Engage

Faith Vs. Feeling

Three Angels Broadcasting Network

Program transcript

Participants: Jay Rosario & Daniel McGrath (Host), Michael Eihm

Home

Series Code: E

Program Code: E000027


00:18 Hello again, and welcome to another
00:20 exciting segment of "Engage."
00:22 In this series of programs we've been addressing
00:24 a lot of very relevant issues
00:27 facing young adults all over the world.
00:30 Joining me today is my good friend Dan McGrath.
00:32 Dan, how's it going? Pretty good.
00:33 How are you? Doing all right.
00:34 So, Dan, what are we gonna be talking about today?
00:35 Well, today we're looking at faith versus feeling.
00:38 A lot of young people today
00:39 are struggling with their faith.
00:42 Their experience doesn't always
00:43 match up with their theology.
00:45 And so the tendency is to give up
00:46 the theology for the experience.
00:48 When in reality, we need to learn how to match the two
00:50 because the Bible speaks a lot about that.
00:52 And, uh, we have very special guest today.
00:54 His name is Michael Eihm.
00:55 And Michael we're glad you're here.
00:56 Thanks for coming. How're you doing today?
00:59 I'm really good. How's it going, Michael?
01:01 Michael, we're very happy that you're here.
01:02 Um, I know you. And Dan knows you, of course.
01:06 Michael, we've been-- this is of course
01:08 a young adult program, we've been
01:10 addressing young adults have had
01:12 many different guests that have been young adults.
01:15 And how--do you consider yourself a young adult?
01:19 Absolutely. Absolutely?
01:21 If I feel that from the ages of
01:23 one to ninety-nine, you're a young adult.
01:25 Oh, well, then you qualify. You qualify that.
01:27 So, Michael, for those that are not familiar with who you are,
01:30 maybe just kind of share a little bit about
01:33 what you're currently doing, where you're from,
01:35 just a little so we get a gist of who you are.
01:37 Well, currently I live in
01:40 a tiny little box in Berrien Springs.
01:43 Box 403. Tiny little box?
01:44 That's right. No, I'm in Berrien Springs.
01:47 What're you doing in Berrien Springs?
01:48 I'm at Andrews University. You're at Andrews University?
01:51 And you're not in your 20s? I'm not in my 20s.
01:53 And you're at Andrews University?
01:54 I'm at Andrews University. Wow.
01:55 Undergraduate. Undergraduate.
01:56 You're taking theology? Awesome. Yeah.
01:58 Went back to school to finish up
01:59 of what God had started in me.
02:00 And are you originally from Berrien Springs?
02:02 No, I'm not. Where are you originaally from?
02:04 Wisconsin. You're from Wisconsin.
02:05 So not too far from Berrien Springs? No.
02:07 So I understand that not only are you
02:09 a student in the undergraduate program there,
02:11 but you're also involved in something there with--
02:15 what are you involved with?
02:16 I'm the president of the AMA which is
02:18 Andrews Ministerial Association.
02:20 It's a club of the religion department there.
02:22 Okay, so is it kind of like a campus club
02:23 that facilitates programs, events?
02:26 Yeah, we work with the young theology
02:29 and religion students. Okay.
02:31 And we're bringing programming to them
02:32 and pastors of the campus to talk about issues that face
02:36 them or that they will be facing in the ministry.
02:39 Nice, nice. Well, Michael,
02:41 we're really excited to have you and, of course,
02:42 because of the nature of our program, well, you know,
02:45 time is very limited but we are gonna
02:47 talk about your story a little bit.
02:48 And we're also gonna kinda talk a little about
02:50 this whole issue with faith versus feeling.
02:52 And how young people get overwhelmed by feelings
02:54 and sometimes it's very difficult
02:56 to make rational decisions, but I understand
02:59 for those that are not gonna able to
03:01 listen to the whole program.
03:03 And because we're not gonna have the time
03:04 to get into all the intricate details.
03:06 I understand that your story has been published
03:09 in a magazine is what I've heard.
