House Calls

Discipleship Part 2

Three Angels Broadcasting Network

Program transcript

Participants: John Lomacang (Host), John Stanton

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Series Code: HCL

Program Code: HCL170005A


00:01 Hello, friends, grab your Bible and a friend and sit back
00:03 as we explore God's word together
00:05 on this edition of House Calls.
00:25 Welcome to House Calls, my name is John Lomacang,
00:28 this is the program that you want to be watching
00:30 so don't turn away and his name is John Stanton,
00:33 good to have you here, John.
00:34 It's good to be here again.
00:36 I tell you, we are continuing our track
00:37 in this very important topic on Discipleship,
00:40 so we are very pleased
00:42 that you've taken the time to join us.
00:44 Hopefully you have your Bibles and your pens
00:46 and I like to make it rhyme,
00:48 invite your family and your friends.
00:49 And, John, give us some preview
00:51 of kind of what we're gonna be talking about
00:52 as far as Discipleship,
00:54 that's your area in the conference.
00:55 Yeah, we in the last program we talked about discipleship
00:59 and it's impact on the church, and accomplishing its mission
01:03 and how important it was.
01:05 And this one we're gonna talk about discipleship
01:08 what it looks like in the eyes of Christ.
01:11 He gave four conditions of discipleship,
01:13 we're going to talk about those.
01:14 Okay, wonderful and we look forward to that.
01:16 And as you know we always invite you to join us
01:20 for this program, because it's very important.
01:22 However, before we do anything, before we answer questions
01:25 or go into the Bible, we always begin with prayer.
01:28 John, would you pray for us? Yes.
01:30 Gracious Father in heaven,
01:31 we again ask for Your presence here
01:33 to be with us.
01:35 We know that we cannot open Your word
01:37 and rightly divide it
01:38 without the leading of your Holy Spirit and so,
01:41 please Lord help us today,
01:43 and touch the hearts and minds of those
01:45 that are listening or hearing this program,
01:48 and to just pray that you would prepare a blessing
01:51 for each one of us as we study together
01:53 in Jesus' name, amen.
01:54 Amen. Thank you, John.
01:57 As many of you know that if you watch this program
01:59 before we have questions that we like to entertain.
02:01 I get the snail mail.
02:04 John gets the ones from the internet.
02:06 I get the ones from the internet also,
02:09 but if you have any questions you'd like to send to us,
02:11 here's the information you need,
02:12 send those to housecalls@3abn.org
02:15 That's housecalls@3abn.org,
02:19 and try to make them concise and to the point.
02:22 You surely do increase your chance of having
02:24 those questions read and answered on the program
02:27 and we appreciate everything you do
02:29 for this network as we go and grow looking forward
02:32 to the coming of our Lord and Savior.
02:35 John, what's our first question for today?
02:37 What do you have? I got a question from Janelle.
02:39 All right.
02:40 And she writes here that her husband
02:42 and her are confused about Genesis 1.
02:45 Okay.
02:46 It's speaking about creation stating that the evening
02:49 and the morning was the first day
02:50 and the second day and the third day and so on.
02:53 Could you please explain the evening
02:56 and morning as a day
02:58 and not being evening to evening?
03:00 So a good question and I think
03:02 there's a fairly simple answer to this.
03:06 Moses who wrote the Book of Genesis,
03:09 obviously wrote as a Hebrew and very much understood
03:16 the culture of the Hebrews and from a very early on,
03:19 a time early on where Jesus called them as His people,
03:22 He gave them a clarity
03:25 as to what encompassed each day.
03:29 And contrary to what we practice here
03:32 in our modern society,
03:34 modern culture is that the day started
03:38 when the sun went down, not when the sun came up.
03:42 Our emphasis here is when the sun comes up,
03:44 the day gets started, but not so much back then.
03:48 The Hebrews saw the day starting
03:50 when the sun went down
03:52 and it entered into the evening hours,
03:54 and so what Moses is simply saying here
03:57 is that the day that begins in the evening
04:00 and ends during the day was the period of time
04:03 that creation occurred.
04:04 That's right.
04:06 So he's simply using terminology
04:07 that it was in their own understanding,
04:09 their culture, what they were familiar,
04:12 very familiar with practicing.
04:14 To us it sounds a little strange,
04:15 but to them it made a lot of sense.
04:17 Very simple, in a nutshell he's simply saying
04:20 that the evening and the morning
04:22 are a part of the day.
04:25 The reason why he started with the evening
04:26 is because when the Lord began creation in Genesis 1,
04:29 the Bible says, darkness moved on the...
04:33 the earth is without form and void and darkness,
04:36 there was darkness first, so the day always begins
04:39 at the dark part.
04:42 When the day ends it goes back into the dark part,
04:45 but the day is made up of the evening and the morning.
04:49 You know, John, I thought it was interesting
04:50 that when we get to midnight a lot of people think,
04:52 okay, it's 12:01, it's now Tuesday,
04:55 you know, first minute into Tuesday
04:57 or 12 o'clock and one second,
05:00 they think is one second into the next day,
05:03 but it's called midnight for a reason,
05:06 because the night has already begun
05:07 when the sunset
05:09 and that's why you hear the meteorologist say
05:11 sunset tonight is or sunrise tomorrow morning,
05:14 and then we get to noon lunchtime as we would say,
05:17 we say mid day, so the day already started
05:21 and the night already started
05:22 and the Bible's reckoning is clear.
05:25 But another question we have here.
05:28 Lincoln from Belize, I've been to Belize,
05:32 love that country,
05:33 it's beautiful not too far off shore
05:36 and Belize is a set of coral reef
05:38 that's almost like the reef out in Australia,
05:41 beautiful, people go to Belize
05:42 for diving and clear, clear waters.
05:45 I didn't get a chance to go,
05:46 but thank you for sending the question.
05:49 I didn't get a chance to go to the reef that is,
05:51 but the question is,
05:52 "Why is the Sabbath so important?"
05:55 Well, let's go first of all to Exodus 20,
05:59 I'll show you the reason why it is important.
06:02 Will begin in Exodus 20 and matter of fact
06:06 in my Bible I could turn there quicker,
06:08 we have these digital Bibles nowadays,
06:10 they are lot of fun but you know
06:12 when you could rightly divide the word of truth
06:13 by turning there, it sure does make it a lot easier.
06:16 Exodus 20 and we're going to look together at first verse 8
06:22 and then verse, portions of verse 10.
06:26 We're gonna read 8, 9 and 10.
06:28 Now first of all...
06:29 The context here are the Ten Commandments.
06:31 The context is,
06:32 are the Ten Commandments, exactly.
06:33 Ten Commandments, not ten suggestions,
06:36 not nine commandments and one suggestion,
06:39 because oftentimes the Ten Commandments
06:41 are handled as though they are nine commandments
06:44 and one suggestion, but the one suggestion
06:46 that people often forget
06:48 "suggestion they make it seem that way
06:52 but there are Ten Commandments, none of those are suggestions."
06:57 Verse 8 of Exodus 20, the reason why it is important
07:01 is because it begins with the word remember, remember.
07:06 When God says, "Remember," it's a serious injunction.
07:10 You know, we have a couple of remembers in the Bible,
07:13 one is remember Lot's wife.
07:16 Remember Lot's wife, what's the lesson there John?
07:18 What was the lesson? What did she do?
