Participants: Cheri Peters (Host), Ralph Sanchez
Series Code: CLR
Program Code: CLR000117A
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00:01 The following program discusses sensitive issues
00:03 related to addictive behavior. 00:05 Parents are cautioned that some material 00:06 may be too candid for younger children. 00:10 Welcome the Celebrating Life in Recovery. 00:11 My name is Cheri, I'm your host. 00:14 Can we survive like adultery and anger 00:17 and abuse, resentment. 00:18 This is a continuation from last week 00:21 and this journey is incredible. 00:23 Come join us. 00:50 Welcome, so we are really looking at all kinds of things 00:53 this session as far as health wise. 00:56 How to maintain our recovery and I've just been blessed. 01:00 You know, from the very first interview 01:03 to the very last has just been amazing, 01:04 but this week we're looking at air. 01:07 And I'm trying to figure 01:08 how to tie in air with the story 01:10 that you gonna hear with the life testimony 01:13 that you gonna hear and I think God gave me a way. 01:16 One of the things that I learn 01:17 when I was traveling is there was a young girl 01:20 that who had emphysema 01:21 and she really could not breathe at all. 01:24 And as I was staying with her at her home, 01:27 her mother came over and her mother is just amazing, 01:29 just a incredible woman of God. 01:31 And they said that when she was little, 01:33 her mom was a chain smoker, smoked all the time. 01:37 The little girl would go to school 01:38 and people would tease her like do you smoke 01:40 and she'd go like no, I don't smoke 01:42 but her clothes smelled like smoke. 01:44 The current in the house smelled like smoke. 01:46 It was like she was always just smelled like smoke 01:48 and so all the kids tease her. 01:49 She finally told her mom when she was 10, 01:52 I can't stand that anymore. 01:54 And you got to quit smoking. 01:55 Well, her mom was devastated. 01:57 I had no idea you were going through all that, 01:59 so she quit smoking. 02:01 That very day was really, really tough. 02:03 Because smoking was harder for me to quit than heroin, 02:06 I mean it's a tough addiction. 02:08 But she quit that very day for her daughter 02:10 but it wasn't soon enough. 02:11 Her daughter is dying in her 30s of emphysema 02:14 and she has never smoked at all. 02:16 But she was surrounded by smoke 02:17 so even the air quality in our home, 02:20 even if I'm not bringing it into my life 02:23 and I'm surrounded by smokers, 02:24 I could end up with some lung diseases from that. 02:27 So it's really important 02:28 when you're going into recovery. 02:29 If you're smoking, man, I know it's hard 02:32 but you got to quit. 02:33 You know, I just got to say, 02:34 I'm not your mom nor I'm not your grandma whatever 02:36 but I'm just saying you got to quit 02:37 because it will take your life and so think about 02:42 making sure that even in the house open windows, 02:45 you know don't close things off so much. 02:47 We have air conditioners 02:48 and we have all that kind of stuff 02:50 but the air quality sometimes in our home are so bad. 02:52 So open your windows, go outside, 02:54 take a deep breathe like every hour 02:56 so take a deep breathe, it changes how your body reacts 03:00 and if you try to recover from something, 03:02 you gonna want all the help you need. 03:04 But what happens 03:05 if you can't breathe emotionally? 03:07 What happens if you're so full of either anger or resentment 03:11 or bitterness or whatever and you can't breathe? 03:13 And I hate to say that's why 03:15 I'm gonna introduce my next guest. 03:17 But I'm gonna introduce my next guest. 03:19 Well, the first time I heard your story, 03:21 I thought that you really are brave coming out 03:25 and saying this is my issue, this is what I'm dealing with. 03:28 We were talking about air, taking a breathe emotionally, 03:32 all those kind of things. 03:33 So I want to turn it over to you, 03:34 but I want you to start from the very beginning, 03:36 who are you? 03:38 What kinds of things did you grow up with? 03:41 And then, you know, what the issue is, 03:43 then go into the issue. 03:44 Okay. 03:46 I'll try to keep the two things separate. 