Participants:
Series Code: IC
Program Code: IC180121A
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00:01 The following program discusses sensitive issues
00:03 related to sexuality. 00:05 Parents are cautioned 00:06 this presentation may be too candid 00:08 for younger audiences. 00:29 Welcome to Intimate Clarity. 00:30 I'm Jason Bradley, 00:32 and I'm here with Jennifer Jill Schwirzer, 00:33 and she is a licensed professional counselor. 00:36 And today, we're going to be talking about 00:38 a very sensitive topic, 00:40 but it's a conversation we need to have. 00:43 Jen, is the best solution 00:44 for gender dysphoria transitioning? 00:47 All right, well, that's a really good question. 00:49 You're right, and what I want to do is 00:51 I want to explain what that all is. 00:53 This actually comes in three stages. 00:56 The first stage would be social transitioning 00:58 where the person with gender dysphoria, 01:00 say, for instance, 01:02 he's a male and identifies as a female, 01:04 would socially transition, dress like a female, 01:07 present himself as a female, changes name, 01:11 and kind of accustom his community 01:14 to regarding him as a female. 01:16 That's the first step. 01:17 The second step in transitioning 01:20 is dosing with hormones of the opposite sex. 01:22 So for instance, a male would then take female hormones 01:27 and that would actually change their body 01:29 in significant ways, the face structure changes, 01:32 female to male, the face, 01:34 the man will take estrogen and his, 01:36 you know, women's faces are softer than men's, 01:38 and so he'll start to have more of a feminine face. 01:42 He will start to have less facial hair, 01:48 he'll start to develop breasts, his genitalia will atrophy, 01:52 his male genitalia will atrophy, 01:55 and other changes that come about 01:57 as a result of that. 01:58 The male to female, gets kind of confusing. 02:00 It does like XY chromosomes, YY chromosomes... 02:03 I'm sorry. 02:04 The female to male will take testosterone, 02:06 her voice will lower, 02:08 she'll start to have facial hair, 02:10 her breasts will atrophy, and her female genitalia 02:13 will also go through some changes. 02:15 So those things are going to begin 02:16 the physical transitioning process. 02:19 Some people will then elect to undergo surgery. 02:23 Okay. 02:25 And as I've studied this, I've realized 02:26 that the vast majority of surgical transitions 02:30 are done on the top half of the body, 02:32 either removing breasts or adding breasts. 02:35 Not too many are done on the lower half 02:37 because they're kind of difficult 02:39 and there are some significant side effects 02:42 as a result of those things, 02:44 not the least of which is sterilization. 02:46 The easiest, if you're going to operate on the lower half 02:49 is male to female, 02:52 the most difficult is female to male and very physical. 02:55 There is no coming back from that. 02:57 Yeah, exactly, exactly. 02:58 That's a point of no return. No, I know exactly. 03:00 And we don't want to get into too much detail 03:02 just for delicacy reasons, 03:04 but let's just suffice it to say 03:06 that there are difficulties with these surgeries 03:09 because the tissues of your body 03:12 need a certain oxygen exposure level. 03:15 If you give too much oxygen exposure to a tissue 03:20 that is not accustomed to it, you'll have problems. 03:22 If you have too little oxygen exposure for a tissue 03:25 that is accustomed to a different environment, 03:27 you'll have problems there. 03:29 And so what you're doing with these surgeries 03:30 is inferring things 03:32 that aren't designed to be inverted, 03:33 so what will eventually happen is atrophy. 03:36 So it's a very unnatural process. 03:39 Extremely against nature, like we were talking about 03:42 during one of our programs before. 03:44 So you're going to deal with side effects. 03:46 Whenever you go against nature, against our design, 03:49 you're going to have a physical side effects 03:50 and basically many of these surgeries 03:53 don't succeed for a length of time. 03:55 And it's very interesting to me there was a study in Sweden 03:58 that showed a spike in suicide in transgendered people 04:02 who had undergone surgery from 5% to 10% post surgery 04:08 starting at about 10 years after the surgery. 04:12 So it doubled. 04:13 It doubled, 04:14 and it was already high but it doubled. 04:16 And it happened 10 years after the surgery, 04:18 which I find very interesting. 04:20 And what my educated guess would be about 04:22 what happened there is that individuals, 04:26 for one thing, hoped that 04:27 this surgery would solve all of their problems. 04:30 And a period of time after the surgery, 04:33 they realized it really didn't make me happy. 04:36 I relate to that 04:37 because I've had health problems, 04:39 and I've had surgery for health problems, 04:41 and I thought this is going to fix everything. 04:42 I want to be, you know, like new. 04:44 Yeah. 04:45 And then realize it really didn't do 04:46 as much as I thought it would. 04:48 And that can be a crushing revelation. 04:49 And, you know, we see a lot of times 04:50 where there are different medical issues 04:53 and people push certain medicines 04:56 and everything like that 04:57 but it's not dealing with the root cause. 