03:11 Is this true? What magazine is your story in?
03:13 Well, it's a magazine that was published
03:16 by the communications department at Andrews.
03:18 It's called "Envision Magazine."
03:19 And in it, they have different stories
03:23 of the students on campus.
03:24 And it is written and edited
03:27 and all put together by students.
03:31 And, yeah, so my story was in it.
03:32 So some of the-- not only are there--
03:36 'cause I've had actually seen the magazine.
03:38 So not only is your story there,
03:39 but you also have some pictures in there.
03:41 Oh, we're gonna talk about that.
03:42 So we're gonna talk a little bit about that
03:43 because when I saw the magazine,
03:44 I said, "That, that cannot be Michael."
03:46 And indeed it was Michael.
03:48 So, Michael, let's talk, let's start by talking
03:50 a little about this issue with feeling.
03:51 What is it about feelings that always seem to detour
03:57 young Christians in their faith?
03:59 You know, why is it that we tend to,
04:01 as young adults, always fall into feeling?
04:03 Now, of course, you're not--you're young at heart.
04:06 And, of course, but you've been--
04:07 you've been a young adult.
04:08 You know the challenges of that.
04:11 Why is that feel-- why is it that feelings
04:12 are so easily--why are we a easy victim, I guess,
04:16 young adults for feelings to kinda take over
04:19 and just kinda lead us out of control?
04:21 Well, I think it's natural that we want to feel things.
04:23 We want to taste things. We want to see things.
04:27 We want to be like Thomas.
04:29 The Doubting Thomas as he's called
04:31 who needed to feel or see Jesus
04:34 and His scars and all that, you know?
04:35 And so we base everything on that.
04:37 Interesting. So we're kind of like,
04:38 we wanna see things tangible.
04:40 We wanna be able to touch and feel, sometimes--
04:42 And then we believe. And then we believe.
04:43 And sometimes when we don't have that there,
04:45 we tend to lose faith and then
04:47 just kind of roll our feelings.
04:49 So tell us about maybe your home life.
04:51 What was it like, you know, growing up?
04:52 Did you grow up an Adventist?
04:53 Or, you know, tell us little bit about yourself.
04:55 Yeah, I grew up an Adventist.
04:57 Though my mom was the Adventist.
05:00 My dad wasn't stepfather.
05:02 And, uh, went to public school most of time.
05:06 And then went to Wisconsin Academy my senior year.
05:09 And then I went across the lake and I was
05:11 at Andrews University. So wait a second.
05:13 You went to Andrews University twice?
05:17 Now this is your second time at Andrews University?
05:20 So, what did you originally go to Andrews University for?
05:22 What were you studying? Theology.
05:24 You were taking theology? Really?
05:26 So how long did you last in Andrews University?
05:28 Uh, not long. I was there for about a semester.
05:31 I left. Um, I was having issues, and, uh, with faith.
05:36 And I'm looking at everyone else and I'm just not having
05:39 or feeling what they're feeling.
05:41 You know? So evidently,
05:42 if I'm not feeling what they're feeling, I left.
05:45 So then you went to Andrews University
05:47 and then you just weren't--
05:49 you were having an issue with your feeling.
05:51 It didn't feel right. So why didn't it feel right?
05:54 What was it about the environment
05:56 or even the beliefs that didn't jive with your feelings?
05:59 Well, you know, when they would sing songs, you know,
06:01 and we'd go to chapel and everyone's singing,
06:02 I wasn't feeling what they were singing.
06:04 When we sit in class and people would
06:07 passionately talk about things and about,
06:10 you know, these realms of God and all that.
06:11 I wasn't feeling that. And so I felt if
06:13 I wasn't feeling it, I didn't have faith.
06:15 It wasn't for me. Wow.
06:17 So I left. So where did you go?
06:20 You left, where'd you go to?
06:22 I went to Madison, Wisconsin.
06:24 And I thought I would go to school there
06:26 and get involved with a sports program
06:29 and, you know, finish a degree there.
06:32 So when you went to a Public University,
06:34 did you--did you gain your faith or what happened?