03:50 I'd say I had by my way of seeing things 03:54 probably pretty normal life. 03:55 I had a mom and a dad 03:57 that stuck together through their whole lives. 03:59 They are still together. 04:03 My dad, I was raised in a Christian home. 04:07 Both mom and dad were Christians before I was born. 04:10 My dad's was-- 04:11 his family was converted to Christianity 04:14 when he was a little boy. 04:15 My mom is a multi generation Christian. 04:17 So it sounds perfect. 04:19 Yeah, I mean it's in a lot of ways on 04:21 and that's, you know, gets begins to cross 04:25 over almost immediately because that was the goal, 04:29 was to make everything look perfect. 04:32 And there was all kinds of little games 04:34 that were played too. 04:35 Make sure that one we set outside the front door, 04:38 we had vocabulary, 04:40 we had the way of saying things and doing things 04:42 that made us look like nothing was wrong. 04:46 Ever. 04:48 Was that the truth? 04:49 No, I think probably all families. 04:52 By now, I think I've realized 04:54 all families have certain kinds and levels of dysfunction. 04:58 And if my family had its kind and level of dysfunction. 05:01 Okay. 05:03 And so but you learned early on that you know what, 05:06 whatever is happening inside, that's one thing. 05:08 When you step out the door, you better look like this. 05:11 So you need to look like this. 05:12 Yeah, and I mean, 05:14 I think a family is a sacred thing. 05:16 It's a sacred institution, that's what I think, 05:19 that's what I believe. 05:21 But there gets to be such a game played 05:24 with that sacredness that the things 05:27 that are reserved for the family 05:29 I think and they are meant to be personal 05:32 and somewhat private in the family 05:34 are meant to be uplifting, 05:35 so that when I walk out the proverbial front door 05:37 what I'm, what's shining out of me is real. 05:41 Its not pasted on. Right, it's joy. 05:44 And in my family I think the sensation was 05:49 that we were always covering something up. 05:52 And so I think that had probably 05:59 for a lot to do even now when I think back on 06:02 what was my perception of growing up way. 06:06 And I had my family, totally psychoanalyzed 06:09 by the time I was about 15, 18 years old. 06:12 I had everything figured out. 06:14 I had my dad figured out, had my mom figured out. 06:16 I figured out what was wrong. 06:17 When I got to college a lot of what I had figured out 06:19 I had affirmed in psyche what I want. 06:23 I took psyche what I want. 06:25 So you do, you looking every page 06:26 and say oh, that is so me, yeah. 06:29 I mean and things just kind of clicked 06:32 and I went okay, so I wasn't just young 06:35 and naive, really some of the things 06:36 I figured out at least in terms of mechanics 06:40 of the human psyche and things that go 06:42 good and bad wasn't too far off. 06:45 And along with that went-- I wouldn't say vows 06:49 but I made promises that the things 06:51 I identified as being just plain negative, 06:56 obviously bad in the family, 06:58 were they were being covered up or not. 07:01 I was never going to do those things. 07:03 I'm not gonna be that. 07:04 I'm not gonna have that, 07:05 that's not gonna be part of my family. 07:06 I'm never gonna be like that. 07:08 Yeah. Those are incredible. 07:10 You know, to me I don't think we realize 07:12 and you probably even a way you said 07:14 that have some awareness 07:15 but I don't think we realized that 07:17 I think the enemy himself steps in at that moment, 07:21 we make those kind of covenant 07:23 or vows or promises that you know, 07:25 I'm not gonna ever have that insane just as yeah. 07:28 You better make sure, you gonna make sure 07:30 and so we can't-- It's like those 07:32 who have such horrendous things to say, 07:36 to ourselves that nobody is gonna hurt me like that, 07:38 nobody is gonna. 07:40 Yeah and the worst part is nobody is gonna hurt me, 07:43 but I'm not gonna hurt people like 07:46 I see that happening to other people in the family. 07:48 Yeah, I'm not gonna be like my family. 07:50 I'm not gonna do that from 07:52 more of the perpetrator standpoint. 07:55 And then things don't go that way 07:57 and I think I like what you said 07:58 because that's exactly, it's been a horrific 08:02 and tough growing up experience spiritually 08:05 to realize all of these. 