07:20 Yeah, I suppose she turned back
07:22 looking at the world that she left behind
07:24 and turned into a pillar of salt.
07:25 That's right so, the lesson there is don't,
07:28 when God says, "Go forward, don't turn back."
07:30 Don't even look back and she looked back
07:33 and that's why the question, it's a simple verse remember
07:36 "Lot's wife," just those three words.
07:40 And then the other one is in Ecclesiastes 12:1,
07:44 "Remember now the creator in the days of your youth."
07:48 Well, nobody would argue with the fact
07:50 that young people need to know the Lord, right.
07:52 Young people today, one of the reasons our society,
07:55 and this is not just in the 2000s or 2017s
07:58 or whatever the case may be, but this is in all generations,
08:02 young people in every generation
08:04 have a tendency not to have a desire to know the Lord.
08:08 The world grabs on to the mind of the young people
08:10 whether it's the 50s
08:13 when it was out to a movie theaters
08:15 or when rock and roll begin to become...
08:18 I remember looking at some of the stories
08:19 when rock and roll began to surface,
08:21 young people just dove into that,
08:24 so we could see in every generation
08:26 from ancient times to the present,
08:28 young people need to know the Lord,
08:30 and nobody would argue,
08:32 if I said remember the creator while you're young,
08:34 nobody would say, well, that's not important.
08:37 But we get to the Sabbath and it says,
08:38 "Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy."
08:43 Not to make it holy,
08:44 we don't pick a day to make holy,
08:46 we simply choose the day the Lord has already made holy
08:49 and He says, "Remember it to keep it holy."
08:51 Now the question is why is it important?
08:54 Look at verse 10.
08:56 "But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord,
09:01 your God."
09:03 The question is who is your God?
09:07 When you honor the Sabbath, you are acknowledging
09:11 that the God of creation is your God,
09:14 so why is it important?
09:15 First of all he says, "Remember"
09:17 secondly if you identify with the Sabbath,
09:20 you identify with a God of creation.
09:22 Go to Genesis, look at Genesis 2.
09:27 Genesis 2 and then we're going to show one more here.
09:31 The Sabbath is important,
09:32 then we'll show one few more texts,
09:35 but the God of creation, when creation was done,
09:39 notice what the Bible tells us about the end of creation.
09:43 "Thus the heavens and the earth,
09:45 and all the host of them were finished."
09:48 Genesis 2:1, "And on the seventh day
09:51 God ended His work which He had done,
09:55 and He rested on the seventh day
09:58 from all His work which He had done.
10:00 And God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it,
10:05 because in it He rested from all His work
10:08 which He had created and made."
10:10 And so when he says in Exodus 20,
10:15 "For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth,"
10:17 Exodus 20:11, "For in six days
10:20 the Lord made the heavens and the earth,"
10:22 is taken us way back to when there was only Adam and Eve,
10:25 only two individuals.
10:27 No Jews, no Greeks, no other nationality,
10:30 just mom and dad, the beginning of creation.
10:34 So when you honor the Sabbath, you are saying,
10:37 "I am connected to the God of creation."
10:40 But there's one more thing.
10:41 Ezekiel, do you have Ezekiel 20, John,
10:44 go there and I want you to read for us
10:46 verse 12 and verse 20.
10:48 Ezekiel 20:12 and 20,
10:54 this is important, very important.
10:57 Okay.
10:59 "Moreover I gave them My Sabbath,
11:00 to be a sign between them and Me,
11:02 that they might know that I am the Lord
11:03 who sanctifies them."
11:05 Okay, first of all, when you honor the Sabbath,
11:07 it is a sign that you know that the Lord is the one
11:11 that sanctifies you, I thought that was interesting
11:14 because in Exodus chapter...
11:15 in Isaiah 66, one of the reasons Isaiah 65,
11:19 one of the reasons why people are going to be destroyed
11:22 is because they sanctify themselves,
11:25 but when you honor the Sabbath, you recognize that the Lord
11:28 is the one that is sanctifying you,
11:30 but there's something else, verse 20.
11:34 "Hallow My Sabbaths, and there will be a sign
11:37 between Me and you, that you may know
11:39 that I am the Lord, your God."
11:40 Right, so when you hallow the Sabbath,
11:42 you are saying the Lord of creation is my God.
11:48 Why is it so important?
11:50 It is a sign between you and God
11:52 that He's the one that sanctifies you.
11:55 It is a sign between you and God
11:57 that you acknowledge that He is your God.
12:00 Is it important to know that He is your God?
12:02 Yes.
12:04 "And this is life eternal," John 17:3,
12:06 "that you might know God, the only true God
12:09 and Jesus Christ whom He sent."
12:12 The only true God is the one that is connected to creation.
12:16 There are many God's, many lords,
12:19 we are told not to have any other god.
12:21 When you ignore the Sabbath, then you are saying,
12:24 I am not connected to the God of creation,
12:27 and there is no other god that can save you
12:29 but the Lord of creation.
12:32 What's interesting, John, is that it is,
12:36 the Sabbath has come under scrutiny.
12:37 I'm talking about the seventh day Sabbath,
12:39 this might come under scrutiny
12:40 because the accusation has been levied
12:43 by many Christians in the world as those that keep that day,
12:47 the seventh day from Friday sundown
12:49 to Saturday sundown are doing,
12:52 are gauging in legalistic works based system.
12:56 When what we just read shows exactly the opposite.
12:59 By keeping the Sabbath what God is saying
13:01 is that you're showing a dependency,
13:04 a faith relationship with me
13:05 trusting that I am the one that sanctifies you
13:08 and acknowledging that I am your God.
13:11 So the very opposite is actually true
13:13 and Satan works this way,
13:14 I mean he, he knows the Sabbath there's a blessing in that,
13:17 there's a connection between God as the Creator
13:20 and His creation in that and not only to create them
13:26 but Deuteronomy 5 connects recreation with the Sabbath.
13:32 That's right.
13:33 Because it says in that, toward the end of that verse
13:36 which is a recapitulation
13:37 by Moses of the Ten Commandments.
13:39 He says there at the end of the fourth commandment there
13:43 that God was the God who brought you
13:45 out of slavery.
13:46 That's right. He's God of deliverance.
13:48 So God of creation and God of deliverance to recreate,
13:52 so everything here points to God setting this day apart,
13:56 to enter into the life and heart of his people
14:00 and as they trust Him, as they depend upon Him
14:02 and put their faith in Him, He sanctifies them,
14:04 He changes them, recreates them
14:06 and they become blessed as a result of that.
14:09 And the devil comes along and says,
14:10 "The day doesn't matter."
14:12 I mean that's amazing because there's...
14:14 I'm sure that the person, well, I'm highly,
14:17 it's a high probability that the person
14:19 that asked this question is a Christian.
14:21 And there are many Christians that watch our program,
14:23 and the majority of Christians in the world today
14:25 have been told that the Sabbath doesn't matter,
14:28 that is for the Jews, it was nailed to the cross,
14:31 it is a symbol of works.
14:33 Let me answer that one, it is,
14:35 first of all it was not nailed to the cross,
14:37 because it had nothing to do with the cross.
14:39 It was established before sin even entered the world.
14:42 Why would something perfect have to be done away with?
14:45 If the Sabbath was nailed to the cross,
14:46 then marriage is nailed to the cross,
14:48 because those are the two institutions
14:50 the Lord blessed before sin even entered the world.
