward,
51:01 not because I've learned to scale the utmost heights
51:03 but because I know who's I am.
51:05 I choose not to fear life but to live it.
51:07 I look back not to lament but to remember.
51:09 I hold on not because I'm incapable,
51:11 but because I am wise.
51:13 I look at barriers as movable, problems as solvable,
51:15 heartache as healable,
51:16 and disappointment as temporary.
51:18 It is not confidence in myself that gives me hope,
51:20 it is Christ in me that is my hope.
51:23 The experiences I've had were not designed to break me
51:25 but to make me.
51:26 I am at peace because I know who I am.
51:28 If, in the midst of your circumstances you can see God,
51:31 you are on your way to wholeness.
51:33 If in the midst of your storms you can hear His voice,
51:34 you are on your way to peace.
51:37 To be abandoned is out of your control
51:39 but to think that you are alone is your choice."
51:43 That was great. That book is so good.
51:45 I read that book years ago and it's a page turner.
51:49 You don't want to put it down.
51:50 It's really a page turner. So it's really good.
51:52 Maybe folks at home,
51:54 they are used to send here at 3ABN
51:55 but do you have an address
51:57 if folks want to write because you've got CDs,
51:59 you got the books,
52:00 you've always got something new coming out,
52:03 maybe Bible studies, no telling what,
52:04 maybe new books in the works?
52:08 If you have an address...
52:10 3ABN carries.
52:11 You know 3ABN carries all of our CDs.
52:12 Sure.
52:14 So if you know the 3ABN address and phone number.
52:15 They can just get it through here.
52:17 Yes.
52:18 Get it through here. Okay.
52:19 PO Box 220, West Frankfort, Illinois, 62896.
52:21 There it is on the screen.
52:23 3ABN, PO Box 220, West Frankfort, Illinois, 62896.
52:29 And I would encourage you to get the book and read it.
52:31 I read it sometime ago but your music John
52:34 is such a blessing and God has gifted you.
52:36 Praise God.
52:38 You have a incredible voice because not everybody,
52:43 in fact, very few people who preach
52:46 as well as you do can keep you on the edge
52:48 of your seat preaching,
52:49 can keep you on the edge of your seat singing
52:52 and John really is one of the most talented preachers,
52:56 teachers, musician, singer and to get all
53:01 that in one package and to get him here,
53:03 somebody who loves the Lord, somebody who stays straight,
53:07 straight as the needle as they say to the pole,
53:09 straight there at the plumb line
53:11 and your theology has been such a blessing to 3ABN.
53:14 So I praise the Lord that you guys have chosen to be here
53:18 all of these years
53:19 and so literally not just brothers
53:22 in the church but brothers together.
53:25 And I appreciate brothers and sisters and I feel like
53:28 we're all family here.
53:29 So thank you for what you do for the cause of God.
53:32 We're gonna take a short break, we're gonna go to newsbreak.
53:35 We'll be back for closing thought.


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Revised 2021-09-18