08:06 I'm never gonna be like that, I'm never gonna do that. 08:09 I even had functioning paradigms 08:12 by the time I was-- 08:13 I'm not kidding 13-14 years old were 08:15 okay, I'm now projecting myself into adulthood 08:18 and I have a family and I come home from work 08:21 and it's been a bad day at work. 08:23 This is what I'm not gonna do. You know what I mean. 08:25 And I have all these things worked out. 08:28 So, Ralph, for somebody to do that at such an early age, 08:31 you must have seen stuff that was pretty intense 08:35 that you said you know, man. 08:38 Well, I mean, how intense does it have to be on a child. 08:43 And, you know, we were talking a little bit early about this, 08:46 some of the stuff is relative. 08:48 What shocking to me 08:50 maybe less shocking to somebody else 08:52 but it's all evil, it's all bad. 08:57 And when you see your mother and father 09:03 go at each other even as verbally, 09:05 this can be traumatizing. 09:07 I had, I would say probably in fact honestly 09:10 I just dealt with this 09:12 I would say 2 years ago with my father. 09:16 There was one time, there was one faithful night 09:20 probably I was I'm gonna say 12 09:24 and I've run this through my little brothers, 09:26 I worked with them, I should say my younger brother 09:28 because they're bigger and smarter than I'm so, 09:31 that's what goes around comes around 09:32 'cause I used to pick on them a lot. 09:35 But... I mean I was probably 09:38 no more than 12 years old I'll say half sure. 09:41 So my second youngest brother 09:44 and then my youngest brother was still in diapers. 09:46 He still slept in a crib. 09:48 And one night my parents got into it 09:50 and they yelled and screamed at each other all night long. 09:53 Well, to kind of get back to the point, 09:55 nobody shot anybody else, that would be, 09:58 I don't know what that would be, 09:59 I can't imagine that would be bad to hear that 10:01 that's what happens in other people's houses, 10:03 that's what we told ourselves. 10:05 But when you hear things being flown, 10:07 you know, thrown around and they are screaming 10:09 and sometimes you can even hear the hitting, 10:12 you can hear that, you know what, 10:14 the body sound as an interesting sound 10:15 when its get socked. 10:17 And when you hear that all night long, it changes you. 10:24 It changes you. 10:25 And that was a traumatizing point in my life 10:29 that I had always, I knew it was traumatizing 10:32 but I just never really, 10:34 if I can put it this way gave it enough credit. 10:37 Because here I'm however old I'm now 10:41 and I'm thinking 10:43 I've taken care of a lot of the stuff with my parents 10:47 what I call my Freudian stuff. 10:50 I've taken care with my parents. 10:51 Both my mom and dad individually, 10:52 I've confronted them with their own issues. 10:54 I've tried to you, called to you, 10:57 you know the trouble I was to them growing up 10:59 and so and so forth as best as I can. 11:01 And then there is this one night 11:03 and it kind of keeps floating around my head 11:05 and I kind of keep pushing it away. 11:06 And for me I think it was the turning point 11:11 or a turning point in my life 11:13 that was very psychologically damaging 11:16 and spiritually damaging. 11:18 I don't know what the difference is. 11:19 To me psychology and spiritual, spirituality are like this. 11:23 I don't, I've hard times-- Just who we are. 11:26 And I think that changed me 11:27 a lot more than I ever get credit for than I be. 11:29 And really the Holy Spirit work and I knew what that felt like 11:33 because when I graduated from college, 11:35 I went to this with my dad. 11:37 The Holy Spirit really called me to a relationship 11:40 for the first time ever with my father. 11:42 I would never ever have a real relationship with my father. 11:47 It was just too emotionally risky. 11:50 Because you wanted to protect yourself against them. 11:53 Right? 11:54 Emotionally and spiritually. Emotionally. 11:55 So I couldn't trust him. 11:57 I know that, you know, you could be safe at one point 12:01 but you're not safe at another point, 12:03 so it's easier just to distance myself. 