14:53 And how amazing it is today
14:55 that both of those institutions are under fire,
14:57 homosexuality, same sex marriage
15:00 has attacked the family in the marriage.
15:02 And Sunday which has been established as a tradition
15:06 have nothing to do with the scriptures.
15:09 People try to make it connect to the scriptures,
15:11 but those who established it,
15:12 it has no connection to God's command whatsoever.
15:16 It does not connect to any command
15:18 to honor His resurrection.
15:20 Baptism is the symbol of death, burial, and resurrection.
15:24 That's right.
15:25 Walk in the newness of life, raised to the newness of life,
15:28 so men have come up with these
15:30 discombobulated pile of illegitimate excuses
15:35 as to why the Sabbath should be forgotten.
15:37 Let me make the point in transition
15:38 to the next question,
15:40 why is it important?
15:41 Because God said, remember.
15:43 Now here's a simple question.
15:45 I did this a number of years ago,
15:48 and it resulted in a couple giving their lives to Jesus,
15:51 coming out of darkness into this marvelous light.
15:53 I said this and I'll repeat it on this program,
15:56 look at these five words Saturday, Sunday, Sabbath,
15:59 the seventh day, and first day.
16:01 Saturday, Sunday, Sabbath, seventh day, and first day,
16:06 look that up and take it to your pastor
16:08 and ask him to explain
16:10 why you don't honor the Bible Sabbath.
16:13 I had a Presbyterian couple come
16:14 one Wednesday evening to our church
16:16 and stood up and I thought they were visiting 3ABN,
16:19 and I came to find out after asking questions,
16:20 "Are you an elder?
16:22 Are you a deacon? Are you a member?
16:23 Are you an Adventist?
16:25 And they said, "No, no, no, no."
16:28 I said, "Why are you here?"
16:29 In the very questions I put out,
16:31 they said, "Well, we were watching House Calls
16:33 and you said, "Look up Saturday,
16:34 Sunday, seventh day, first day and Sabbath."
16:37 And we did and we went to our pastor
16:39 and that's why we're here."
16:41 And their pastor said to them,
16:44 this man was an elder in his church 40 years,
16:47 the pastor said to them,
16:48 "You're causing problems in our church."
16:51 And he said, "No, I'm not Pastor,
16:53 I'm simply following the Bible."
16:55 And then this pastor ended by saying, "You have a problem,
16:58 you fix it."
16:59 And he said, "I am,
17:01 I'm going to the Seventh-day Adventist Church."
17:02 You also mentioned something
17:03 to the effect that you're a member,
17:05 you sit in a pew.
17:07 I'm the pastor, I'm the one that preaches.
17:09 Exactly, he said, "I speak, you listen."
17:12 And he said, "No, it doesn't work that way."
17:13 And they went away, and they came
17:15 and they both got baptized and they accepted the Sabbath.
17:18 But it's a simple equation, God says, remember.
17:22 Let me say that again because somehow
17:25 our ears have been so tuned to the wrong voice.
17:29 God says, "Remember."
17:32 God says, "Remember."
17:34 Man says, "Forget the Sabbath."
17:38 God says, "Remember the Sabbath."
17:40 And mankind and the majority of Christians
17:44 follow what man says and not what God says.
17:48 That shows you how important it is.
17:51 The devil would not attack something so vehemently
17:54 if it was not important to God.
17:56 Yeah, yeah.
17:57 He knows what a blessing it can be
17:59 and we know that the advancement of evolution
18:04 wouldn't have been so strong and gained so much ground,
18:07 how do we remember the Sabbath?
18:09 Because the Sabbath points to the creator
18:11 and the week of creation.
18:13 He created the world in six days
18:16 and rested on the seventh.
18:18 Had we remembered that,
18:20 we wouldn't have forgotten and fell into evolution,
18:23 macroevolution as we have today.
18:25 You know what amazes me also, John,
18:26 there is a Creation Research Institute,
18:29 they do a great job.
18:30 Creation Research Institute,
18:32 recently I think they've built
18:33 a whole model of the creation week.
18:36 I'm just blown away
18:38 that they could put a model of the creation week
18:41 and they only covered six days.
18:44 They are the Creation Research Institute
18:48 and they put a model that people lord over
18:51 and you go then they say this is the week of creation
18:54 and they exclude the seventh day.
18:57 Which is the capstone.
18:58 Which is the capstone of the week.
19:00 And there is no place in the world
19:02 not in the constellation, not in the rotation of the sun,
19:05 not in the rotation of the moon,
19:06 the full moons during in the month,
19:08 not in the seasons changing four times a year
19:10 and not in the entire 365 day year.
19:14 There is no place you can find a seven day week
19:16 except in the Bible.
19:18 There's a reason why God gave the seventh one,
19:20 it is the perfect number, the number of divinity,
19:23 and it is the capstone of our relationship
19:25 between Him and you, and Him and us.
19:28 And by the way, I didn't mention the text,
19:31 but some people say
19:32 but the Sabbath is not mentioned
19:34 in the New Testament.
19:35 The Sabbath is mentioned 60 times in the New Testament.
19:38 The first day is only mentioned 12.
19:41 Eight of those references
19:42 have to do with the resurrection.
19:43 So you only have four chances
19:45 to come up with a replacement for the Sabbath
19:48 and you cannot because those four have
19:50 nothing to do with the change of the Sabbath.
19:52 One has to do with the breaking of bread
19:53 on the first day of the week
19:55 which they did every day.
19:57 The other one has to do with collecting offering
19:58 in Corinthians, 1 Corinthians 16,
20:00 which was an offering that was collected not at church
20:03 but from house to house like the Salvation Army would.
20:06 And the other one was simply saying,
20:09 I'll meet you on this particular first day,
20:12 and the last one was the disciples
20:14 hiding for fear of the Jews
20:16 after the resurrection of Jesus at the death of Jesus,
20:19 and the Bible says, and they gathered together,
20:21 and people teach that they gathered together
20:23 for worship service.
20:24 Read the whole context,
20:26 they were hiding behind locked doors
20:27 for fear of their lives, it was not a worship service.
20:31 So let's be honest and follow God's word,
20:34 and you will understand that when you love the Lord,
20:37 the Sabbath is not an issue.
20:39 Yes.
20:41 Okay, we have one more question here
20:42 before we move into the rest of our program.
20:44 Sure.
20:45 It's in regard to Hebrews 9:12.
20:50 Oh, yes.
20:52 And here's what Chapter 9:12 actually says,
20:56 and I'm reading from the New King James Version.
21:00 Well, I'll read verse 11 first,
21:01 "But Christ came as High Priest of the good things to come,
21:05 which the greater and more perfect tabernacle
21:07 not made with hands,
21:09 that is not of this creation.
21:10 Not with the blood of goats and calves,
21:12 but with His own blood
21:14 He entered into the Most Holy Place once and for all,
21:17 having obtained eternal redemption."
21:21 The question is asked here is surrounding some confusion,
21:26 King James Version says, "Holy Place,"
21:28 New King James says, "Most Holy Place."
21:30 In fact, most other translations
21:32 also say most holy place there.
21:35 So is the writer referring
21:36 to Jesus entering the Holy Place on His ascension
21:39 or the Most Holy Place upon His ascension?
