Participants: Cheri Peters (Host), Asheley Woodruff
Series Code: CLR
Program Code: CLR000101B
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00:01 The following program discusses sensitive issues
00:03 related to addictive behavior. 00:04 Parents are cautioned that some material 00:06 may be too candid for younger children. 00:14 Welcome back. 00:16 Um, so you know, we were talking about before the break about, 00:18 you know, these kids growing up in these really crazy homes. 00:22 And when we become adults 00:24 we have all of this behavior that we just don't understand. 00:27 They desperate need to be normal, 00:29 not knowing how to be kind of in social settings 00:32 and we look fabulous, but we just don't know anything. 00:35 You know, what I-- And so it's really a kind of a crazy thing 00:38 because either we're going to go into recovery and heal 00:42 and literally look at all those issues 00:45 or we're going to just learn 00:47 how to mask it and walk through life. 00:49 And always being somewhat disconnected from ourselves 00:52 and using our addictions to give us comfort. 00:55 And so, you know, I want to say, Asheley, welcome to the program. 00:59 And I know that you understand a lot of what I just said. 01:04 Not only do you work with folks like that, 01:05 but you've been through it. 01:07 So tell us a little bit about yourself and-- 01:11 and I'd like to hear everything from child, 01:13 I guess, I like all the stuff. 01:15 Okay, all right. 01:16 Well, I was born in Georgia, 01:19 which is a good old conservative state and, 01:22 but to a single mom who got pregnant out of wedlock 01:25 and she was kind of run out of the church for that. 01:31 And so she didn't-- 01:32 'Cause at one time that was a big deal. 01:34 Yeah, it was a big deal at that time. 01:36 And, you know, she came from a very respectable family that, 01:39 you know, had a reputation 01:41 and here she was kind of breaking the social norm. 01:44 And my grandparents, God bless them. 01:47 They said, "You know, we don't care, 01:49 you know, we want to take care of you." 01:51 And so they took care of her while she was pregnant. 01:54 And my father, my biological father 01:58 kind of had the attitude of, "Well, I don't want any kids, 02:01 I've never had kids, 02:03 and I don't intend to be a dad now." 02:04 So you're on your own type of thing. 02:06 So he just left. He just left. 02:07 And so what I love about your grand--your grandparents 02:10 just because even for the church it's like, 02:12 nobody knew what to do with that, so they usually just said, 02:14 "You know, we're not gonna deal with that." 02:16 And even nowadays, we are a little bit more loving 02:20 'cause nobody wants a teen who are pregnant. 02:22 I mean, you know, 'cause all of the problems that come with that 02:24 and that's a harder life. 02:27 But I think the church right now is more accepting. 02:29 And so at that point, where your grandparents had 02:32 and God bless them as that you're still my daughter 02:35 and I love you, and we'll take care of you. 02:37 Yeah, and my grandmother says she got over the, 02:40 you know, the fear of like, 02:42 "Oh, you know, what's gonna happen with this kid? 02:44 What kind of life is this baby gonna have? 02:46 And start praying going, God let this child be healthy. 02:49 You know, she got passed and said, 02:50 "No, I've got to pray that this kid comes out healthy." 02:52 'Cause she's already got everything stacked against her. 02:55 So I was born, and my mom lived with my grandparents 03:00 and started turning her life around and it had been kind of, 03:03 I would say kind of wishy-washy. 03:05 She didn't really know what she was doing with her life. 03:08 And she decided she was gonna be a nurse 03:09 and applied to nursing school 03:11 and got into nursing school out in California. 03:13 Soon I was 18 months she moved out to California 03:16 and moved in with my great-grandmother, 03:18 so now grandmother's mother. 03:20 And so she started attending nursing school 03:22 and I would live with my great-grandmother 03:24 who would take care of me during the day. 03:26 And then she had this Chinese chest, 03:28 it's like, antique Chinese chest, 03:29 it's over a hundred years old 03:31 and I'd stand on it to look out the window 03:33 to see my mother coming up the road from school. 03:36 And just wait for her. And just wait for her. 03:37 And that was what I remember is 03:39 I don't have any idea what we did the rest of the day, 03:41 but I remember getting up on that chest, 03:42 look out the window and there were some construction going by, 03:46 so I'd count the cement trucks, kind of, 03:48 you know, I couldn't count, but I would count the cement trucks 03:50 and I knew that at a certain point in the day 03:52 my mom was gonna come home and I see her coming up the hill. 03:55 And so my early childhood was a lot of that, 04:00 just waiting for my mom to come home 'cause she was in school 04:03 and eventually my mother's parents 04:05 moved out to California also and we moved back in with them. 04:09 And so the first I would say, six years of my life 04:13 it was a lot of moving in with my grandparents 04:15 and then moving out of my grandparent's place 04:17 'cause my mom would want to try to see 04:19 if she could make it on her own for a while 04:20 and then it would just be too much 04:22 and so she moved back in with my grandparents. 04:25 So even though you were surrounded by people 04:27 that loved you, it still was that--still wasn't very stable 04:31 and it's like I don't know where I'm gonna be tonight 04:33 or where we're gonna live or what's gonna happen. 04:35 It was really weird for me 04:38 because it was like I knew I had this loving family, 04:41 but there was always somebody gone. 04:43 And if I was living with my mom by myself, 04:45 I was over out at a babysitters. 04:47 So as I never had my mother to myself 04:50 and it was like there is always 04:51 this part of me that was missing. 04:53 So when we moved back in with my grandparents again 04:57 it was just kind of just for a sense of relief 04:59 because, okay, now everything is stable 05:01 and it's gonna be, you know, this way. 05:02 And my grandmother is there 05:04 and then my mother comes home from nursing 05:06 and so we're all good. 05:08 And then-- I can trust this maybe. 