12:05 Anything that guy got, he would take 12:08 and use it as a weapon against you sooner or later. 12:11 When I got out of college, the Holy Spirit I was head-- 12:15 was in the process of growing as I pray in now, 12:18 but I was at a point and the Holy Spirit 12:20 really called me among other things, 12:23 reconcile with your father, start a relation-- 12:25 It was an interesting calling. 12:26 It wasn't just reconciliation, it was you may now 12:29 have a relation ship with your father 12:30 I'm here, I'll protect you. 12:32 It was, it was a horrific experience mostly 12:35 but he was fast and it launched a relationship. 12:39 My dad could never, he wanted that 12:41 but he could never bring himself to initiate that 12:43 which is really sad, but with the other garbage 12:46 that goes in the house is not surprising 12:48 and rushes back that the patriarch of the family 12:51 couldn't star the deep relationship 12:53 that he really desired to have you know with his sons-- 12:56 So what did you do to reconcile with him? 12:59 Did you say something? 13:00 Did you go inside let's talk, let's- 13:03 Well, as with good traditional family issues, 13:06 I started out with some trivial thing. 13:08 I think we were moving stuff around 13:10 and I got to be a little bit of verbal argument about 13:13 well I use, I should move it this way 13:15 or put it in this particular position whatever it was 13:18 and it ended up in a pretty severe verbal battle 13:21 and of course every time my dad and I got into it, 13:24 all this I want to use the C word all this junk. 13:29 It would come like a volcano I mean it could be, 13:32 I don't like that glass of water 13:33 on the table over there and give it 15, 20 minutes 13:36 and it will turn into a mess 13:39 that had all this garbage in it from the past 13:42 'cause it was all never dealt with at all, not even close. 13:44 You know what? 13:45 When somebody says that and I heard some 13:49 as psychologists talk about you know that we all have 13:52 almost a file cabinet within our heart, 13:55 within our soul and every time 13:57 we've get offended or every time we get angry, 13:59 every time we have something unresolved, 14:01 we'd just put the file in the right place 14:03 and file it in that cabinet, then something happens 14:06 and every single paper flies out. 14:08 So it's like what happened 14:10 because it was just about the glass, wasn't it? 14:12 Well, no it was years in using the stuff 14:14 and you says you said 14:15 and that in your home that happened a lot. 14:17 This particular day it happened. 14:20 It happened and I did something 14:24 I thought I would never do, and that was I went back home 14:27 and lived for three months so never leave at home-- 14:30 I love my mom and dad dearly. 14:32 But as an adult to hear that kind of abuse its hard. 14:36 Yeah. 14:37 So my dad and I got into it and I-- it turned into-- 14:43 I think I really had a nerves break down 14:45 because at some point after a 30 or 45 minutes 14:49 of just circling stuff around he won't let stuff go 14:52 and I you know bare my streak of stubbornness 14:55 well, I just lost it 14:59 and I started screaming on my dad. 15:01 And I screamed at my dad is I recall nonstop. 15:04 I mean, I was even still moving around the house 15:06 and helping them move from their apartment 15:09 where they living into the house 15:10 that they had just recently got 15:12 and I am screaming as a loud as I can scream 15:15 which is you know I talk kind of normally talker 15:18 but I am screaming at the top of my lungs 15:20 and just all kinds of stuff is coming out 15:22 including some good stuff. 15:25 I mean, some stuff that makes sense. 15:27 But I am just yelling at him, 15:29 screaming at him at the top of my lungs. 15:31 We drive as 20 minutes in the sour spring 15:33 and then I was back again and back and forth 15:35 and I am screaming at him. 15:36 I'd say for a couple three hours nonstop. 15:39 You could not stop. I lost it. 15:41 Now my brother was there and we came into the house 15:44 and I was still gone I think pretty much 15:49 and I actually maybe the only time 15:52 but for sure we wanted two times 15:54 and I actually thought about taking my life. 15:57 And it wasn't all I am so sad 15:58 and it wasn't any like that I was just freaking mad. 16:03 And I wanted to kill somebody and I can't kill you so-- 16:05 Somebody is got to die. 16:07 Somebody got die and I killed two birds with one stone. 