21:42 We as Adventist understand that Christ
21:45 and especially all high priest,
21:48 the priestly service surrounded the high priest
21:50 entering into the Holy Place first
21:53 throughout the year
21:54 offering they continue to bring in the continual sacrifices
21:56 into the tabernacle.
21:58 He only went into the Most Holy Place
22:00 once at the end of the year
22:02 in the ceremonial system and that was called,
22:04 "The Day of Atonement".
22:06 And then on that day it completes the annual cycle
22:09 of sacrifices and ceremonies...
22:11 That's right.
22:12 That provide a picture,
22:14 overall picture of the plan of salvation.
22:19 The church has been challenged in the past,
22:23 on this understanding based upon this verse,
22:26 because this verse as most read it
22:28 and most translations give it says, Most Holy Place.
22:33 But it actually isn't the Most Holy Place,
22:36 it's a wrong translation in most every case.
22:39 And just a quick way, we can get it,
22:41 we could spend a whole program on that
22:43 but we're not going to do that.
22:44 Just a quick thing here,
22:45 just a couple of things to take a look at.
22:48 You have to follow from Hebrews 9: 1-5 first
22:53 and follow the words used for sanctuary,
22:57 and for Holy Place and Most Holy Place.
22:59 You have to follow that very carefully,
23:01 and you will find that the only time
23:04 the Most Holy Place is mentioned is in verse 3.
23:08 Because in verse 3 it says, hagia hagioon,
23:11 which is holy of holies, that's in verse 3.
23:15 Nowhere else in that passage not even down in 9:12,
23:18 does it say hagia hagioon.
23:20 It's either hagia or hagioon.
23:24 Plural and singular also has an effect
23:26 on how you interpret this,
23:28 so the interpreters as they went through this thing
23:31 did the best they could with their understanding
23:33 at the time and probably in many cases
23:36 not linking it to the depth of study
23:38 that we have had now up to the time today
23:41 of the old ceremonial system to understand the process.
23:44 So what you're reading here in verse 12,
23:47 actually relates to the first apartment of the sanctuary,
23:52 not the second.
23:54 Good.
23:55 So that's the answer to the quick question,
23:57 hopefully clearing out some for that,
23:59 but I suggest you also continue to read that,
24:01 read the passage and especially read in the Greek.
24:04 You don't have to know Greek,
24:05 but read the words there
24:07 and you'll see that they're very inconsistent
24:08 in these translations as to how they translate
24:11 those different apartments.
24:13 And the reason why I say 1-5 there,
24:15 John, is because it clearly spells out
24:19 the sanctuary in general,
24:20 the first apartment and second apartment,
24:23 second apartment and it tags
24:25 or specifically mentions those with the words
24:28 that describe them and from there
24:30 they lose consistency in most cases, so anyway.
24:33 In understanding it,
24:34 I'm glad you made that point
24:35 understanding of the ceremonial services
24:37 and how they occurred,
24:38 you'll know clearly, but when it said,
24:41 I'll just turn the passage away but when he says,
24:43 he entered the Most Holy once for all,
24:45 he's just simply talking about the completion
24:47 when he entered once for all.
24:49 The inference is better, he entered once,
24:52 he entered once a year.
24:54 He didn't enter that at the time of his accession,
24:56 he went to the holy.
24:58 And the once a year
24:59 was the part of the cleansing of the sanctuary,
25:02 but you did a very good job on that, thank you, John.
25:05 I have one quick question
25:06 I think we could answer this in the time
25:07 we have before we go into our topic,
25:10 but the question is, "I have, I had always,
25:12 this is from Collin, thank you Collin
25:18 for this question about the lamb's wife.
25:23 I had always thought so,
25:25 is the church the bride of Christ?
25:26 He said, I'd always thought so.
25:29 Fundamental belief number 12,
25:31 the church is the bride for whom Christ died
25:34 that He might sanctify and cleanse her
25:36 and that's in the church manual chapter 2 of the church manual
25:41 and the scriptures analogies
25:43 of the husband wife relationship.
25:45 He said, "But I read in Great Controversy Chapter 24,
25:48 which says, "The holy city, the New Jerusalem,
25:49 which is the capital
25:51 and the representative of the kingdom
25:52 is called, "The Bride, the Lamb's wife".
25:54 And that's in fact true, Revelation 21:9, 10.
25:58 Let me read that passage here and it says, verse 9,
26:03 and one of the seven angels, Revelation 21:9,
26:07 "Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls
26:10 filled with the seven last plagues
26:11 came to me and talked with me,
26:13 saying, "Come, I will show you the bride, the Lamb's wife.
26:17 And he carried me away in the spirit
26:19 to a great and high mountain,
26:21 and showed me the great city, the holy Jerusalem,
26:24 descending out of heaven from God,"
26:27 and the answer is,
26:29 is the New Jerusalem the Lamb's wife?
26:30 And the answer is, yes.
26:32 That's what the Bible says clearly.
26:34 The only reason why this connection was made
26:38 was in conjunction with Revelation 19,
26:42 because you find and here's, here's the beautiful parable,
26:45 you know, the parable of the ten virgins?
26:47 You have the...
26:49 Those are the bridesmaids if you were to consider that,
26:52 it's five wise, five foolish,
26:54 and then you have the bridegroom,
26:57 and then you have the bride,
26:58 and they're waiting for the bridegroom to come,
27:00 behold the bridegroom cometh, go out to meet Him.
27:03 Now if the church represents the five wives
27:06 and five foolish virgins, they can't represent the bride,
27:09 and that was a parable
27:11 of the five wise and the five foolish,
27:12 the division of the church
27:14 or as we would say the wheat and the tears.
27:16 If they represent the five wise and the five foolish virgins
27:19 which are like the bridesmaids at the wedding,
27:21 they cannot represent the bride.
27:23 Until Revelation makes it very clear,
27:25 where they connect those
27:27 where the statement is made is when Paul says,
27:31 "Speaking of the woman,
27:33 husbands love your wives
27:35 as Christ loved the church and gave Himself for it."
27:38 And then he talks about,
27:39 "He's going to sanctify her and He's coming back for church
27:42 without spot or wrinkle or any such thing."
27:45 He's speaking about
27:46 the righteousness of the Christian
27:49 who is looking forward to the coming of the Lord,
27:52 and here's Revelation 19:7,
27:54 "Let us be glad and rejoice and give glory,
27:58 for the marriage of the Lamb has come,
28:00 and His wife has made herself ready."
28:03 That's the other's connection, so here's the condition,
28:07 to have the New Jerusalem to be involved in the wedding feast,
28:12 you have to have guest.
28:13 So the wedding feast will include the guest
28:16 which is in fact
28:18 spoken of as since Jesus is the bridegroom,
28:21 His church will be in fact connected as the bride
28:24 without spot or wrinkle or any such thing.
28:26 And here is the support for that.
28:28 I just read Revelation 19:7,
28:31 "For the marriage of the Lamb has come,
28:33 and His wife has made herself ready."
28:35 And notice how the wife is identified.
28:37 "And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen,
28:41 clean and bright, for the fine linen
28:44 is the righteous acts of the saints."
28:47 So the saints are referred to as fine linen,
28:50 and finally verse 9, "Then he said to me,
28:52 "Write: 'Blessed are those
28:54 who are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb!'"
28:56 And he said to me,
28:58 "These are the true sayings of God."
