Participants: Mike Carducci (Host), Raymond King, Ron Woolsey, Wayne Blakely
Series Code: PC
Program Code: PC000027
|
00:01 The following program discusses sensitive issues.
00:03 Parents are cautioned that some material 00:05 may be too candid for younger children. 00:40 Hi. 00:42 I'm Mike Carducci, with Coming Out Ministries, 00:44 your host today for Pure Choices. 00:46 Today with me, 00:48 I have my fellow colleagues from Coming Out Ministries, 00:50 Ron Woolsey and Wayne Blakely 00:53 and we also have with us today Elder Raymond King. 00:56 Today our topic is gonna be about 00:58 "Heredity and Sexuality." 01:01 Coming from the homosexual background that I had, 01:05 when I gave my heart to the Lord, 01:07 I wanted to know how this happened. 01:10 I wanted to know why it was that 01:11 I was not in control of who I was attracted to. 01:15 And so as Jesus was leading me out of that lifestyle, 01:19 I was asking God, I said, 01:20 "Lord show me how this happened? 01:22 How was it that, that if I was born gay," 01:25 which is what I understood 01:27 by the history of 20-years in that lifestyle, 01:30 "then why Lord would you call me an abomination?" 01:33 And so in my search to find legitimate answers to, 01:36 to what it was that that had caused this, you know, 01:39 this understanding or this attraction in me, 01:42 I was desperate to find out 01:44 how homosexuality actually originated. 01:47 My understanding and some of the things 01:49 that I actually was able to glean from, 01:52 from different sermons, 01:53 from different things that I read articles, 01:56 and even my own Bible study, 01:58 was that there was a hereditary component 02:00 and then also there was this environmental component. 02:03 Now, because of my history, 02:05 my mother came from sexual abuse, 02:08 she was molested by her father. 02:09 My grandmother, my mother's mother 02:11 was also raped by her stepfather 02:13 and my great grandmother 02:15 was actually a prostitute during the depression. 02:17 So, you can see the hereditary predisposition 02:20 from the generations of sin and then on my father's side, 02:23 he was a philanderer, he had many affairs. 02:26 He was also a sexual addict which was also 02:30 what I struggled with. 02:31 As well as his father was a musician, 02:34 who was also very popular with the ladies 02:36 and his and my grandmother 02:38 whose father had actually murdered a man 02:41 because he thought 02:42 that somebody was having an affair with his wife, 02:44 he had actually murdered a man and actually died in jail. 02:47 So not only did I see 02:49 the hereditary predisposition for sexual sin, 02:52 but I also saw areas of anger management 02:55 and an impulse control. 02:58 So, today what we want to talk about is, 03:00 we want to talk about the hereditary components. 03:02 One of the phrases that I heard in my quest 03:05 to find out more was the word epigenetics. 03:08 And Dr. Arlene Taylor, I went to a conference of hers 03:12 and she was talking about how epigenetics is, 03:15 is the genetic link that whatever my history is if, 03:20 if I get married and to my wife, 03:22 we actually have a child together, 03:25 what happens is when the egg meets the sperm, 03:27 all of my history all of the, the history from not only me, 03:31 but my generation behind me 03:32 and generation before that is combined with, 03:35 with my wife's and when the child is born, 03:38 all of that history 03:40 actually comes through to that child. 03:42 So I started to recognize 03:44 that some of what I was struggling with, 03:46 were things that I wasn't even responsible for. 03:49 In Exodus 20:5 it talks about 03:52 visiting the sins of the generations, 03:54 "to the third and fourth generations 03:56 of them that hate me." 03:57 And so, I started to see biblical evidence 03:59 that supported the understanding 04:01 that there is a genetic link 04:03 to the sexual sin that I was struggling with. 04:06 I was also raised by a single mother 04:08 and three sisters so, 04:09 so I also had an environmental factor. 04:11 I didn't have a father, a gender role model 04:14 that I could relate to or that I could be affirmed by. 04:18 And so, I also believe that this 04:20 had an influence as well. 04:22 So, panel if you would this morning, 04:24 my first question is, is it possible to be born gay? 04:31 I talked to people about that question myself and, 04:37 I tell them that you cannot be born genetically gay 04:40 but you can be born with, what I call a, 04:43 abnormal sexual appetite. 04:47 In the medical community 04:49 they have a list of abnormal sexual turn on. 04:53 It's called Paraphilias. 04:55 And there are individuals 04:56 who are sexually turned on by their bodies, 04:59 there are people who are sexually turned on 05:02 by older individuals, 05:05 there are people who are sexually turned on by children. 05:07 They call them Pedophiles. 05:10 There are people who are turned on sexually by tattoos. 05:13 So it's a list of different "abnormal" sexual attractions. 05:20 And people didn't understand that because of sin, 05:24 these individuals may, may say well, you know, 05:29 as long I've known I've had this weird desire, 05:33 I've had this weird turned on, where did it come from? 05:36 But I believe because, we are born in sin 05:38 and in iniquity as you said earlier. 05:40 That's right. 05:41 That we indeed, do pick up 05:46 certain sinful tendencies from our forefathers. 05:51 I'm reminded about the end antediluvian and, 05:55 we know that, Adam and Eve were made perfect. 05:59 Because of sin, their first generation was, 06:03 develop a murderer, 06:05 but the mankind had got to the point 06:08 where the Bible says, 06:10 "Their imaginations were only evil continually." 