05:09 Yeah, this is gonna-- this is gonna work. 05:11 And I started attending school 05:14 and I didn't realize that the stigma of being like 05:18 the fatherless child still is attached to me. 05:22 And so I would go to school 05:24 and the teachers would kind of treat me different, 05:28 but I didn't really know why. 05:29 And I didn't know what was different about me, 05:33 so I just kind of shrink in. 05:35 I became really shy. 05:36 And I can remember I was in class one day 05:39 and the teacher shuffled the tables around 05:41 and I was the one who had the odd table out 05:44 and she said, "Well, just go put your table 05:46 with whatever group of tables you want." 05:48 So I started to move my desk 05:50 and one of the girls piped up and said, 05:51 "Ashley, I will be your best friend, 05:52 if you promise not to sit with us." Oh. 05:55 And I was just kind of like I was stunned and it was like-- 05:58 Think I don't know what that means. 05:59 Well, no, I knew what it meant. 06:01 It meant that she didn't want me. Yeah. 06:03 And I'm seeing they're going I'm not wanted here. 06:07 And so I went just pushed my table over to any older group 06:10 and I'd just got in my head that 06:13 there was something wrong with me that people didn't want me. 06:17 And then when I was seven, 06:19 I--my mother decided she wanted to try being a single mom again 06:23 and so she moved us all the way out to New York City. And so-- 06:26 Away from grandparents, away from everything. 06:29 So, you know, and she hyped it up as this big adventure 06:32 and I was the kind of kid. 06:33 I was like, "Okay, mom, where you want to go? 06:35 Let's--what we're gonna do today type of thing 06:36 'cause we would always take off to new trips and stuff." 06:39 And she is like, "Well, we're gonna go to New York." 06:42 And I said, "Okay." 06:43 You know, and so we stopped 06:45 at all these neat places along the away, 06:46 Mount Rushmore and we stopped at the Grand Canyon, 06:49 and I freaked out because my mother 06:51 being my mom had to go 06:52 up to the edges of the Grand Canyon take photos 06:55 and I'm just in my head positive. 06:57 She's gonna fall over the side 06:58 and I'm gonna loose my mother, and I'm freaking out. 07:01 And she goes, "I will never ever 07:03 be able to go to the Grand Canyon again." 07:04 And I'm like, "No." You were so traumatized. 07:08 But, you know, for this little kid that says, 07:10 you know what, you were in my mind, 07:13 you were what and I need you. Yeah. 07:15 And you can't leave me. 07:16 Yeah, it was just-- it terrified me 07:18 that I'd be without her. Yeah. 07:19 So we get to New York, and I'm put into public school, 07:24 which I hadn't been in 07:25 and I'd been in a private school before that 07:27 and I was put into public school 07:29 and the teacher just I don't know what her issue was, 07:31 but she hated my guts. 07:32 I mean, literally I've heard of, 07:34 you know, teachers hating students 07:35 but this is, you know, she would look at me and she'd go, 07:38 "You're so stupid, you can't do anything right." 07:40 And she said, "Go use the dictionary 07:42 since you can't figure out what the definition of a word means." 07:45 And I'm like, "Well, how do I use a dictionary? 07:47 I'd never been around the dictionary. 07:50 It wasn't something that I flipped open naturally." 07:52 And she goes, "You're too stupid 07:54 to even know how to use the dictionary." Wow. And-- 07:56 And for an outrace kid. Yeah. 07:59 And that's what we were talking about earlier 08:01 is that we then try to make sense or try to figure it out 08:04 or we're not gonna ask for help anymore. 08:06 I mean, all of those things start to happen. Yeah. 08:08 And then we look stupid 'cause we don't know. 08:10 I need to ask you for help and yet I'm not going to. 08:13 Yeah, so I kind of closed in. 08:14 I just--I kind of caved in. 08:16 I was like there is something. 08:17 You know, I was like I didn't think I was stupid, 08:19 but it was like you hate me what did I do wrong. Right. 08:22 And so this just kind of kept going all the way through school 08:28 and I got to fourth grade and the teachers would be like, 08:33 "You're so stupid. You're so stupid." 08:34 And yet I would take my CTY test 08:38 and I get the scores back 08:39 and my scores were off the charts. 08:41 Like, they would put me at 99 percentile because they said, 08:43 "Well, we don't have a score for where you landed." 08:45 And I'm like, "Okay." 08:48 So obviously I'm not stupid, 08:50 but yet I've got my teachers turning around going, 08:53 you were the stupidest thing we've ever seen. 08:55 And like I forgot to bring-- I think it was my flute-- 08:59 I forgot to bring my flute over quarter thing for music one time 09:03 and the teacher is looking at me 09:05 and she goes, "I can't believe you forgot your flute. 09:06 How could you be so stupid to forget your flute?" 09:09 And I'm just like, "Well, I just didn't." 09:12 She goes, "Well, how do you expect 09:13 to get into college that way?" 09:15 And I looked at her I'm like, "Really?" 09:18 I'm in fourth grade and you're telling me, 09:20 I'm not gonna get into college 09:22 because I forgot my recorder today. 09:24 Okay, you're just-- 09:25 forget it, I don't care what you think anymore. 09:28 But, you know, just to stop right there and, 09:31 you know, kind of probably where I'm gonna go with this 09:33 is that at one point with the child that's been injured 09:37 is that realization and that kind of rebellion, 09:40 and that kind of, you know, almost sarcasm in our mind, 09:43 at least if we don't say it, 09:45 at least we're thinking it in our mind, is that not right. 09:47 That makes no sense. 09:49 And so you're saying about fourth grade. 09:51 You start to realize that. You know what? 09:54 That's crazy. It was. 09:55 It just--I could not wrap my head around, 09:57 having me for getting my recorder for one day, 09:59 it was gonna bar me from college. 10:01 It just didn't make sense to me. 10:03 And about that time too my mom had gotten married, 10:06 so to my step-dad who adopted me 10:09 and they got pregnant right after that, 10:11 so we had this really chaotic household, 10:14 at least from my perspective, it was chaotic. 10:16 Where I've got a brand new dad who I don't really know. 10:20 I think they dated about three months before they got married. 10:23 And then I have a brand new baby sister 10:25 who I just loved to death, I mean, she was like my doll, 10:28 I got to play with her. 10:30 And then my parents were fighting all the time 10:32 because they were trying to figure out 10:34 how to make a marriage work. 10:35 And they didn't really have the skills for that, 10:38 and so they were figuring out verbally 10:41 and so I'm sitting here and looking at the world's going, 10:43 what the heck happen? Right. 10:45 And there is a lot of anger building up inside me, 10:48 especially towards to my step-dad 10:49 'cause I saw him as like the problem. 10:52 He'd come in and everything just fell apart. 