29:00 So the church is spoken of in context of the saints
29:03 covered in the beauty of the bride
29:05 and the New Jerusalem
29:07 which is in fact the Lamb's wife of the bride.
29:09 And there would be no New Jerusalem
29:11 without the saints in it.
29:13 Exactly.
29:14 So it's interchangeable, there is no hard and fast rule
29:17 that one or the other is preferred,
29:19 but both are connected
29:20 because when you have the marriage feast,
29:22 the church is there.
29:23 Yeah, and the imagery in the Old Testament
29:25 also is that the...
29:27 heed that God's people are His bride,
29:28 He is the bridegroom.
29:30 That's right.
29:31 So there is a definite connection
29:32 between the New Jerusalem
29:34 and the saints that are in it here.
29:35 In that respect, they're both part of His bride.
29:37 Right.
29:39 And you find the woman spoken in Revelation 12,
29:41 she's pregnant, she's going to have a baby,
29:43 and she's arrayed in clean and white, she has the sun,
29:48 moon and stars, the glory of God's righteousness.
29:51 So the pictures are there and the symbolism is there,
29:54 so there's no hard and fast rule
29:56 that one must be preferred above the other,
29:59 but both are connected.
30:00 Or one to the exclusion of the other.
30:01 Exactly. Yeah.
30:03 Right, John, take us into it.
30:04 By the way, if you have any more questions
30:06 to send to us, you can send those questions
30:07 to this following email address,
30:09 housecalls@3abn.org
30:11 That's housecalls@3abn.org
30:13 And thank you very much
30:15 for your support of this network
30:17 and this program.
30:18 Takes us to our topic today, John, "Discipleship",
30:20 a study that you put together as Personal Ministries
30:23 and Sabbath School Director
30:25 in the Upper Columbia Conference.
30:26 Yeah, it's a seminar, it's kind of a series,
30:28 a miniseries, and it's something that I use
30:31 and we hope to at least in our conference
30:33 encourage our churches to get back to the discipleship model
30:36 that Christ instituted from the very beginning.
30:39 You know, Jesus spent three and a half years
30:43 preparing His disciples, creating disciples,
30:45 making disciples Himself,
30:48 and He did that through a number of ways.
30:52 Doesn't it make sense
30:53 that the church would put in a lot of time
30:57 and energy as well
30:59 in preparing people to be disciples as well of Christ?
31:01 It would make sense.
31:03 It makes sense to me,
31:04 and I mentioned this quote in the last,
31:07 in the last program,
31:08 and I want to mention it again that,
31:11 if the church did discipleship right,
31:15 evangelism would largely take care of itself.
31:19 So if people accepted and committed
31:21 to a life of discipleship
31:23 in the way that Christ has called His disciples...
31:25 Right.
31:26 The church wouldn't be begging
31:28 through flyer sent out all the time for interest
31:31 and new people coming into the church
31:33 in response to the gospel.
31:36 And so I think that
31:37 one of the things we are missing,
31:38 a huge thing we're missing in North America specifically
31:41 because other countries are experiencing incredible growth
31:43 and their focus, their emphasis is discipleship.
31:47 Their pastors come around
31:48 and they're seen maybe once every...
31:50 A cycle.
31:51 Twenty visits or something so we are not suggesting
31:56 that we go to that immediately here,
31:57 but there is coming a time
31:59 where I think the Lord is transitioning us
32:01 out of necessity back to a model
32:04 that is less pastor dependent and more discipleship focused.
32:08 So what I want to talk about today
32:10 as we then transition is,
32:11 what did Jesus say in regard to His disciples?
32:14 What were the conditions? And there are four of them.
32:17 What were the conditions of discipleship
32:19 that Christ specifically mentions,
32:22 so that we can understand
32:24 what it means to be a disciple of Christ,
32:25 because that's where we kind of have to start, right?
32:27 What does it mean to be a disciple of Christ?
32:30 Before we get there, I want to mention...
32:32 Well, I'm not going to mention that,
32:34 I'm gonna wait till the next program to do it,
32:35 so let's dive right into that.
32:37 In fact on your notes that I gave you there, John,
32:39 it's right around or slide,
32:45 it's 26, I think it is, so you'll find that.
32:49 I shared my program here with John,
32:50 and we're working off that for our notes today.
32:55 In making disciples and creating His disciples,
32:57 Jesus did several things that were very intentional.
33:01 Okay, and I'm gonna name seven things,
33:03 so we're not getting yet
33:04 to the conditions of discipleship.
33:06 We're looking at seven things Jesus did as He made disciples.
33:09 Number one, He chose a small number of disciples.
33:11 Okay.
33:12 So first when He created,
33:13 He spent time personally with a smaller number.
33:16 This is another reason
33:18 why pastors can't be depended upon
33:20 to create all the disciples in the church.
33:22 The whole church and its leadership
33:24 needs to be involved.
33:26 Disciples are disciple makers and you need a group,
33:29 you need a limited number
33:31 that you work with personally to mentor,
33:33 to coach and to help them understand
33:34 what it means to be disciples, Jesus did that.
33:37 He built personal relationships.
33:39 He invested time in them personally.
33:42 He became a servant leader.
33:45 Discipleship isn't about leading from position
33:49 or from some part of a title or office.
33:53 It's about being a servant leader
33:56 and spending time with them
33:57 and helping them along as disciples.
34:00 Number five, He taught by word and example,
34:02 so He didn't just teach it, He didn't just say it,
34:04 He went out there and He did it.
34:06 And so many times
34:07 we like to have seminars in churches today
34:10 about this or that including discipleship,
34:12 and we think, okay, now let's see if it's changed,
34:16 and we don't actually effectuate
34:18 or help that change by doing what we've just talked about.
34:21 Right.
34:23 And that's, I think that's one of the challenges
34:24 of bringing somebody in
34:26 and not having good follow up after something.
34:28 If you really mean that that individual
34:30 who comes in is to help effect change in the church,
34:33 follow up and do something about it.
34:35 True.
34:36 And number six, then He sent them out
34:38 to practice what they had learned
34:40 and then lastly, He held them accountable,
34:42 you have, find him teaching after the fact
34:44 as to what happened in their experience.
34:48 And so this is what Jesus did.
34:50 And so as we get to this point of talking
34:53 about the four conditions of discipleship,
34:55 we're talking about a Jesus
34:57 who is a Messiah with His disciples
35:00 who has a hands on relational nurturing experience
35:05 with the people, not just principles He taught.
35:08 I want to get this point across.
35:09 This is something that He nurtured them,
35:12 He gave them special attention
35:13 to help bring them along and understand it.
35:16 And that, you know, John, when you think about that,
35:18 the whole idea of choosing a small group,
35:22 even among the 12
35:24 he had a smaller group, Peter, James, and John.
35:27 He had His internal support group,
35:30 the other disciples for whatever reason,
35:32 and Jesus, you couldn't argue with His choice,
35:35 He chose a close knit group,
35:37 and you find they're mentioned quite a bit.
35:39 Matter of fact,
35:40 the New Testament highlights them too,
35:42 Peter, James, and John.
35:44 Unfortunately, James became a victim
35:47 in the formation of the New Testament church
35:50 he became, he was victimized, he lost his life.
35:53 Peter eventually was crucified upside down,
35:57 and John survived to pen the Book of Revelation.