06:37 I never made it to classes.
06:39 I started hanging out in clubs there.
06:42 And I started going for other feeling there.
06:44 I started feeling what the world was feeling.
06:46 So it would be like drinks and, you know--
06:49 So you started drinking, started taking drugs.
06:51 Right. Where did you end up working?
06:54 Well, that took me, I ended up working at a night club.
06:58 And I had just more an interest in rock and roll.
07:00 And so basically, in short, went in rock and roll
07:04 and for 30 years I was in rock and roll.
07:07 For the better part of 30 years
07:09 and I toured with rock groups.
07:10 So how did your mother-- you know, of course,
07:14 your mother is the religious one in the home.
07:16 Um, you went to Andrews, you left to go to school
07:22 that you eventually didn't make it to your classes, et cetera.
07:24 How did she react to your deviation and your
07:28 detour and all of these vices and different things?
07:32 Well, of course, you know, like all mothers, you know,
07:33 I mean, she was a little disappointed.
07:36 But as a loving Christian, she kept praying
07:41 and she kept encouraging me to consider
07:44 different things in that, you know.
07:46 And write me nice letters and,
07:48 you know, that I still have actually.
07:52 But, yeah, I just continued on and,
07:55 you know, it was pretty sad at points.
07:56 I think that as I went through life
07:59 what I had put her through.
08:00 I mean, 'cause I would call her up--
08:01 I had a very open relationship with her.
08:03 And she says, "Oh, tell me what's going on in your life."
08:05 And so I would. And sometimes,
08:08 I think there's some things that should not be said.
08:10 You know, because it really tried her.
08:13 So were you the only sib-- were you the only child?
08:16 Or did you have siblings as well?
08:18 Yes, with my mother and my stepfather,
08:22 there was me, of course.
08:24 And then I had a sister.
08:26 Or have a sister named Randi.
08:28 And then I've, uh, I met my real father
08:30 a few years later and then I've got
08:32 a whole family over in Colorado.
08:35 So that's another story. That's another story.
08:38 Well, it sounds like, you know,
08:40 what I'm hearing you say is that you went to Andrews
08:43 as an Adventist in theology thinking maybe
08:46 you were gonna be a pastor in ministry for sometime.
08:49 And then your experience wasn't matching up
08:51 with what you thought you--it should be.
08:54 You know, your feelings were different,
08:55 so you left and you went to a Public University.
08:58 Then you kind of experimented
08:59 with the wrong crowd or the wrong drugs,
09:01 and you ended up in rock and roll.
09:02 Now from that time forward, are you searching
09:05 to have that feeling, that longing?
09:08 You know, what's going on inside?
09:10 Absolutely not.
09:12 It's funny is, you know, these feelings of the world,
09:14 I mean, they over-talked me.
09:18 I mean, you know, I started getting more involved,
09:21 you know, with the drinking.
09:22 And that all came on real slow, it wasn't--I just,
09:25 you know, walked from Andrews and I walked in the bar
09:27 and said, "Here, give me a drink."
09:28 So it was gradual. It was very gradual.
09:30 It actually started out with water.
09:31 And then it built up from that.
09:34 You went to the bars and asked for a glass of water?
09:36 Yeah, a glass of water with a little umbrella in it.
09:39 That's what I thought it was until
09:40 someone said, "Hey, uh, here."
09:41 And slid me a drink over and said, "Here, have this."
09:45 And it was a vodka.
09:47 And, well, I drank that back and spit it out,
09:49 not realizing that it was not water, you know, vodka's clear.
09:53 But anyways, enough about that,
09:56 it just kind of took me down that path
09:58 and I just got involved in
09:59 more and more of the music and the lifestyle.
10:02 And it's a very self-indulgent lifestyle.
10:06 You know, music, and basically anything
10:08 that's outside of God becomes self-indulgence.
10:11 You know, because we look within ourselves.
10:14 We build everything on feelings.
10:16 And that's what I was doing.
10:17 So my whole life was for 30 years
10:19 was built on what made me feel good.