10:54 I mean, just I'd never been around violence before 10:57 and he was a violent man. 10:59 And like I forgot to do my math homework one day 11:02 and he thought I lied about it, and it wasn't that I lied, 11:05 I just literally forgot about it 11:07 and I had these stacks of shelves 11:09 in my room with all my toys and games, 11:10 and he just took them and tipped them over. 11:12 Just throw them over and he said, 11:13 "That's what you get for being a liar." 11:16 And he said, "You're gonna clean this up, 11:18 that's your punishment." 11:19 And I was on the floor sobbing 11:21 'cause it was probably like 7 or 8 O'clock 11:23 and it was bedtime and it took me 11:24 till I think 10:30 that night to get it cleaned up. 11:27 And it was just that was-- 11:30 my world was I didn't know if I was gonna make him angry 11:33 or if I was doing something wrong or, 11:36 you know, how did I-- how do I make it work? 11:39 And I felt like I was always messing it up. Right. 11:42 And so, did you find anything like we talked about the kid 11:45 that find some way to comfort themselves, 11:48 some way to were-- yeah. Yeah. 11:49 For me, it was books. 11:50 I took it because I turned in big time. 11:52 And I was not allowed to be angry. 11:55 I was never allowed to be the angry one. 11:57 So I just turned it all in 11:58 and I started reading these books and-- 12:00 You escaped into. I escaped into fiction. 12:02 I think a lot of kids do that. 12:04 So what kind of books did you grab? 12:06 For me, it was Nancy Drew, 12:08 she was just kind of the epitome of what I thought was perfect. 12:11 She was 18, she was beautiful, she was smart, 12:14 she flew planes, she spoke three languages, I think. 12:17 And it was just one of those things where I looked at her 12:19 and I went that's what I want to be, 12:22 but I knew couldn't do it 'cause I'm sitting there going, 12:24 well, how did she do that, 12:25 you know, by the time she was 18? What pressure. 12:28 I mean, you know what I mean, 12:29 it's like all of the stuffs that were happening around you, 12:31 trying to live up to everybody else 12:33 and then you find something 12:34 that you absolutely cannot live up to. Yeah. 12:36 And it was just I started, 12:39 you know, I hated her because she was perfect, 12:40 but at the same time I wanted to be her. 12:43 And that kind of became who it was? 12:45 It was like, for me, I was the person, 12:47 I wanted to be somebody perfect, 12:49 but I also hated the perfect people, 12:51 because they had everything I didn't have. 12:53 Well, at least that's what I felt like. 12:55 That's what it felt like. 12:56 Because I know you and you're pretty cool. 12:59 But, you know, that was what it felt like at the time. 13:01 And so I know for you through the years that you ended up 13:06 actually even hitting a time where you felt depressed 13:09 and you were going into some of that kind of stuff. 13:11 Was it a result of not being able to live up 13:15 and that the chaos at home, do you think? 13:17 It was kind of a mixture because for me, 13:19 I think I can pinpoint it back to I was 11 13:21 when I hit my first depressive spell. 13:23 And it was I had my little sister 13:25 and there was my mom and my dad and it seemed like, 13:28 they were the family unit and I was just the extra. 13:31 Right, I may be your best friend 13:33 if you don't come and sit with us. Right. 13:35 And my parents didn't know what to do with me 13:38 when school would let out in the summer. 13:39 So my sister went off to a babysitter a lot of the time, 13:42 but they weren't gonna pay for me to go to be babysitter, 13:44 so they shipped me out 13:46 to live with my grandparents during the summers. 13:48 And I loved my grandparents. 13:50 So I thought, you know, hey this is cool I get to go, 13:53 you know, be with my grandparents. 13:54 I didn't really think about it. 13:56 But when I got to my grandparents, 13:57 I had this really stable environment. 13:59 And my grandmother just doted on me. 14:01 I mean, we spent summers painting, drawing, 14:04 planting marigolds, I mean, we did stuff. 14:08 You know, I got one on one time with grandma and grandpa. 14:11 And then they would take me to church every weekend. 14:13 And so I was still connected in with the church 14:16 even though I wasn't in the church. 14:19 And in my head I was getting everything 14:21 like God was wanting me to have 14:24 that I was gonna need in the future 14:25 from those weekends that I was out at church. 14:28 And then summer would end and I'd have to go back to New York. 14:31 And I knew what was waiting for me when I got back 14:33 and I would just ball the whole 5 hour flight to home or 14:36 whatever, you know, it was. And-- 14:40 It's got to be hard to get it as sense or taste of belonging 14:44 and being loved and then walking away from that again. 14:47 Yeah, and I just kind of got it in my head that, 14:50 that was my life, that it was always gonna be there some 14:54 New York and then out with my grandparents 14:57 and I was never gonna be kind of a stable thing, 15:00 I was never gonna have the home environment 15:03 that I thought I wanted and-- 15:06 That you need it. 15:07 That I--yeah, that I actually need it, you know. 15:09 And I just adapted to what was there 15:13 and the volatility of my dad's anger problems and, 15:19 you know, whatever was going on in the house 15:21 and I just kind of went with that. 15:23 And then my little brother was born a couple of years later 15:27 and it just kind of pushed me out even further 15:29 on that feeling of that's their family and I'm just the extra. 15:34 So I had this opportunity 15:37 to go to high school out with my grandparents 15:40 and I started and I went, sure why not? 15:44 I've got nothing here that I want to stick around for 15:47 may be I'll find what I'm wanting there 15:49 because I'm going to a private school 15:51 and that's with kids who were gonna be like me who, 15:53 you know, go to church and who understand who Jesus is 15:56 and because the kids I hung out with 15:59 didn't have that background at all. 16:00 'Cause in New York, you were in public school? 16:02 Right, 'cause I'm in the public school 16:03 and I still knew who God was, 16:06 I knew who Jesus was 16:07 and the Sabbath was still Sabbath to me 16:09 and I knew all of that, but nobody else did. 16:12 And so I was really excluded on that 16:15 and even though I wasn't attending church. 16:17 I thought "Hey, if I go to private school 16:19 and I'm with the kids who think the way I think 16:21 and do the things I do, that'll fix everything. 16:24 And I went out to my grandparents again 16:27 for the summer and I went to camp 16:30 and they had pastor who was doing one of those 16:32 altar calls type of thing at the end of the camp. 16:35 And I just sat there and I went, 16:36 I've got to go up there I've got to go up there, 16:38 that's what I want to be a part of, 16:40 and I couldn't get up out of my chair. 