36:01 But Jesus had that small group with Him,
36:04 these three disciples, Peter, James, and John,
36:06 so choosing a small group,
36:09 it's easier for one person to disciple three
36:12 than one person to disciple 12,
36:15 but the other nine followed Jesus
36:19 and were taught by His example.
36:21 And I'm glad you brought that out
36:23 of becoming a servant leader.
36:25 Because a servant leader, when Jesus talked about this,
36:28 He says, Matthew 10:24,
36:32 look at Matthew 10:24.
36:36 This is a very important servant leader passage
36:40 that talks about discipleship.
36:43 Matthew 10:24, here I am.
36:46 Okay.
36:48 My pages have been participating so well,
36:51 they've refused adhere one to the other,
36:54 and Jesus said, "A disciple is not above his teacher,
37:01 nor a servant above his master.
37:06 It is enough for disciple that he be like his teacher,
37:09 and a servant like his master.
37:12 If they have call the master of the house Beelzebub,
37:15 how much more will they call those of his household!"
37:19 You know, Jesus is in essence saying.
37:22 The servant is...
37:24 I mean the disciple is not above his teacher.
37:28 So you have Jesus establishing authority,
37:31 the teacher and the disciple, the leader or the servant,
37:36 and those who are being led
37:37 and those who are being taught how to serve.
37:40 So discipleship is a leader, a teacher, a servant position.
37:44 The discipler is the leader, the teacher,
37:48 and the one modeling the life of a servant.
37:51 And look what Jesus did in the upper room.
37:52 Yeah.
37:54 You know, they're all looking around to see
37:55 who is going to take up the towel
37:56 to wash everybody else's feet and Jesus does it.
37:58 Yeah.
38:00 He was right there, He was their example
38:01 as to what they should do...
38:03 He said in John...
38:06 Yeah, he said in John 13, I've left you an example.
38:10 "Do you not know what I have done?"
38:11 John 13:11, or verse 12,
38:15 He says, "So when He had wash their feet,
38:18 taken His garment,
38:19 and sat down again, He said to them,
38:21 "Do you know what I have done to you?"
38:24 You...
38:26 Once again, "You call Me Teacher,"
38:28 John 13:13,
38:29 "You call Me teacher, teacher and Lord,
38:32 and you say, well, for so I am."
38:34 Once again, He took the role, I'm teaching you,
38:37 I'm teaching you, and so discipleship to a large degree
38:41 is where the leader teaches, not just preaches,
38:47 and I think you mentioned that.
38:48 Right.
38:50 Preaching and teaching are not the same.
38:51 Preaching is a one hour exercise a week,
38:54 depending on what kind of church you have.
38:56 Some churches less time, some churches more time,
38:58 but generally within the one hour
39:00 of 168 hour a week,
39:03 you have that one hour designated
39:05 to communicate a message.
39:07 But then you step out of the pulpit,
39:08 step into it preach, proclaim,
39:11 step out of that and you become now
39:14 the one that builds personal relationships,
39:16 the one that invests time become a servant, leader,
39:20 teach by word and example.
39:21 And then you send them out,
39:23 and then you hold them accountable
39:27 for what they've done.
39:28 Yeah, absolutely.
39:29 And so there's,
39:31 there was a definitely an intentional method
39:33 that Jesus had for equipping or for training
39:37 and teaching His disciples.
39:39 And I think the church can learn a lot from that,
39:42 from His example in how we do that in the local church.
39:45 You know, we as a church tend to be very intellectual
39:48 in our approach to the gospel,
39:51 and there's nothing wrong with that
39:52 because Jesus did say to come and see, He taught them,
39:57 He shared with them words
40:00 from scripture to impress upon their mind.
40:03 God in the Old Testament, "Come, let us reason together."
40:06 You know, there's this cognitive aspect to the gospel
40:10 that we do need to accept.
40:12 But God's trying to also reach the heart
40:15 and that is done through relationships,
40:17 not through intellectual mental assent to truth.
40:19 That's right.
40:20 And so the relational part,
40:22 the investment of time
40:23 that is something he did very deliberately
40:25 with a smaller group of people as we talked about,
40:27 and that is what changed their heart except one,
40:30 who is resistant obviously to that.
40:32 Right.
40:33 But, so that, that's I think the church needs to be
40:36 aware of that, knowing that
40:38 if we just stick to the intellectual,
40:40 if we're just bringing people into an evangelistic series
40:42 to try and impress upon their mind
40:44 the fact that this is truth
40:46 and what they maybe have heard in the past is not true,
40:48 is a error, that's not going to,
40:51 that's not going to convert anybody.
40:53 There needs to be a relational component
40:54 that our members have to connect with new people,
40:56 there's got to be relationships develop there.
41:00 Now let's look at then the last 15 minutes we have
41:03 or so here at the four conditions of discipleship.
41:06 Okay.
41:07 So Jesus is teaching them
41:08 and He's showing them by example,
41:10 but what are the things that He's saying
41:12 or He's showing them are crucial components.
41:18 Indispensable components of discipleship
41:19 and there are four of them.
41:20 Okay.
41:22 And I found these four
41:23 because these are direct statements
41:25 in the gospels of Jesus Himself
41:28 and He says either one of two things,
41:30 "If you do this, you will be My disciples
41:32 or if you do not do this, you cannot be My disciples."
41:35 Right.
41:36 So each one of these are backed up
41:39 by a direct statement of Christ to that effect.
41:41 Okay. So let's take the first one.
41:44 Take a look at the first one here.
41:47 Love for God and people.
41:52 I have one text and I'm sure there are many others
41:54 and you can chime in on any of these here.
41:56 But John 13:35, says,
41:59 "By this all will know that you are My disciples,
42:02 if you have love for one another."
42:04 Okay.
42:05 So love is the center, is the motivator,
42:10 the impetus behind discipleship.
42:14 If there's no love for God and love for other people,
42:17 you can't be a disciple.
42:19 I've said many times
42:21 there are lots of people in the church
42:24 that profess Christ and they live like the devil.
42:29 And I say, live like the devil
42:30 not necessarily in their outward lifestyle,
42:32 but they live like the devil in how they treat other people.
42:35 Okay, I like that.
42:36 It's almost like when they see an error in the church
42:38 or something happens in the church
42:40 they disagree with,
42:41 they dispense all Christ's likeness
42:43 for the sake of defending the truth
42:45 and they become downright, dogmatic,
42:49 unapproachable, unkind,
42:53 and there's no greater evidence
42:56 truly of a true sincere Christian
42:59 than someone who's lovable Christ like
43:01 and very kind toward others.
43:03 And so this is the first condition that Christ gave.
43:06 You got to have love for other people.
43:08 Love for Me as well,
43:09 He talked about love for Himself and for God.
43:11 Of course that's the centerpiece,
43:13 the first part of the commandments
43:14 love for God, the second part, love for our fellow men.
43:17 You know, Proverbs 10:12, says, "Love covers all sins."
43:23 You know, sometimes love covers a multitude of sins,
43:26 but love covers all sins, and when we come...
43:29 Now, I'm so glad you brought this point up
43:31 because in order for you to be
43:33 able to be attractive to others,
43:35 we're not talking about physical beauty
43:37 but we're talking about Christian attraction.
43:41 You have to know how to love
43:43 and people hear love in your voice,
43:45 they see love in your action,
43:47 they see love in your body language.