10:22 What made you feel good. Yeah.
10:23 Now did you always feel good though?
10:25 When you were involved-- is it, was it 20 years,
10:28 how long were you in this lifestyle?
10:29 Yeah, I'd say- I would say, um,
10:30 I would say...been in rock and roll about 17 years,
10:33 you know, 20 years of-professionally.
10:36 'Cause it sounds like you kinda pursued
10:38 this lifestyle because it felt good.
10:39 It feels good. Right.
10:41 But did it always feel good within those 17 years?
10:46 Yeah, I mean, yeah, I mean, it did, I mean, it's like,
10:50 you know, I mean, there are things that,
10:51 you know, you-- if you weren't feeling good,
10:53 you take a pill for this.
10:55 You know, off you-- So then when moments came
10:57 where you didn't feel good, like maybe the morning
10:59 after a big party or what have you,
11:01 then you took something
11:02 to kind of take the bad feeling away.
11:06 So it's almost like you were escaping the feelings
11:09 that sometimes would emerge, that weren't good.
11:11 Yeah, well, those, I mean, you would have feelings.
11:13 I remember being at an ACDC concert
11:15 and standing in the wings and not too long
11:19 after I left Andrews and I hadthought,
11:22 it was a Friday night.
11:23 And I remember looking out over the crowd,
11:25 I see all their lighters on and I thought, man,
11:27 tonight they're probably back at Andrews, former students.
11:31 They're, you know, pastors young--
11:33 to be young pastors, had their shoes all shined
11:36 and they're in bed and they're looking forward
11:37 to waking up for being involved in the Sabbath.
11:39 While I'm here, you know,
11:41 hundreds of miles away partying.
11:43 And this was to be my life, and those thoughts
11:47 would--I'm not gonna say they didn't escape me,
11:49 because they were always there.
11:50 The Sabbath issues were there.
11:51 I mean, you couldn't help but think those for some reason.
11:55 But pretty soon, I just got to the point that, um,
11:58 when you asked about my mom and I called her up
12:00 and I said, "Listen, take my name off the books.
12:04 You know, get a hold of the church and have me removed."
12:07 By that time, I was doing stuff like Ozzy Osbourne.
12:10 It was in the newspaper, the things that he was doing.
12:12 And my mom was saying, "This guy, uh,
12:14 he's not really living right."
12:17 And I said, "Yeah, take my name off the books,"
12:19 because I didn't want to have this with the lifestyle
12:23 that I was leading be represented, I mean,
12:28 I actually, point blank is if something happened to me,
12:30 if I died, I didn't want my obituary to say,
12:31 "Oh, he was an Adventist." Right.
12:33 Because I love, you know, my friends were back at school
12:38 and my mom and all that, that I did not wanna blight
12:41 the Adventist with my type of lifestyle.
12:43 So take me off the book. Wow.
12:45 So now in that lifestyle, of course,
12:47 I understand you traveled all over the world.
12:49 Well, not necessarily all over the world.
12:51 But mostly, you know, North America, South America.
12:55 You know, didn't make it to Dominican.
12:56 So at least in the western hemisphere.
12:59 You traveled North America and South America.
13:01 Yeah. And you were involved in what?
13:03 What were you doing traveling?
13:04 Well, basically there was three things I was involved with.
13:06 Primarily, I was involved with merchandising.
13:08 And so I was do merchandise, uh, T-shirts,
13:10 and stuff like that for the bands.
13:12 For the rockstar bands. Yeah. Okay.
13:14 And then the second thing that I would do, is called...
13:20 Well, I guess you'd say
13:22 tour management, one of the things that--
13:24 So you're the one who answered the phone calls,
13:25 kind of set up the gigs. Right.
13:27 Make sure the rooms are of-- you know,
13:28 the hotel rooms or flights.
13:32 So you were an important person in the rock band,
13:34 'cause if it wasn't for you they had no place to stay.
13:36 I was a glorified babysitter.
13:37 You were a glorified babysitter.
13:38 That's a good way of putting it.