16:42 I felt like somebody was sitting on me. 16:43 And I'm sitting there going, 16:45 "God, I know this is what I need to do, 16:46 help me get out of this chair." 16:48 And then a moment I have this feeling like, 16:50 if you don't get up now, 16:52 you're never gonna be able to get up and go. 16:53 And so I stood up 16:54 and it felt like I had lead weights tied to me 16:56 as I was standing up, and I walked and I kid you not, 16:59 it was like somebody might have manacled my feet, 17:01 I could barely take steps. 17:03 And I got up to the altar and I'm like, "This is what I want. 17:05 I want to have God in my life 17:08 and I want to feel like I belong to somebody." 17:11 Amen. And-- 17:13 That's such a powerful for a kid that has all of that stuff, 17:17 does anybody loved me. 17:19 For God through the Holy Spirit to break through to your heart 17:21 and say stand up, I love you. Yeah. 17:24 To me, I wish that everybody could get a sense 17:27 of how amazing that moment was for you. It was. 17:29 It was just-- it was so powerful. 17:31 And I wanted to just keep going, I didn't wanted to stop, 17:34 and then I got back to the cabin 17:35 and I was like, we're done, okay. 17:38 And I'm like, "Really?" That's it, go on-- 17:40 Does anybody gonna come talk to me? I know. 17:42 And I wanted somebody who can talk to me, so God-- 17:44 I really want to turn around. 17:46 You know what I mean? 17:47 Almost to the world and say never do that to a kid 17:50 'cause I don't think we realize 17:52 and in recovery I see this all the time is, 17:54 as we see these injured individuals 17:57 that finally have hope enough to stand up. 17:59 And we don't realize the next step 18:01 and the next step is somebody has got to touch them, 18:04 somebody has got to say, "You know what? Good decision." 18:07 And God loves you and that follow up is critical. Yeah. 18:10 But that didn't happened. 18:12 And I'm glad in a sense that we're gonna cover that 18:15 that didn't happen because your life continues to spiral down, 18:19 even though you had that moment. 18:21 Yeah, it just got worse actually, 18:22 that I might have been like what they call 18:24 mountain top experience 18:25 because for me, that was like the high point 18:27 and then I just kind of roll down the hill after that 18:29 and it just got worse and worse. 18:31 And I started at academy. And I'm from-- 18:33 I'm gonna let you go on, but I want to tell you, I'm sorry. 18:36 All right, go ahead. 18:38 So I started at academy, and I'm from New York City, 18:41 so I'm pretty rough around the edges at this point. 18:43 I've had to, you know, fight my way to having a place 18:47 where I can defend myself 18:48 if somebody is gonna come and attack me and I just really-- 18:50 You had everything, but the plan. Yeah. 18:54 And I just didn't really know what the social norms were 18:58 and I didn't get it and I started feeling that ostracism, 19:02 and so I started hating the kids because, 19:05 you know, they were pulling away from something 19:07 they didn't recognize and so I turned around 19:09 and hated them back for pulling away from me 'cause I'm like, 19:12 "You're supposed to be my kind of people. 19:13 What's going on here?" 19:15 And there was one guy who, you know, was nice to me 19:19 and we started dating 19:20 and I got really hooked into that relationship 19:22 'cause finally I had somebody who's paying attention to me 19:25 and who is telling me that they love me and-- 19:27 And I felt like I belong. 19:28 Yeah, and I felt like I belong. 19:30 And so I just put everything on to that relationship, 19:32 and I allowed it to progress to the point 19:35 where it was sexual, and I was 14 years old. 19:38 And I had no idea what that was gonna do to me. 19:41 And eventually we broke up because it was just, 19:44 you know, it was just too much of intimate thing 19:47 and it was just too hard to, you know, maintain that at-- 19:50 And you were so needy. 19:51 And I was so needy, so needy, and I drove him away 19:54 and it's not his fault, but it was just-- 19:56 But and the reason I say that is that most people come in 19:59 and they judge your behavior and this is just a bad kid 20:01 and I just want to say, no way. No. 20:03 So needy and everything was stacked up 20:05 to make then another wrong decision. Right. 20:08 And I just didn't know how to handle that-- 20:12 not rejection, it wasn't necessarily rejection, 20:14 but having that emptiness again-- 20:16 I'm alone again. I'm alone again. 20:18 And I've been taking some muscle relaxants for pain, 20:22 legitimate, you know, this is from a doctor I can take this, 20:25 but there was 215 of these pills in a bottle. 20:28 And I just sat there around, I can't deal with this anymore, 20:32 I'm tired of being alone and so I took the whole bottle. 20:34 And there would have been-- I've been taking them slowly, 20:39 so I'm gonna guess there is probably 20:40 185 pills left in that bottle and I took the whole-- 20:43 whole lot in one go. 20:45 And my grandmother to this day I don't know what I did to her. 20:51 She came in and she found the bottle empty 20:53 and she asked me and she goes, "Did you take these?" 20:54 And I said, "Yeah, I took them." 20:57 And the next thing I know I'm being run off to the ER 20:59 because, you know, I've taken I don't know how many hundred, 21:02 you know, painkillers 21:04 and they're pumping my stomach and they're looking like, 21:06 "Well, why did you do something so stupid?" 21:08 And I'm looking at the nurse going, 21:10 "Really, do you have any idea?" 21:14 It's like, "Why would you ask me that question? 21:16 Why do you think I took them?" Right. 21:17 And but, you know, 21:19 and then well, this is what I think the devil is so strategic 21:22 because he uses the same words. Yeah. 21:24 You know, the same word 21:25 that you've heard all your whole your life is you're a stupid. 21:27 Why did you do something so stupid? 21:29 And so for you, 21:31 that's just like somebody just slamming you again. Yeah. 21:34 And so, you know, and I guess when I hear that 21:37 I just want to say that 21:39 somebody's got to say the right thing, 21:41 you know, as definitely as Christians, 21:43 but as adults as at sometimes we got to say the right thing 21:46 that this kid took it for reason. 21:49 Yeah, I wasn't-- I wasn't kind of showing off, 21:51 I wasn't, you know-- Trying to get attention. 21:54 May be I was trying to get attention, 21:55 but not it was at the same time it was a real intense pain 21:58 and I was trying to get rid of that pain. 22:00 So they stuck me in the psychiatric ward 22:02 with kids who were in there for anger management problems, 22:05 prostitution and drug addiction, 22:07 and I'm in there for suicide attempt. 