16:09 I get to kill somebody 16:11 and you have to pay for my surviving it 16:14 and they live on a high rise apartment complex 16:17 and they are way at the top 16:18 and I am walking at the sliding door. 16:22 I'm just gonna dive up. 16:23 And I am taking my fist on the wall behind there 16:26 is this temperature, a thermostat 16:29 and I am just hammering this thermostat 16:31 with the back my fist just like this 16:32 over and over again screaming at my dad 16:34 who was sitting over in that direction 16:37 and my brother, my second to the youngest brother 16:39 is standing or kind of kneeling next to my dad 16:43 and all I remember and that is my brothers 16:45 kind of talking softly to my father 16:48 and I heard him at one point say, look at him. 16:52 This is my brother telling my dad 16:53 to look at me, he needs you. 16:56 And so it's hard not to get chocked outside like that but-- 17:03 It's hardened for me not to get chocked up 17:04 and I wasn't even there. 17:06 You know, its just in that moment I just began 17:09 and it was a long time coming down from that 17:12 and even longer getting my voice back 17:14 because by then I think it was just worst bringing 17:16 and I was still screaming at the top of my lungs. 17:20 And it was-- I think hearing my younger brother say 17:24 that was it did something spiritually in the room 17:29 because literally the color of the room changed at that point 17:32 and things began to take a turn. 17:37 So to answer your question that was the turning point, 17:40 that was the day and it was literally a whip around. 17:43 And remember I went into it on faith and faith alone. 17:47 I had-- I was sure I was gonna change my dad 17:49 and I am still sure of that. 17:52 But I knew I could because my dad does strive 17:54 to allow God in the best way he possibly can 17:57 and who knows what brain damage now he has 18:00 that he his carry with him from his childhood as well. 18:05 Not's the true that's the really big truth. 18:06 Oh, it's so true, it's just so-- 18:09 We walk away generation after generation 18:11 after generation into somebody says 18:13 you know what it stops here it cannot continue from here. 18:17 Right, that's right and I guess 18:21 you know in my family 18:22 I was called be that stopping point and that-- 18:25 So let me just say with your dad 18:27 you have that moment totally now down, 18:30 totally losing control. 18:33 God getting both your attention with that statement 18:37 as He needs you, so a little bit a change 18:40 starts to happen seeps in that relationship 18:44 and what about your mom? 18:46 Because a whole time 18:47 she is probably trying to fix something. 18:50 She-- when my dad and I used to get into it like that 18:54 or anything even close to that 18:55 mom would hang around for a bit 18:57 but she kind of had some sort of symptom 18:59 that she will look for, some sort of gauge 19:02 where it would go and she would say 19:04 if you guys don't cool it I'm calling the cops 19:06 and then she would remove herself from the area. 19:09 And I think that kind have happened in this case 19:12 because it was pretty much just my dad and I spending the day. 19:14 I think everybody in my family realize something life 19:17 is was someway inevitable knowing my dad and knowing me. 19:23 Unfortunately I think it was gonna have to happen. 19:26 I don't really advocate, I'm and not saying 19:28 this is a template that anybody should follow. 19:31 It was a horrible experience I mean, really 19:35 and but it did open the door, 19:38 you know, and this was the important thing. 19:40 It opened the door to a relationship with my dad. 19:42 And why was that important? 19:43 Well, other than hopefully the obvious really 19:46 I felt that the Holy Spirit it called me at that-- 19:50 and this was a like a long calling. 19:51 It was after I got out of the college 19:52 and I am wondering okay, I got a degree 19:54 and now what, you know. 19:55 I was in that frame of mind 19:57 and really it wasn't-- it just dawned on me. 20:00 You need to get in a relationship with your father 20:02 and I certainly on my own never would of-- 20:04 I would have continued to go 20:06 through my whole life even loving God 20:08 and everything sincerely protecting myself 20:11 emotionally from my father. 