43:49 My wife and I were in Australia a number of years ago,
43:53 and we were there,
43:55 she did a seminar for women
43:57 and it was tremendous first time
43:59 she did that step out of her comfort zone
44:00 and did a tremendous job
44:02 but included in that seminar for women,
44:07 young ladies teaching them about Christian principles,
44:10 there was a video
44:12 that she showed about how to communicate
44:14 and it was all about
44:15 the hidden language of the body,
44:17 how we communicate to people,
44:19 how when people talking to us,
44:21 how we communicate body language.
44:23 That's good.
44:24 The silent art of communication.
44:26 And so it was they were standing to the side
44:28 when somebody is talking to us whether they are like this,
44:31 you know, communication and it was a lady
44:33 that was talking about and I learned some things
44:35 from that even though I like,
44:37 even though I teach in seminars and relationship
44:40 as a relationship coach teaches some of those things.
44:44 It was important that
44:46 when you go to church on Sabbath,
44:48 there's this phrase we use every weekend,
44:50 matter of fact it's almost traditional
44:51 in many Adventist Church as we say, "Happy Sabbath."
44:55 Somebody once said, "What's so happy about it?"
44:59 You know, if we don't show happiness...
45:01 Yeah, yeah.
45:02 If we don't show happiness to one another,
45:05 if we don't let people know that they can come,
45:08 they don't have to be happy,
45:09 if they're not happy we can be happy for them
45:12 and bearing their burden.
45:13 We used to say that word and you'll finish it
45:15 'cause you're the one that came up with it
45:16 or maybe you got it from somebody else,
45:17 I don't know, but if you're happy, you notify...
45:20 Your face.
45:22 I think, now, I can't claim to be the originator of that,
45:27 but in fact it's a truism,
45:29 if you're happy, notify your face.
45:31 Let people know by your demeanor.
45:34 Don't just say you're happy, you know.
45:36 I said to somebody and we did this in the seminar
45:38 once I said, "Try to do this with a smile
45:40 and say to somebody,
45:41 'You know John, I really hate you."'
45:45 They wouldn't believe it. That makes you laugh.
45:46 I really hate you, I mean here's that with a smile
45:50 they wouldn't believe it,
45:51 he's just joking or try to see this with smile,
45:53 without a smile, I can't even do it right now.
45:57 With the most sourest frown you say, "I really love you."
46:02 The body in the words we say is so vitally important.
46:06 And you know, John, what I like about this topic,
46:08 it's a practical one,
46:09 we've dealt with a lot of doctrinal issues,
46:11 but the practicality of the conditions of discipleship
46:14 is very important.
46:16 Jesus says...
46:17 and hear children, one of the things
46:19 that really bothered the disciples
46:21 is that children were attracted to Jesus,
46:23 He said, "Don't forbid them, let them come to Me."
46:28 He had to have an attractive demeanor
46:31 in order for children to want to be around Him.
46:33 It was a break in the cultural perspective too
46:36 because they typically figured that that kids,
46:38 children have their place.
46:40 Right.
46:41 And they should be silent, they should be quiet
46:43 in the background and Jesus said,
46:44 "No, let them come."
46:47 And obviously then, Jesus was very approachable,
46:49 His demeanor was very open and loving and accepting.
46:52 And to have a friend the Bible says,
46:56 "One must first show themselves to be friendly."
47:01 When you go to a church and say,
47:02 "I don't have any friends."
47:04 It's like you must ask yourself the question,
47:07 "Are you friendly?"
47:08 We had a gal in our church years ago
47:12 and she approached another church member
47:15 and she said to him, he had,
47:18 they've been talking in Sabbath school
47:19 and he was painting a picture of how he viewed Christ
47:22 and she says, "I don't agree with you."
47:25 He says, "Well, at what point?'
47:26 She said, "Jesus never laughed, He was a man of sorrows."
47:32 So her picture of Christ was very much sorrowful always.
47:36 And He said, "I'm sorry,
47:38 but that's just not my view of Jesus."
47:41 Right.
47:43 And I think our view of Christ often will drive
47:45 how we treat other people too as Christians,
47:48 so as disciples we need to see what Jesus really was like
47:51 and then be like Him as He showed the disciples,
47:55 especially accepting of children
47:56 coming to Him and things.
47:58 You know that He wasn't solemn before children,
48:00 children don't respond to that.
48:01 No.
48:03 He was probably very happy joking, yeah.
48:06 Approachable and that's why...
48:09 I'll find a text in a moment here,
48:11 but, the other one I just alluded to
48:13 is Proverbs 18:24,
48:15 "One who has friends first show themselves
48:18 to be friendly."
48:19 Jesus had an approachable demeanor.
48:21 When it says a man of sorrows and acquainted with grief,
48:25 it talked about what he went through for us,
48:28 He didn't have to be the one to be crucified,
48:32 but the sorrow and the sin of the world was laid on Him,
48:36 however, the Bible says,
48:41 "The joy of the Lord is my strength."
48:45 You cannot create me with the ability to laugh
48:49 and you as a creator never smile.
48:53 You know, we're not talking about giddy and insensitive
48:55 and losing your mind as a...
48:57 Yeah, joking and ingesting kind of thing...
48:59 Right, we are not talking about that.
49:00 Playful, playfulness too, to your interactions
49:03 with people too, I don't think that was beyond Christ at all.
49:06 And somewhere the Lord had to have some sense of humor,
49:09 look at Elijah when they were on Mount Carmel
49:12 and they were trying to get their God's attention,
49:13 He said, "Hey, maybe He's sleeping.
49:17 Maybe He's on a long journey.
49:18 Maybe He can hear you a little louder."
49:20 I mean, he was in essence mocking their God
49:24 because there was no real God that responded that way.
49:27 And there're the scriptures, God is a pleasant God.
49:29 Yeah.
49:30 Let's go through three others here.
49:32 I wish we had time to spend more time
49:35 to spent on each of these.
49:36 I might do in the seminar but we don't on this program.
49:39 Number two: A commitment to follow Jesus.
49:43 He's looking for a strong commitment
49:45 to follow Him, Luke 14:27,
49:48 "And anyone who does not carry his cross
49:50 and follow Me cannot be My disciple."
49:53 And then look in verse 33, "In the same way any of you
49:56 who does not give up everything he has cannot be My disciple."
50:00 But that's a pretty strong request,
50:03 the commitment isn't a mental commitment,
50:06 the commitment is with everything you've got,
50:08 you're giving everything up for Him.
50:12 And that's why I put commitment in a different category
50:17 as obedience.
50:18 That's right.
50:20 Because our following Christ begins with commitment.
50:22 If you haven't committed all to Him
50:24 at your beginning of your relationship with Jesus,
50:26 you're going to waver throughout.
50:28 We've got to know and count the cost,
50:30 what's the other text I'm talking about,
50:32 what a man who doesn't build having first counted the cost
50:37 to complete the project before he ever get started.
50:40 So you've got to go through that process to do.
50:42 Now Jesus also said in Luke 9:23,
50:44 "If anyone desires to come after Me,
50:46 let him deny himself,
50:48 take up his cross daily and follow Me."
50:51 Denial of oneself is... Well, that's a huge thing.
50:55 It's hard, it's tough to every day,
50:57 but He said daily, it's got to happen.