04:59 The root cause. It's just masking the symptoms. 05:01 That's right. 05:02 And that seems like 05:04 that's what's going on in this case. 05:05 So I think there can be 05:06 a profound disappointment on that level, 05:08 but also the surgery itself 05:10 can start to not be as beneficial to that person, 05:12 they can have a lower level of enjoyment, 05:15 and they can even start to experience some problems 05:17 as a result of the surgery, 10 years post surgery. 05:20 Okay. 05:21 So basically this is not in my view, 05:24 and I'm not a doctor, 05:25 so I have to issue that disclaimer, 05:27 but I don't think 05:28 this is the most medically responsible way 05:30 to handle gender dysphoria. 05:34 That's particularly true of children, 05:36 and we're going to address that 05:37 in a whole different program. 05:39 But it's also true of adults, I'm not sure 05:41 it's the right solution. 05:44 I'm not denying the problem, 05:46 I'm just questioning the solution 05:47 because here's the thing. 05:48 You may do the transition, you may socially transition, 05:51 hormonally transition, and then undergo surgery, 05:54 but you can never change the DNA. 05:56 Yeah. 05:57 You will always, in terms of your DNA, always be a male, 06:00 I will always be a female, and that will never change. 06:03 So I just think it's a false hope 06:05 that we're holding out to people. 06:07 And I think that transgenderism, 06:09 the movement as we see it today, 06:11 is the fruit of Western individualism 06:15 gone rogue 06:17 because all that really matters is that I'm happy. 06:21 You know, transitioning is very difficult at times, 06:25 depending on your social milieu, 06:28 depending on your community, your family, 06:30 and the people that know you, 06:33 it can be extremely difficult. 06:35 I've had friends that have had children, 06:37 that have transitioned, and they now have to introduce 06:41 their son as their daughter. 06:43 This puts a profound... 06:45 I'm just saying this for myself. 06:48 I have two daughters. 06:49 If one of them decided they were a man 06:51 and they transitioned, 06:53 I don't know that I would ever come to the place 06:55 where I would introduce them as my son 06:57 because I would feel like that would be a lie, 06:59 and I wouldn't want to have to lie. 07:01 Yeah, and so I plan make believe type of thing. 07:03 That's right. 07:04 And so the particular belief of the individual 07:08 just triumphs over the needs of the community 07:12 in this kind of scenario, 07:13 and everybody pretty much around them 07:15 is required to agree, 07:16 even if they know in their heart of hearts, 07:18 this is not a man, this is not a woman. 07:21 And I don't think that that's fair, 07:22 I think that that's dysfunctional, 07:23 and it's denying the community aspect of human life. 07:27 We're not just individuals, we're individuals 07:30 that live within the fabric of a society 07:34 in a body of Christ. 07:36 You know, we're connected to one another 07:37 in a profound way, 07:38 but also in our biological families, 07:40 there are connections, there are relationships. 07:43 And when we're making as big of a decision 07:47 as transitioning would be, 07:48 we need to be in close consultation 07:49 with all the people that would be affected by it. 07:52 And so often, this has not seen that way. 07:54 Yeah, and like you said, 10 years later 07:58 then there those suicide issue is doubling. 08:01 That's right. 08:03 All right, from 5% to 10%. 08:05 Yeah. Wow. 08:06 So what are some of your thoughts and responses, 08:08 this is heavy material, like... 08:10 What are you feeling, you know like? 08:11 It is heavy. 08:12 It's very heavy that the beginning part 08:14 had me a little confused for a little bit 08:17 because it was kind of like in biology 08:18 where they start talking about XX chromosomes... 08:21 And XY. 08:22 YY, XY and all that stuff, 08:24 so the beginning part had me a little bit confused. 08:26 But I think that it's interesting, 08:30 I think that 08:32 you're not addressing the root issue, 08:35 you know, with the gender dysphoria, 08:38 like I don't think that 08:39 they're addressing the root issue, 08:41 which they're just simply masking the symptoms, 08:44 there is an identity crisis that's going on 08:46 that's taking place inside the individual. 08:49 And as opposed to taking a look at, okay, 08:52 where did that originate, where did that come from, 08:55 they're just saying here. 08:56 Here is this solution, 08:58 this temporary/permanent solution. 09:01 Yeah. 09:02 You know, apply that and see what happens. 09:05 And then, down the road, you realize, "What did I do?" 09:09 "What did I just do?" 09:11 And this is a fact that many, 09:13 you know, look back and wish 09:14 that it never happened, you know. 09:16 And it makes me think of this gentleman 09:18 that was interviewed on Dare to Dream. 09:21 Now he had a sex change, and he went back, 09:26 you know, as... 09:27 Transitioned back. Yeah, as far as that he could. 09:29 As much as he could. 09:31 So I mean, it's... 09:33 That's right. 09:34 It's definitely a sensitive topic. 