13:40 What was the third thing, that, uh--
13:41 Well, the other thing I was gonna say
13:43 was that I worked with corporate sponsorship.
13:45 And so at that time, especially in 80s-
13:47 I'm dating myself here-is, um-
13:50 We were alive back then, don't worry.
13:51 Yeah. You guys were-- Mid-80s.
13:55 And, uh, yeah, well, anyways,
13:57 the sports-the sponsorship at that time
14:00 involved with corporations like Rolling Stones
14:04 with like, Jovan, um, cologne and all that.
14:07 No one probably knows what that is anymore.
14:09 Or David Bowie with the Sony Music, Holla Note,
14:14 Canada Dry, you know, various groups
14:17 were involved with these, uh, corporations.
14:21 And so I would go out as a corporate liaison
14:24 between the businessmen, the suits, and the long-hairs.
14:28 The long hairs. And, uh, yeah.
14:29 So, I mean, Michael, that sounds like a blast.
14:32 Sounds like you were living the time of your life.
14:35 What happened? What happened?
14:36 How did you-- in the 17 years or plus
14:39 that you were involved in that. What happened?
14:41 What happened the 17th year, uh, so to speak?
14:44 All right.
14:45 Um, well, I'll keep this short,
14:47 'cause let's save it for a book, but--
14:49 Or the magazine that's published.
14:50 Or the magazine, yeah.
14:51 Um, basically is that one night in a club
14:55 after many years of what I've been through,
14:58 you know, like five years ago, six years ago.
15:01 I, was, in an adult nightclub, running an adult nightclub.
15:07 And I started considering where my life had taken me.
15:11 And I was also considering the people that I was
15:14 working with in where their lives were at.
15:16 And I started realizing that every night,
15:19 different person on the stage or sitting around them
15:22 or dancing on the stage or the bartenders and all that.
15:24 But same kind of conversations going on.
15:27 You know, every night different person, same conversation.
15:30 And the din of all this, you know,
15:32 started to effect me and I thought it was all vanity.
15:35 And I thought they are all vain.
15:38 And of course, we never look at ourselves--
15:39 Right. Outward thing.
15:41 We look at the outward thing.
15:42 Until one night I applied that to myself.
15:46 You know, am I vain?
15:47 And it shot back to me, saying,
15:48 "Well, you're the vainest one of them all."
15:50 And I went home at night,
15:55 thinking about this, put on the TV.
15:57 Nothing on TV but a black gospel preacher.
16:00 And he started talking about vanity.
16:03 And took me to Ecclesiastes.
16:05 You know, and so I ended up reading
16:07 Ecclesiastes and it really spoke to me.
16:09 And after that, several months after that, I mean,
16:12 I left the club actually about five weeks later,
16:15 just walked out on all that.
16:17 And then six months later, I got ready to get baptized.
16:21 Wow. So wait a second, wait a second.
16:23 Wow, that was a bit fast. Yes.
16:25 Six months after that, you were ready to get baptized. How?
16:29 How would you-how'd you get prepared for baptism?
16:30 Well, I had left club.
16:35 And then I just decided that what I'll do for four months
16:38 is that I'll do is read the Bible and work out at a gym.
16:41 And that's how I started doing that,
16:42 but then I decided that I need a community.
16:44 I had answer--or I had questions I needed to ask.
16:48 And so I didn't want nothing to do with the Adventists.
16:51 Right. Growing up as an Adventist-
16:52 Adventist and all that,
16:53 you know, I didn't want to do that.
16:55 You know, I had some issues there.
16:56 And so I went to a nondenominational church.
16:59 Long story short on that.
17:02 What's crazy is that they turned out to be
17:04 a bunch of ex-Adventists. Oh, wow.
17:06 So you went--So let me understand this correctly.
17:08 So you didn't want--nothing to do with the Adventists,
17:11 you went to a nondenominational church
17:13 to avoid the Adventists, and when you went in there,
17:15 you found a lot of former Adventists.
17:16 And as I was studying with them, Jay,
17:19 is that I thought, okay, God led me here, of course,
17:21 and I'm thinking, as I'll study with them,
17:22 I'll find out what's all wrong with the Adventists.