22:09 And they're like, we're gonna have group therapy 22:11 and so we do group therapy and it's all about 22:13 why you're not gonna drink alcohol. 22:15 And I'm going, "Oh, why?" I don't drink. 22:19 I'm like, "Wait a minute. I don't--I don't do that." 22:21 And it's like well, how does this help? 22:23 I didn't--I didn't understand that. 22:25 It didn't make any sense to me why it was helping. 22:28 And I had no respect for the staff at that point 22:32 'cause they would come in and they're like, 22:33 all you're gonna go do this group therapy thing? 22:35 And it had nothing to do it what my issues were. 22:39 And finally they got me into see the psychiatrist, 22:42 and the psychiatrist sits there and he's got his notepad 22:46 and I'm sitting on the couch, you know, across the room 22:49 and he does one of these things, and he goes, 22:51 "Okay, tell me how your week has been." 22:53 And I'm like, "It's been bad. 22:58 You know, what do you think?" 23:00 Until you will see this here your life stop, leave me. 23:04 You know, 'cause I think that you've got all that 23:06 rebellion and that anger and that stuff 23:08 and to have somebody to really look at a pad more than you. 23:11 Yeah. He never looks at me. 23:12 There is no--yeah, there's no way. 23:14 And that's another thing is that 23:16 there is no way you're gonna open up. 23:17 And I can't even--my heart just breaks when you say that. 23:20 It just--it was one of those things 23:22 where I sat there and I went, you want me to tell you 23:23 how my week has been. 23:25 What do you think it's been like? 23:26 You know, no, it's been great. 23:28 Actually, you know, everybody is welcome me back to school, 23:30 they don't think I'm a freak, my boyfriend's taken me back, 23:32 it's great, you know, kind of like, "Really?" 23:36 And, you know, they put me on antidepressants and just, 23:39 you know, for teenager that's like giving them dynamite. 23:42 You know, and I was on antidepressants. 23:44 I went up and I went down and I'm all over the place. 23:46 And sometimes suicide and even homicidal stuff is exaggerated. 23:50 And I got more suicidal for that too. 23:53 I was one of those people I had that reaction. 23:55 I would just come up real high and then I crash real low 23:58 and the kids at school would pull even further away 24:00 'cause now I'm really a freak. 24:02 They don't know how you're gonna be any given time. 24:04 And so they would make fun of me in the hallways and stuff 24:06 and I'd just, I sat there and I went, 24:08 "You guys are all awful, I can't stand you. 24:10 You have no value at all in my life." 24:13 And I went through three years of that academy 24:16 and then my parents would finally say-- 24:20 they would call up one day and say, 24:22 "Oh, we're gonna buy house. 24:24 Okay, well, next year we're gonna buy house. Okay." 24:28 Well, my junior, they finally did buy the house 24:30 and they said, "We'd like you to move home." 24:32 And I said, "Sure, I will do anything 24:34 I can to get away from this because I'm so tired of this." 24:36 I don't fit. Yeah, I don't fit. 24:38 They don't want to be friends with me. 24:40 The youth pastor won't even talk with me 24:42 and have a serious conversation with me. 24:44 I said, "I can't handle this anymore." 24:46 What's really--what's really tough in the situation you have, 24:49 and tell me if this is true for you 24:51 or sometimes we can't stand ourselves? 24:53 You know, I know that I'm all over the board 24:55 and I know that I don't fit in 24:56 and I know that I don't know how to talk 24:58 and I know that was stupid for me to say, 25:00 and yet I don't feel like I have any control. 25:03 My emotional junk is following me. 25:07 It's like tied to me. Yeah. And I did things wrong. 25:10 I know I did, but I just didn't know how to do them right 25:13 and I didn't have anybody showing me how to do them right. 25:16 My grandparents were busy, 25:17 struggling with trying do raise me. 25:19 You know, here I'm this volatile teenager 25:21 and I've got, you know, issues all over the map 25:24 and I'm grabbing onto whatever is there as a lifeline, 25:27 just going please somebody save me. 25:29 Whatever comforts you? Right. 25:30 And I go home to New York in the summers 25:33 and I'll be back in that volatile world of my home. 25:36 And so I would just go out to any party 25:38 'cause there's parties in New York City 25:41 that a teenager can get into. 25:43 And they'll hand you alcohol, they'll hand you drugs then, 25:46 you know, and the backrooms and, you know, sleep with you 25:49 because, you know, hey, why not you're there? 25:52 So now that we talked about 25:53 during the first part of the program is that 25:55 when you take something or find something 25:57 that for even a moment gives you comfort 26:00 how addicting that becomes. 26:02 It was very addictive. Yeah. 26:03 And for me, it was going to guys and finding that love for, 26:06 even if it was just for 15 minutes, 26:08 it was something that I felt that was-- 26:10 I just want to cry for you 'cause, you know, 26:11 I know so many kids that, you know, 26:14 for them to make a statement 26:16 even if it's just for 15 minutes, my heart breaks. 26:18 And I just want to say is, man, we got to wake up to that. 26:22 We do. And it's I don't think I'm the only one. 26:26 And I had friends who just took it even further, 26:29 they got into prostitution, they got into gangs. 26:32 You know, my friends that I was in, 26:34 we took it to kind of the occult level. 26:36 We got into vampirism, which means 26:38 that if in order for me to show that I trust you, 26:42 I have to let you hurt me. 26:44 So I'm gonna let you cut me open and let me bleed. 26:47 And I'm gonna bleed for you 26:49 and that's how I'm gonna prove that I trust you. 26:51 And that you're okay-- And people don't realize that 26:53 that is not an uncommon thing, yeah. 26:56 No, it's not, you know, cutting on yourself 26:58 'cause you're in pain, it's like, 27:00 I'm gonna take this trust level up a notch 27:02 'cause I need to trust somebody that much. 27:04 Yeah, go ahead. 27:05 So, yeah, and then you take it, 27:08 you know, from just the trust level into the sexual nature 27:11 and the whole thing just become so ridiculously demonic. 