20:12 And you know because we work with adverse people 20:15 all over the world there's so many people 20:18 that are gonna hear this and get it. 20:19 You know, that do I reconcile with this craziness? 20:25 You know, I don't even know have to change it 20:26 and the other person I am looking at has no clue 20:29 that there as damages they are and you're asking me 20:32 to move back into the relationship, 20:34 how do we do that? 20:35 But in faith what you saying is that crisis 20:38 I am started that for you, started that journey for you. 20:42 Yes, all that. 20:43 And during you wish you could say 20:44 and the next day dad was so different. 20:48 You know we wish you could say that 20:49 but that's not what happen is this the next day 20:52 you were little different. 20:54 The next day when I could talk again later in that evening 20:57 my dad was down in his study and I walked on 21:01 and I put my hand on my dad shoulder 21:03 and I looked at him and I say dad, 21:05 let's just bury the hatchet. 21:07 And my dad said I can bold on my shoulder 21:09 for about five minutes 21:11 and he said this is what he said 21:14 if can say it without bothering myself 21:16 because I wasn't bothering down 21:17 I mean in my heart was pretty steely after all that. 21:21 But I realize I was being 21:22 let alternately thank God, by God 21:24 and I just thought let's bury the hatchet 21:26 and he stood up and he said you truly are a man of God. 21:30 That's what he said and I thought well, 21:31 that providential right there. 21:34 Amen. 21:35 So, because well-- 21:37 So you say with dad and you said your mom 21:40 tended to kind of just wait until, you know, whatever 21:44 and I'll call the police if it doesn't calm down. 21:48 But would-- did she ever start to say 21:53 you know let's get healthy, 21:54 let's kind of heal, let's talk about this, 21:58 let's do whatever would-- 21:59 because I getting kind of a picture of your dad 22:01 and even of his childhood I get somewhat of a picture 22:05 but your mom I don't get any sense of who she was. 22:08 That's interesting. 22:12 My mom I think is and was an enabler 22:20 to my fathers stuff. 22:23 So explain to the people that have no idea 22:25 what enabling means, what is that mean? 22:29 Well, to me it means that rather than do 22:33 what you just describe, rather than take one person 22:36 or the other or calling outside help 22:40 not only to save the moment but also to fix the problem 22:46 because my mom loves her family, her children 22:49 and she wants things workout. 22:52 She doesn't do that. 22:54 She-- her first duty is to protect her husband 22:57 this is my perception of my mother 22:59 and in doing that when there is bad stuff going on 23:02 when you protect somebody in their long doing 23:07 you're enabling. 23:09 And nothing changes? 23:10 And nothing changes 23:11 and usually gets worse over time. 23:13 Lot of times with enabling I am just been able to say, 23:16 okay, come on, stop let's go eat, its time to eat. 23:20 And the table is set perfectly and everybody sits 23:23 and we just had this incredible storm that just went through 23:25 and nobody talks about this storm. 23:27 You know, they talk what the elephant in the living 23:29 and nobody talks about the elephant, 23:31 nobody talks about the anger 23:33 and yet everybody now is dressed properly 23:36 is saying grace, the day goes on. 23:40 We are gonna go ahead and take a break 23:41 because to me the most important thing 23:45 about any of this, the most important thing 23:48 about realize and where we've come from 23:50 and where we kind of get our anger 23:53 and our junk from is that what do we do with it next? 23:56 What is that look like next especially in Ralph's life. 23:59 And stay with us because man, 24:02 its not an easy journey to know that in your toolkit 24:06 I have this in my toolkit 24:07 I don't have a lot of things to pull from 24:09 and God has to teach me. 24:11 And so man, we're gonna explore that when you come back. |
Revised 2015-01-01