17:24 And didn't want nothing to do with them, you know,
17:27 I couldn't but help get into these conversations with them,
17:30 because they were still hurting about things
17:33 and stuff and their decision
17:34 was to leave was for various reasons.
17:37 But I would find out what they were and I ended up
17:41 studying my way back in to Adventist.
17:43 Amen. You know, because--
17:46 Well, can you, you know, just tell us a little bit, you know,
17:49 maybe you have something to share from the Bible
17:50 about how faith and feeling should work because,
17:54 you know, obviously, from your experience,
17:56 something wasn't matching up, and now it is.
17:58 And you're back at Andrews again, you know,
18:00 studying theology which you've put off for 30 years.
18:03 And fulfilling the Lord's call.
18:05 But what is it about faith and feeling that
18:06 you think our viewers might, you know, need to know today?
18:10 Well, I'ma tell you first, is that we don't get our
18:12 faith from looking at other people. Okay?
18:16 Our faith comes from the Word of God.
18:18 Our faith should be grounded in God.
18:22 And as we read the Bible,
18:25 we need to believe what's in that Bible. Okay?
18:28 And then hold that dear to us
18:29 when contradictory things come up,
18:31 we need to go back to the Bible again.
18:34 But for the viewing audience,
18:37 I would have to say is that they need to hold on to God,
18:41 and not the things of this world.
18:45 Meaning that, staying focused on Him.
18:50 Not--not supplanting that with,
18:53 "Oh, I'm not feeling good today,
18:54 therefore God doesn't love me."
18:55 God is always there. God always loves you.
18:57 You know, and God is there
18:58 in our Bibles if we study that, yeah.
19:01 So it seems that what you're saying is that
19:02 our feelings are very inconsistent by nature.
19:05 Right. You know,
19:06 one day I wake up and I'm just whistling very, very happy.
19:09 The next day is I wake up and "don't come near me."
19:12 You have a cold. Oh, yeah,
19:14 maybe I have a cold.
19:16 But I think what you're saying is that
19:18 the Bible is something that is sure,
19:20 something that is consistent, something that doesn't change.
19:24 You know, the weather changes our moods,
19:26 but the weather doesn't change the word.
19:28 So I think if I hear you correctly,
19:29 I think what you're saying is if our faith
19:32 is based on the word and our feelings,
19:34 the word of God is something that is constant
19:37 and it's not gonna have that up and down
19:40 inconsistency, but rather,
19:42 is going to be something solid.
19:44 It's gonna be something substantial.
19:46 Right. Did I hear you right?
19:47 Is that kinda what you're saying?
19:48 Exactly, exactly.
19:49 In fact, I had a text here that I brought,
19:51 that's James 1:22 and in James 1:22,
19:59 it says, "But be doers of the word,
20:01 and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.
20:04 For if anyone is a hearer of the word, and not a doer,
20:07 he is like a man observing his natural face in a mirror."
20:11 And I think that has a lot of application there.
20:13 You know, that we need to be
20:15 looking into the face of God and in the Bible.
20:19 And doing what He says that we find in the word here.
20:23 And not by what the natural world tells us to do.
20:26 Yeah, I like this Bible text.
20:28 You know, we need to be hearers--
20:29 we're not just hearers, but doers.
20:31 And the very next verse is because, you know,
20:33 if you observe yourself, you go away and then you
20:35 immediately forget what kind of man you are.
20:36 Right. That's right.
20:37 When you look in the mirror, you forget what you
20:39 look like or, you know, you forget how much makeup
20:41 you put on or didn't put on, you know,
20:42 for the TV show, you forget.
20:45 And so, but if you're doing it,
20:46 it's always whether you're remembering it and living it.
20:50 Now, Michael, let's look at the counter aspect to this.
20:54 You know, feelings are important.
20:57 You know, sometimes feelings
20:58 are a gauge that something is not right.
21:01 You know, you mentioned a cold or sometimes you feel.