27:14 I mean, it is, it really truly is. 27:17 And it just distorts your idea of what love is, 27:20 relationship is supposed to be like and, you know, 27:23 what trust is supposed to feel like, 27:25 and you don't feel like, you can trust anybody 27:27 'cause even the people you trust are 27:28 literally they're hurting you. 27:30 So I moved back with my parents 27:34 and got in with another boyfriend 27:37 and I'm, you know, it was pretty bad. 27:40 And being able to say when you would say, 27:42 I moved back and I got in with another boyfriend 27:44 is at that point in your life, 27:46 I don't know how to stand on my own? 27:47 No. I have never done it. 27:49 And if somebody even said, 27:51 "You know, stand up, just be yourself." 27:54 You're like, what does that mean? 27:56 I had no idea. 27:57 And for me, I thought, you know, 27:58 if I move back to with my parents 28:00 maybe I could start over 'cause my mom was like, 28:02 "Well, you can always start over." 28:04 And I totally believe that you can truly always start over, 28:07 but at that point I maybe started over 10 or 15 times. 28:11 And I didn't know what that meant anymore. 28:13 So I know, you know, 28:16 that we are like on a time limit, 28:19 just doing a program like this. 28:20 So I got to say, you know, what happened? 28:23 What started this kind of? How did you turn this around? 28:27 How did God come in? 28:29 'Cause I want to just grab you 28:30 and just rescue you like, "Stop, don't do--" 28:33 Don't do anymore. Don't do anymore. 28:35 Well, that boyfriend I'd gone down to visit him in New York 28:38 and he had gotten pretty tired of me at that point, 28:42 and so he was like, "Well, how can I miss you 28:44 if you're never gone type of thing." 28:46 Was what he told me? And it's a same message. 28:48 The devil is so strategic. 28:50 If you don't sit here, I will love you. 28:52 You know, the message in your life it's like, 28:54 it's just the same. 28:56 And, you know, for people in recovery, 28:58 I would love you to start listening to the message 29:00 'cause a devil doesn't change that much-- 29:02 It doesn't, it's maybe a work here or work there. 29:04 Yeah. And I was so broken. 29:06 I walked out to there is a bridge near the mall 29:09 where I'd been and I stood on the bridge and it was-- 29:13 I don't know how far above the water is, 29:15 but it's one of the New York City bridges 29:16 and I was gonna jump off. 29:18 Right then in there I had decided 29:20 and I started arguing with God. 29:22 Of all the things I'm arguing with God about 29:24 why I'm gonna do this. 29:26 And I'm telling Him, "God, it's not you, it's me really." 29:29 Yeah, I don't want You to feel bad about this. 29:32 It's not your fault that I'm gonna commit suicide. 29:34 You didn't do anything. This is all me. 29:35 I just can't make it work anymore. 29:38 And I heard God in my head going don't--don't do it. 29:43 And I'm like, "You don't understand." 29:45 I can't do it anymore. I'm tired. 29:48 And I said, "God, I need a different life." 29:50 And He goes, "If you don't do it I'll give you a different life." 29:54 And I'm sooner going, "Well, what if I got to loose really?" 29:59 You know, and I go, "Okay, God, You're gonna have to put-- 30:02 You're gonna have to fix everything 30:03 'cause I have just completely messed it up at this point." 30:06 And so I turned around, walked off the bridge 30:10 which I have to explain. 30:12 The bridge I was on nobody else was on it. 30:14 There were no cars passing by. There were no people walking by. 30:16 If I'd jumped, nobody would have been able to stop me. 30:19 And so I turned around and I walked off 30:21 and I still had two more low points 30:25 because I got pregnant twice after that, 30:27 and I had two abortions. 30:29 And I really came this close to committing suicide 30:33 after those because it was just-- I was like, "That's it. 30:35 I've screwed it up. I'm beyond fixing." 30:38 Even, you know, and to me were there are lot of people 30:40 don't realize even when you step into the, you know, 30:42 well, now I've hand an abortion is not only have I hurt myself, 30:46 but I have hurt someone else, I have murdered my own child, 30:49 and it almost seems like there is no light 30:53 at the--there's-- I can't. 30:55 I'm not redeemable. I'm not, yeah. 30:57 I've got--I got that that I've gone too far. 31:00 And God kept working with me, and kept working with me, 31:02 and kept working with me, 31:04 and I'd sit in the shower and pour my heart out to God 31:07 and He's like, "I'm gonna fix it. 31:09 I'm gonna fix it." Yeah. 31:10 And so that counseling thing 31:13 that I had with that psychiatrist, 31:14 I remember looking at him and thinking you're so awful. 31:17 Nobody should have to have a psychiatrist like you. 31:19 So I spent-- from the time 31:21 I was 14 until the time I completed college 31:23 and working in psychiatric clinics 31:26 to get experience and I took a bachelors degree in psychology 31:29 and I went and--right after that 31:31 I got my master's degree in clinical psych. 31:33 'cause I said, "Nobody should ever have to have 31:35 a counselor that does not care." 31:37 Yeah, that does not even look at them. 31:39 And so I started doing my internship 31:43 and I worked with kids and I saw these kids who-- 31:46 they might coming from loving families, 31:47 it doesn't mean that their parents don't love them, 31:49 but they're still floundering. 31:51 And I'm like, "These are kids that we need to be reach out." 31:53 And I totally understood, I totally got 31:55 where they were coming from and I can look at them and go, 31:57 "Yeah, I get that. 31:59 I get where you're at because I've been there." 32:01 Right. I understand, and-- 32:03 Now what's really interesting to me, 32:05 Asheley, is that I really believe that probably 32:07 during even your education 32:09 that God did incredible healing in your life. 32:11 There was--I think it was, but it was so subtle, 32:14 I didn't know when it was happening 32:16 because now I can sit there 32:17 and look at all of them and I go, 32:19 "That's over there. That's not me anymore." 32:22 To me, is the counselor who wants to work 32:24 and help feel--help people feel better about themselves 32:28 and find a way to get pass that pain 32:31 and to have relationships. 32:33 When did you feel like? You know what? 32:36 I think I'm in my own skin and I like it 'cause I know-- 32:41 I'm still getting there. Good. But, you know what? 32:43 'Cause I've--you know, you and I have had lunch before 32:46 and I sense that about you is that God is allowing you, 32:50 you know, through the count and through what you do, 32:52 but he is allowing you to be in your own skin 32:54 and actually liking it. 32:56 So the healing even though it's been subtle, 32:58 it has been relentless. 33:00 It has been. 33:01 It's--it took me getting married and having three children. 