09:35 Well, we started out, 09:37 you know, perfect there in the Garden of Eden, 09:39 we fell into sin. 09:41 And as a result of our fall into sin, 09:44 we developed a shame 09:46 because now we're sinful 09:47 and God is holy and we see this. 09:49 We have the sense of this sort of baseline 09:51 sense of distress and shame. 09:53 And the first thing that mankind did 09:56 when faced with that overwhelming sense of shame 09:59 is we manufactured fig leaf garments. 10:01 And I think that those symbolize 10:03 our human attempts to fix ourselves 10:06 apart from God because they were, 10:08 there in the garden, 10:09 God hadn't come into the garden yet, 10:11 and they, like patch it up and fix it up, 10:13 and then God comes into the garden, you know, 10:15 in the cool of the day so it's same day, 10:18 and they jump behind a bush. 10:19 So how much did those fig leaf garments 10:22 which were purportedly there to help them 10:24 overcome that shame really help them in the end? 10:27 They ended up jumping behind a bush and hiding from God. 10:29 So it really didn't work and all of our efforts, 10:32 I think similarly, I think that's symbolic 10:35 of all of our efforts to fix ourselves 10:37 apart from God, 10:39 and I can't help but see this in high relief 10:42 in this phenomena of transition. 10:43 I got to jump in right there. 10:45 I mean, the fig leaves, right? Yeah. 10:48 It's an uncomfortable situation. 10:50 They're scratchy. That's uncomfortable. 10:52 I have fig leaves in my yard. I have fig trees in my yard. 10:55 Yeah. Very rough. 10:56 And so then when we try and fix our own situations 10:59 without the help of God, 11:01 without allowing God to come in and change us, 11:05 it leads to uncomfortable situation. 11:07 If there is one thing I've seen over and over in my own life 11:10 and in the lives of the people that I try to help 11:12 in counseling and in ministry, 11:14 it's that the more we do to try to fix ourselves 11:17 apart from God, the worse we make ourselves. 11:20 Absolutely. 11:21 We get driven farther and farther 11:23 into the sin cycle 11:25 and more and more entrenched in it 11:27 and the problems compound and they get deeper and deeper, 11:30 and the layers get deeper 11:32 and the corresponding incentive to numb out 11:35 or seek diversions in order to escape 11:38 those layers of problems be intensifies 11:41 and we just get in deeper and deeper 11:44 until, finally, sometimes we come to the point 11:48 where we throw our hands up in the air and say, 11:49 "Lord, it's not working. I can't fix myself. 11:52 You're going to have to take over from here." 11:54 Oh, yes. 11:55 And so I'm saying this out of compassion for people 11:58 that are dealing with transgenderism. 12:00 I don't think I'm coming from a place of, 12:03 you know, feeling of wanting to disparage or put them down, 12:08 I don't feel that way, but it's kind of like 12:10 when you see someone smoking, 12:11 you know, you want them to quit smoking 12:13 because you know 12:15 that the smoking is going to cause health problems. 12:17 And I look at this phenomena of transgenderism, 12:20 I don't deny that some people have an intense desire 12:23 to be the opposite sex, 12:24 and even identify as the opposite sex, 12:26 and feel like they're a woman locked in a man's body 12:28 or man locked in a woman's body, 12:30 and my heart goes out to them, 12:32 but I think that, like you said, 12:35 to try to fix it in our own way, 12:38 apart from God is only going to make it worse. 12:41 We need to get to the root of the problem. 12:43 And to get to the root of a problem like that 12:45 is such a profound crisis as an identity crisis 12:50 requires the Holy Spirit of God 12:52 coming into that person's life and helping them 12:55 to trace from cause to effect, what happened in my life, 12:58 what are some of the variables that occurred 13:00 that led me to this place 13:02 where I feel like I'm the wrong sex 13:04 locked up in the wrong body. 13:06 And that's what the Holy Spirit can do. 13:08 He can show us, what led us to the point 13:11 where we got and then the same spirit 13:14 can give us the power to change. 13:16 And I think the people dealing with transgenderism 13:19 can come to a place 13:21 where they have peace with their own biological sex. 13:24 I think that that's possible. 13:25 That's a change of mind. 13:27 And the Bible says, "Let this mind be in you, " 13:29 which was also in Christ Jesus says, 13:31 be transformed by the renewing of your mind. 13:34 The renewing of the mind is much more possible 13:38 if I can put it this way than renewing your body, 13:41 changing your body. 13:42 Absolutely. 13:43 You never going to change your DNA. 13:45 And even the transitional surgery 13:46 doesn't work all that well, 13:48 so you're really never going to be 13:49 able to do that effectively. 13:52 I would say, the easiest route is to, 13:54 you know, seek renewal of the mind. 13:56 Absolutely. 13:57 Yeah, like you said, it's no going back sometimes. 14:00 Sometimes you reach the point where you can't return. 14:03 So, yes, I agree with that. We've uncovered a lot. 14:07 We have. 14:08 And if you want some more information, 14:11 go to IntimateClarity.TV 14:13 and check out the resources there. 14:15 Our time is up. 14:16 Make sure you join us next time on Intimate Clarity. |
Revised 2018-10-29