21:04 You call in. Right?
21:05 I'm sure you call in to your professors and say,
21:07 "Oh, professor, I'm not feeling good."
21:10 And usually, that doesn't fly, right?
21:12 But sometimes when we say, you know,
21:13 "I'm not feeling good," feelings are sometimes
21:15 a good gauge that something is not right.
21:18 Something is wrong. So how do we differentiate?
21:21 The young adults thinking, well, wait a second,
21:22 you know, I mean, biologically,
21:23 if I don't feel good, that means that
21:25 there's something biologically wrong.
21:27 How come it doesn't work that way spiritually,
21:29 or does it work spiritually?
21:30 That's a good question. Can it work spiritually?
21:32 Yes, and yes, it does.
21:34 How I would answer that, first of all,
21:35 we have to look as faith as an action word.
21:38 As we said there to be doers of the word, right?
21:41 It's an action word, okay?
21:43 Feelings aren't an action word. They are what causes action.
21:47 And a lot of times, in most times,
21:49 feelings of the natural world are the wrong actions.
21:52 The wrong choices. And so--
21:55 So then faith would be proactive.
21:56 Feelings would be reactive. Correct, correct.
21:59 So faith is actually like an engine.
22:01 Feelings would be like the cars or the caboose behind it.
22:05 Some days they may be there and some days they may not.
22:07 But we don't base the train upon the caboose.
22:10 That's not what's pushing the train.
22:12 It's the engine of faith that propels us forward.
22:17 You know, towards God.
22:18 And this is what's an important thing about
22:21 is that if we have this faith in God,
22:23 this engine of faith in God, it's the driving force
22:27 that's within us for us as Christians.
22:29 We don't need to see certain things to accept God, you know?
22:35 We have this faith that leads us forward.
22:39 And any feelings that come after that out of faith,
22:43 you know, is possible and it does happen.
22:46 I mean, I know that there have been times
22:49 that were that I will think about things
22:52 what God has done for me or what Christ has done for me.
22:54 You know, where he pulled me
22:56 out of the lifestyle that I was in.
22:58 And my heart can weep because of the things
23:02 when I realize, you know, that what I have done,
23:05 it might have hurt someone and, um, from my actions.
23:08 And so now my feelings then are more
23:11 feelings of repentance, you know,
23:12 the feelings of joy because--
23:14 Which are positive feelings. They're positive, yeah.
23:16 So it seems what you're saying is that feelings
23:18 actually can be trained, if I'm hearing you correctly.
23:21 That sometimes when you focus on
23:22 faith and not feelings, when you focus on your faith,
23:25 your feelings are gonna be conditioned,
23:27 they're gonna be transformed, and they're gonna changed.
23:29 So now you're gonna feel the right feelings
23:31 of repentance when you need to repent.
23:33 The right feelings of joy when you need to have joy.
23:35 And I think Biblically, when you look at
23:39 the Bible characters, there are times
23:41 where it didn't feel good to do the will of God.
23:43 It didn't feel good to move on forward.
23:45 It didn't feel good for Moses to go into water and say,
23:49 you know, have the faith that it was actually gonna split.
23:51 It didn't feel good for Abraham
23:53 to go up that mountain to sacrifice his son.
23:55 But what came after was a flood of
23:58 awesome feelings that were divine,
24:00 that were celestial, that were inspiring
24:02 and I think if a young person is struggling with feelings
24:06 to do something that they know needs to be done,
24:09 I think one encouragement
24:11 is to remember that after you do that,
24:13 there's gonna be amazing feelings.
24:16 So don't get consumed by the feelings
24:18 that you have prior to doing what you need to do.
24:22 Yeah, I think that's a good point.
24:24 I know sometimes, you know, I don't always feel like
24:27 preaching on Sabbath morning,
24:28 but I'm a pastor and that's what I have to do.
24:31 And I have to do it every Sabbath.
24:32 So there's some Sabbaths where I just wake up
24:34 and I wish that I did not have to preach and--
24:37 We should've put a DVD in or something.