33:05 In my head, this is probably going to sound weird, 33:07 but I look at them as replacing the two that I aborted, 33:11 but they are my life. 33:14 And everything I do-- my work, I do it for God. 33:18 And I can tell, He is there, He talks back to me, 33:20 I have that conversation and it's like, 33:23 I screwed up as my life might be going for a moment. 33:26 I know that, "Hey, he's gonna pull me through." 33:28 And now when I have those moments of depression 33:30 'cause they still hit, it's not gonna go away. 33:33 I don't have depression for two weeks anymore at a time. 33:35 Now it's maybe I have a day 33:37 and I know who my support group is, 33:39 I know who my friends are that I can go to and go. 33:42 I'm--you got to help me. 33:43 I'm like totally spiraling out here and they go, 33:46 "We're here with you. It's okay." 33:48 And it's just awesome to have that, and to know 33:50 that my husband loves me for everything 33:53 and he knows everything about me. 33:54 Right. And he loves me anyway. 33:55 Your friends love you. Yeah, my friends love me. 33:58 You know, it's like, I sit there and I go I have 34:00 everything now that I wanted so much growing up. 34:03 Except for the plane. Except for the plane. 34:06 But, you know, even-- You know, I have to say that, 34:08 you know, in all of our recovery 34:10 we do really wanted to happen overnight 34:12 and God says, "You got to trust me. 34:14 As you surrender to me, as you really make 34:17 the commitment like on the bridge, 34:18 you made a commitment to live, 34:20 as you make that commitment I am going to-- 34:22 you may not even see the changes, 34:24 but I'm gonna make changes in your life." 34:26 And so what I think is hysterical about 34:28 where He is taking you right now, 34:30 is that we go to the same church. 34:32 Yeah. I love you. 34:34 You know, I watch you with your kids, and your family. 34:36 And at one point, we needed someone 34:39 to work with their adolescence. 34:41 Yes. Oh, my goodness. 34:43 I have to explain I did not want to work 34:45 with adolescents because I had been one 34:47 and I see here going, "Why would I do this to myself?" 34:51 And I had a foreign exchange student living with us 34:54 and she said, "Well, 34:55 I don't know why I go to church." 34:57 And I sat there and I went, it clicked, 34:59 you know, it's like God was saying, "That's it. 35:00 That's why you've got to go do this." 35:02 And I went, "Kids don't know. 35:05 They don't have that personal relationship with Jesus." 35:08 And if we don't help them develop that, 35:11 it doesn't matter what we teach 35:12 them about going to church or how to live. 35:15 If they don't have that relationship, 35:16 they're gonna end up floundering just like I did. 35:18 Right, in not all kids, but you're talking about, 35:20 you know, lot of kids go, they don't know 35:22 why they're going, they're not connecting with each other. 35:24 And your heart said, "Oh, I remember that. 35:26 I know how that feels." Yes. 35:28 And you've got to have something there to pull them in. 35:32 And I love 'cause at that moment, 35:33 you knew you had to say yes. 35:35 I was like, "Yeah, sort of like you're going really, God, 35:37 you knew I didn't want to work with adolescents." 35:39 And now I need to go around help find the youth program 35:41 and we've been running it. 35:42 And I'm having the best time in my life. 35:44 The kids that I worked with, 35:46 you know, they are just some of the most awesome kids-- 35:49 With issues-- And they do. 35:51 They all have--they all have their issues even if it's, 35:53 you know, time management some of them are doing really great 35:56 and they just have time management issues for school. 35:58 Other kids, you know, their world might 36:00 as well just be completely upside down. 36:02 They don't know what house 36:04 they're gonna live in this weekend, 36:05 you know, they don't know what's happening, 36:07 and they're just going, "What do we do? 36:10 How do we make this work?" 36:12 And so to me, it's--can you explain 36:16 how God not only reaches in our life 36:18 'cause I loved the way He reached in your life 36:20 even on that bridge and all through your education, 36:24 but then how does He wake up that passion and, 36:26 you know, that that's--that's 36:28 what He anointed me for, that's what this gift is for. 36:31 It was kind of like, I sat there and I went, 36:32 when I'm arguing back with God, 36:34 it's probably something I'm supposed to do. 36:38 And the more I've started working with the kids 36:40 and seeing what they needed, the more I sat there I went, 36:43 "Hey, I know how to fix that because I've been there, 36:47 I've had that peace missing, so I know how to fill that in." 36:51 And we started making relationships with the kids 36:54 and they know that they can come to us whenever. 36:58 I've got-- I've got 36:59 what I call a 24-hours cell phone service. 37:01 You can call me up anytime of the day 37:02 and I will talk with you. 37:04 I've had kids call me up in the middle of the night-- 37:06 And, you know, what really interesting? 37:08 I've got to say for somebody that will think, you know, 37:10 that sounds a little bit codependent or whatever. 37:12 Some of the kids that we have are literally in blended 37:16 families, mothers an addict, dealing with that kind of stuff. 37:20 And so what you and your husband 37:21 decided is to behave-- let these kids have access 37:25 to their youth directors at the church. 37:29 And so, you know, even though it may sound. 37:33 I mean, there is little bit of be careful with that. 37:36 You guys are careful with that. We are very careful with it. 37:38 And part of that thing to is I'm a--since I'm a counselor, 37:40 I'm a licensed counselor now, especially in the city of Idaho. 37:44 It's very--I have to be very careful with my boundaries. 37:48 So the kids know that the girls come to me. 37:52 The boys go to my husband Brad, 37:55 and we have a very strict boundary on here's 37:58 what we're gonna do and here's when we can do it, 38:00 but if you are in crisis don't-- you know, not call me, 38:03 call me 'cause if you're-- if you're not point of, 38:06 you know, downing the bottle's pills. 38:07 I'd rather have you on the phone with me 38:09 because I can call the emergency services-- 38:11 And we're your church? 38:13 Yeah, I'm part of your church family, 38:15 and it's like, I want to be there for you 38:16 and not make you feel like, 38:18 you have nobody that you can turn so. 38:20 So now the next thing which I think is funny. 