50:59 'Cause the human flesh
51:00 and the things that we've learned,
51:02 I mean you talked about the vices,
51:03 you came out of, I had a lot of vices I came out of,
51:05 and along the way the devil throws vices at you
51:07 just kind of, we live in this cacophony
51:09 of demonic suggestions every day,
51:12 the hell born dissonance
51:13 that just grabs our attention sometimes
51:16 and rocks our very committed to Christ.
51:19 We have to come to the point where we have to deny self
51:21 and flesh the flesh that we've had, you know,
51:24 growing up and I'm growing up, this leads us to the place
51:26 where we have to say, okay, no, no,
51:29 have you resisted unto death?
51:31 Right.
51:32 Have you resisted unto death as the Bible talks about
51:35 and many people haven't.
51:36 Yeah, yeah, I agree.
51:39 The next one, number three:
51:40 Is obedience to God and His Word.
51:44 John 8:31, "If you abide in My word,
51:46 you are My disciples indeed."
51:48 Very good point.
51:49 And that word abiding there is really a word connected
51:52 to following in the ways of Christ,
51:57 it's residing in Christ as you obey Him
51:59 and walk with Him.
52:01 And so you find over and over again,
52:03 Jesus is asking the disciples to follow His actions,
52:08 to obey His commands.
52:11 He wouldn't have given commandments
52:13 unless He didn't expect obedience.
52:16 Okay.
52:17 There would be no reason, you don't command anybody
52:19 to do anything unless you expect them to obey.
52:22 And let's remember, the disciple simply means
52:25 pupil or learner.
52:30 And so as a learner, as a pupil you have a master.
52:34 This is an important point, disciples have a master
52:38 and what disciple doesn't follow
52:40 the master's commands.
52:41 True.
52:43 It's just common sense and so Jesus does
52:45 as the condition of discipleship require
52:47 obedience to His ways.
52:49 You know, John, everything that we do in life
52:51 has a factor of obedience in a company,
52:54 you have rules and parameters,
52:55 and operational principles of a company.
52:57 And a country too, laws.
52:58 In the country we have laws, in the military we have laws,
53:02 you have a commander, you have the general,
53:04 you have the sergeant, you have the captain,
53:07 you have the colonel,
53:08 depending on what branch you're in,
53:10 there's always a level of command
53:12 and obedience to the strictest form
53:14 is in many cases a life or death matter
53:18 in the military.
53:19 You know when they say down, or they say, you know,
53:21 look to your left or watch your six,
53:25 you got to be.. you can't say, "Do I do that again today."
53:29 Let me think about it. Yeah.
53:30 You could, your life could be taken very easily,
53:33 so when we mention obedience, that's the word
53:35 that's often missing in Christianity.
53:36 Yeah. It's like a bad word.
53:38 It's gotten a bad rap.
53:39 Yeah, obedience, but a very good point.
53:42 And then number four, this is the last one,
53:43 faithful fruit bearing.
53:46 So a disciple, he loves God and people,
53:50 he's committed to following Jesus,
53:52 he's obeying Him and His word, and then he is taking it
53:55 to that next step of faithful fruit bearing
53:58 and it says here in John 15:8,
54:01 "By this My Father is glorified,
54:03 that you bear much fruit, so you will be My disciples."
54:08 So discipleship again
54:10 very much connected to bearing fruit.
54:13 Those that don't bear fruit,
54:14 in fact, I think you mentioned this
54:16 in the last program or two
54:17 where we talked about this fig tree
54:21 that was not bearing fruit and what did Jesus say to do?
54:24 Cut it down. Cut it down.
54:25 In fact, Jesus was walking by a fig tree
54:28 that didn't bear fruit and He cursed it
54:29 and it withered and died.
54:31 And so the example here is that what good is a tree
54:34 that is intended to bear fruit, if it bears no fruit
54:37 for the Kingdom of God and for His glory.
54:40 Now here's another principle of discipleship
54:41 which is kind of a hard thing and it's not a new principle
54:44 but bearing fruit is, is kind of along the same lines.
54:47 One of the hardest things to do
54:48 is you ask yourself the question,
54:50 why am I going through such difficulty
54:53 if my life is so successful as a leader,
54:56 as a discipler, as a servant,
55:00 why am I going through difficulty?
55:03 Why am I facing hardship?
55:06 I mean everything's that I'm doing
55:08 what I'm supposed to do at least
55:09 as far as I'm concerned,
55:11 the pruning process is something
55:12 that many Christians don't look forward to.
55:15 We tend to think that if a tree is not bearing fruit,
55:17 then you need to prune it and get it ready.
55:20 But the Bible gives a different concept,
55:22 John 15, and we're going to look at verse 2,
55:26 "Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit..."
55:30 as you just mentioned, "He takes away."
55:32 Because there's no fruit coming from it.
55:34 "And every branch that bears fruit, He prunes,
55:40 that it may bear more fruit."
55:42 So, why am I going through the pruning process?
55:47 And Ellen White points out the pruning process
55:51 is the very discipline in our lives
55:54 that we just don't welcome.
55:55 You know, we don't welcome the Lord
55:57 getting cut here or getting cut there.
56:00 It hurts. It hurts.
56:01 Yeah.
56:02 But the pruning is necessary and so,
56:04 I saw someone yesterday actually matter of fact,
56:07 the weather was conducive to that,
56:08 and I saw them outside with their, you know,
56:10 with their shears and they were cutting the trees
56:14 at a certain level, I thought, ah, man, it's warm weather,
56:16 they're getting ready for the change in seasons.
56:19 And so God does the same thing, our lives,
56:21 we have changing seasons, and the Lord knows
56:24 He has to prepare us for those changing seasons
56:26 and the only way to do it is by pruning us.
56:28 That's right.
56:29 And the fruit that happens as a result of that is twofold,
56:33 there's the fruit in our own lives
56:35 coming from the fruit of the spirit.
56:38 And then there is the fruit that results
56:40 from engaging in our spiritual gifts
56:42 to advance the kingdom of Christ,
56:44 the fruit of other people's lives.
56:46 One person said, and maybe I'm going to quote this right
56:49 but I'm gonna try my best.
56:54 "The fruit we give appears on other people's trees
56:59 something to that effect."
57:01 In other words, as we bear fruit,
57:02 as we share our faith, means,
57:04 we encourage others as we disciple others.
57:07 The fruit that we will see happen
57:08 will appear on other people's trees.
57:11 And I think, and it also appears
57:13 on our trees of course,
57:14 but I think there is something to be said about that,
57:16 so fruit in that our own lives and then fruit in that
57:20 the lives of others are transformed
57:22 by the Christ that they have now accepted
57:24 because of our testimony.
57:26 And so this topic of discipleship conditions
57:29 are very important.
57:30 If you were to give us a preview of
57:32 what we're going to talk about
57:34 in some of the upcoming problems,
57:35 what would it be?
57:36 I mean about this particular subject.
57:38 We'll talk about couple of other things
57:39 relating to discipleship.
57:40 Jesus said some profound words to the woman at the well.
57:43 The true worshippers
57:45 will worship in spirit and truth.
57:46 We'll see how that applies to discipleship.
57:48 Wow, well, you know, here at House Call
57:50 we surely believe that the Lord is going to call each of us,
57:54 there's a call coming to our lives
57:55 and the call to discipleship is one of the highest.
57:59 May you answer that call, and God bless you too,
58:01 we'll see you again.


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Revised 2017-06-29