24:38 You know, I wish, or I've had--
24:40 realized that I was gonna feel this way
24:41 and got a guest speaker or got
24:42 Jay Rosario to come to my church.
24:44 And, you know, but sometimes I think
24:46 the devil will put that feeling there because
24:48 he knows that this sermon is gonna have greater results.
24:50 Absolutely. Right.
24:51 And we need to realize through faith,
24:53 we can see through the feeling--the bad feeling.
24:57 And press forward, because we know
24:59 that the Lord is working. Michael, in 30 seconds,
25:02 what message could you give to somebody
25:04 viewing our program right now that is struggling?
25:07 They're kind of tied down with their feelings.
25:10 They want to do what is right, but they're just feel--
25:12 they're just 100% out of control,
25:14 and their feelings are kind of at the driver seat.
25:16 What's the message that you could give them
25:18 practical message of counsel
25:20 from an experienced person like yourself?
25:22 First I would say, is pray.
25:25 Pray, pray, pray that God will impress upon you.
25:29 Impress upon your heart. You know.
25:34 To let go of those feelings and go to the faith.
25:37 Go to the faith that God is there.
25:38 That God is going to bring you through this.
25:41 He's always there.
25:44 That says basically what I'd have to say to that,
25:46 you know, that have faith in God
25:47 that He will pull you through.
25:49 And abandon those feelings. Abandon 'em.
25:53 Just like that, it's almost like
25:55 having the right perspective, like, if you look at this,
25:58 you're gonna feel like this. Right.
26:00 If you look at that, you're gonna feel like this.
26:01 If I look at the possibility,
26:03 if I just dwell upon the possibility it's a failure
26:06 and discouragement, I'm gonna feel that way.
26:08 But if I focus on Christ,
26:10 focus on the possibilities of victory,
26:11 focus on-and that's why the word is so powerful
26:13 because when you focus on it,
26:15 it has a positive effect on your life
26:18 and you begin to feel the proper feelings.
26:22 I think there's so much that could be touched
26:23 and once again I just wanna encourage
26:26 those that are viewing to look up
26:28 the Envision magazines to get the rest of story.
26:31 Michael, we're so happy that you're with us.
26:34 And we're really blessed to have you.
26:35 And you're back at Andrews and you're gonna be
26:36 graduating very, very soon, hopefully very, very soon.
26:41 May be there's somebody watching this program
26:42 who can definitely resonate with this
26:44 issue of faith versus feeling.
26:46 Maybe you're a young person that knows that
26:49 you have to do something that God is asking you to do.
26:53 Maybe God is bringing conviction upon your hearts.
26:55 Maybe you feel overwhelmed.
26:57 Maybe you feel like you can't move forward
27:00 because you're surrounded by your feelings.
27:02 Whatever the situation may be,
27:03 hopefully this program has encouraged you
27:05 that if you focus your attention on Christ,
27:08 if you focus your attention on positive things,
27:10 then your feelings, right feelings will follow.
27:13 Look at the powerful examples of scripture,
27:16 look at Moses, look at Abraham,
27:17 but more importantly, look at Jesus.
27:19 Jesus was on the cross of Calvary.
27:21 And prior to going to the cross of Calvary,
27:23 He was in the Garden of Gethsemane
27:24 and it didn't feel good to him to move forward.
27:26 In fact, he prayed three times
27:27 "my father, my father is it possible?
27:29 If it is possible, let this cup pass from me."
27:31 But then He said, "Not my will,
27:33 but your will be done."
27:34 And because of the joy that was set before Him,
27:36 because He saw the results of what the cross
27:38 was going to do, He saw millions of redeemed people
27:41 saved because of that sacrifice.
27:43 And that's exactly what we need to do.
27:45 We need to follow in that same example.
27:47 Look ahead by faith and recognize that after you
27:50 obey the Lord, there's gonna be a flood
27:53 of powerful and positive feelings.
27:55 Thank you so much for tuning in.
27:57 Hopefully, we can see you next time.
27:59 God bless you. Take care.


Home

Revised 2014-12-17