38:22 So the next thing is you and your husband decide 38:29 that maybe the church is in our conference, 38:33 so it's like I love the way God does that, 38:35 it's like okay so now our youth group is running really well. 38:37 Yeah. Yeah. 38:39 Kids are feeling comfortable coming to Christ, 38:42 literally having a stronger relationship 38:45 and being able to just settle in who they are spiritually, 38:48 having a connection with the body, I mean, 38:51 you know, when they walk around, 38:53 they really look at everybody as family now, 38:55 so all of that is being developed really well. 38:57 And then God tells you well, 38:59 what about the other churches in the conference. 39:00 It was, He didn't just tell me later. 39:02 It was like I got the whole thing in one whammy. 39:05 It was just we're gonna do all of it at one time 39:07 and the first thing was to fix the church that you're in. 39:10 So we started working on the program. 39:12 And then I sat there and I went, well, 39:13 why is our church here and there is another church over here 39:16 and there is like another church over here 39:18 and we're not talking and I had and idea 39:20 who my conference leaders, you know, 39:23 who they were and how I suppose to utilize 39:25 those resources and God's like, I would love to see happen. 39:30 And He is telling me, this kind of like inside of my head 39:33 type of thing is we need to get 39:35 the churches working together, you know-- 39:37 Especially with our youth, yeah. With our youth. 39:39 And so now we're working there, 39:41 I've been meeting with some of the other church leaders 39:43 and youth leaders specifically. 39:45 And we're looking at how do we bring 39:46 the youth together for big events 39:48 to just get that support system going. 39:51 And it doesn't mean that we're gonna do everything that way, 39:53 I mean, we still have our own little church events, 39:56 but now we're taking it to the conference level, 39:57 so that the kids see that they have 39:59 this whole network that is out there. 40:01 And, you know, what I love is that, 40:04 because of where you're wounded and that says, 40:08 you are stepping into the church 40:10 and healing that wound for the church, 40:13 because God healed it for you. 40:15 And that's where I think that recovery and spirituality 40:19 and who got is it's just brilliant. 40:21 I think, you know, I want to kiss, God on the face, 40:23 I just think you're brilliant that He just takes 40:25 everything about who we are and blesses us. 40:29 I would like to open it up. 40:31 We don't have a much time, but open it up 40:33 for a few questions before we close. 40:36 And so I know that, you know, 40:38 you guys have been just hearing this testimony 40:41 and this incredible journey 40:43 and so I was wondering if anyone had a question for Asheley. 40:48 I've one. So Brad. 40:50 Asheley, I just want to say, thank you so much, 40:52 for sharing us someone who I've seen in my church 40:54 I had no idea and just God bless you. 40:57 My question to you, 40:59 and Cheri and I are actually are parents of a child 41:02 who took a bottle of pills once. 41:05 And I want to, you know, having to go with her 41:07 to a psych facility which for a few hours and stuff. 41:10 Can you, talk just a little bit of more about 41:13 like teen suicidal just say even in Idaho? 41:17 Teen suicide it's a big problem like 41:20 I know the statistics kind of change every year 41:23 and what the rate is, but I think what I saw this last time 41:26 was that Idaho ranks number third in the nation for suicide. 41:29 I think Washington and Alaska were head of us. 41:33 So it's a real issue and what it is a lack of kids 41:37 feeling like they have somebody they can go to 41:40 talk about their problems and the pain just builds up. 41:43 And so they're only out. 41:45 It seems to them is that they feel is to commit suicide, 41:49 because everything else, you know, 41:51 it might look perfect from the outside, 41:53 but what's going on inside is not perfect 41:56 and so that's tends to be what I think happens is that, 42:01 you know, they feel like I've got nobody 42:02 I can talk to about this, nobody is gonna understand. 42:05 I don't want to go to mom and dad, 42:07 'cause mom and dad will wholly freak out which, 42:09 you know, we do, we do freak out, 42:10 because something is wrong with our kid and we want to fix it. 42:13 But they don't feel like they have somebody safe that-- 42:15 And even so when they do go to somebody and there are times 42:18 when people say,"Oh, you shouldn't feel that way." 42:20 Instead of allowing them to feel. 42:23 We have one more question, Melody, 42:25 I know that you had a question. 42:27 Yes, Asheley, I think you're remarkable lady, 42:29 but I want you to expand 42:30 a little bit more on that vampirism. 42:32 I've never heard of that before. 42:34 Okay, vampirism for those who don't know it's technically 42:38 it's a sexual fetish which does not make it in addiction, 42:41 but it can also become an addiction and what it is, 42:44 is you literally you cut on your skin anywhere, 42:48 you know, it can be here, it can be on your arm 42:51 and you allow somebody else to drink your blood. 42:53 And the idea is that it's a form of trust building 42:58 if you're taking on that level, 43:00 if you're taking it on the relationship level, 43:01 it's a form of trust where I'm trusting you to hurt me, 43:05 but not cut me so bad 43:07 that I will bleed to death type of thing. 43:09 And it's a very--I don't even know how to put it nicely. 43:14 It's just a very distorted view 43:16 of what a relationship is supposed to be like, 43:19 what trust and love are supposed to be-- 43:21 And you have, you have books and movies 43:24 all about kind of the vampires and romantic, suspense 43:30 and really seductive thing 43:33 and so that has kind of blood into 43:35 how people want to be looked at. 43:37 I want to be other worldly. 43:39 I don't want to be in my own skin. 43:41 And when you don't like being in your own skin 43:43 and you've been wounded for that long to have some escape 43:46 whether it was like what you did with books. 43:48 And I did with Nancy Drew 43:49 or I'm gonna become the walking dead. 43:52 I'm gonna become a vampire, it really does build up 43:56 its own society and there is it's huge. 43:58 It is huge, there are clubs, there are underground societies. 44:02 There are, you know, it's own world. 44:04 It's huge. 44:06 You know, we're gonna go ahead and break 44:08 and I--even want to come back and close this, 44:10 but I'd like you to join me, 44:12 'cause I know that you have a few more things to say, 44:14 you know, we could do another program altogether, 44:16 but few more things to say 44:18 and then I want you to talk to someone out there 44:20 that maybe is feeling alone, 44:22 standing on a bridge even in there own head. 44:24 So we'll be right back. 44:26 Thank you, for staying with us this long, but don't go away. |
Revised 2014-12-17