06:13 And it was like that because 06:14 you had generation upon generation of people 06:16 who did not embrace righteousness 06:19 and because of the malignancy of sin, 06:21 we see that sin can totally ruin 06:25 generation upon generation. 06:26 But each generation becomes worse and worse. 06:28 And, so I submit that from a genetic perspective, 06:31 where people can say, we'll, 06:33 you can be justified in your sin 06:35 or justified in your wrongness. 06:36 No, that's not the case. 06:38 But I believe that we can be born 06:40 with evil tendencies. 06:41 Okay. Yeah. 06:43 I would personally, I have had that question 06:45 and I've wondered myself 06:47 and I've come to the conclusion at times that 06:49 that yeah, I was born gay. 06:51 And so, the question back today is 06:54 so what if you can be born gay? 06:57 so, are you saying that if you're born gay 06:59 that you can't be redeemed? 07:01 My mother's prenatal influence on me was that 07:05 she would only have a baby girl and not a boy and so, 07:09 throughout her pregnancy, 07:10 where she was adamant with people 07:12 that she was having only a baby girl. 07:14 So, she had put such much... 07:17 so much emphasis on this before I was born. 07:20 And then, her rejection of me when I was born, 07:23 had conditioned me into being someone 07:26 who would respond to any kind of gay influences. 07:30 But my response again is this, 07:33 there is no hereditary or cultivated sin 07:36 that God cannot redeem you from. 07:38 Amen. 07:39 And so we're all born with a sinful nature. 07:41 It's just that my cross, the one that I carry, 07:44 had to do with same sex attraction. 07:47 You know we, we all come to this panel 07:50 with different experiences and different perspectives 07:56 and that these 07:57 I think to a healthy discussion of the issue 07:59 and I have always had well, when I was in the gay life, 08:03 all those years I was in the gay life, 08:06 I use the same old argument that we all have used, 08:09 except Elder King, who was not in that life. 08:11 That's right. That, that I was born gay. 08:13 And in a way that it was to shut down the discussion. 08:18 I didn't want to be confronted about being gay. 08:22 And so, I actually believe that I was born gay because 08:25 from our earliest memories, 08:26 I had these fantasies and attractions 08:30 to the same gender. 08:33 But I've come to believe and this is my thinking 08:35 that a person's perception is his own reality. 08:38 And so, if a person believes that he is born gay, 08:41 then, so be it. 08:42 And then we then focus on the solution. 08:46 But and that we probably 08:48 will be talking about in another episode. 08:51 But, I have also come to understand 08:54 that children can be born with a sense of rejection 08:57 and this is kind of what Wayne is talking about. 09:00 And if a child is born with a sense of rejection, 09:05 he will grow up looking for acceptance 09:08 and quite often in all the wrong places. 09:11 If a child does not have that acceptance 09:14 and those love cups filled from father and mother, 09:17 he will tend or she will tend to look to fill 09:21 that void in the life through other ways 09:24 and it may be alcohol, drugs, just sexual promiscuity and, 09:30 and of course, in our case, 09:32 we had a void in our lives from our father, 09:36 the father side and, 09:38 and so we were looking to fill that void, 09:41 that sense of rejection with acceptance 09:43 in all the wrong places. 09:45 And so, yes, a child can be born 09:47 with a sense of rejection and then, 09:49 we think that we're just born gay 09:51 and we think it may be genetic, 09:53 when it's actually environmental 09:56 or a conditioning. 09:57 And so we have these different factors. 10:01 I think there are many factors that feed into the, 10:06 the gay reality and so my thinking is, 10:12 I tend to believe more in the conditioning 10:17 and in the rejection 10:18 and the push from environmental sources. 10:22 But yes, there is that inheritance of tendencies 10:27 and weaknesses in sin. 10:30 Well, I think it's important to let our audience know, 10:33 Ron Woolsey is now a pastor 10:35 and has been a pastor for over 20 years 10:37 and was in the lifestyle before that. 10:39 Wayne has also come from the gay lifestyle 10:42 and he was in that lifestyle for over 40 years. 10:45 My history is I was in that lifestyle for 20 years. 10:48 Elder King is what we would call, 10:51 he has a lot of information 10:52 and he also talks a lot about sexual purity 10:55 and he has a ministry as such so. 10:57 I just wanted to give the audience 10:59 a little bit of our, our history 11:00 and what our understanding is in that field. 11:03 So gentlemen, especially, Wayne and Ron, 11:05 I bring this question to you. 11:07 Does everybody have the same experiences? 11:10 Is it, is it true 11:12 that every homosexual comes from the hereditary 11:14 and the environmental factor? 11:16 I don't think so, 11:17 I don't think Satan really cares how he influences us. 11:21 Some today think that you know, God... 11:24 they'll say, "God made me this way." 11:26 So, it's as though they were given the right. 11:28 But we were all born with a fallen nature. 11:31 And in my life, I was at a point 11:34 where I was catering to people 11:36 who were seeking out sexual pleasure. 11:39 And that turned out to be people 11:41 from bisexual backgrounds, heterosexual backgrounds, 11:45 pretty much any kind of background 11:46 and so if they found that they 11:51 experienced the pleasure, 11:53 then they could make choices based on the pleasure 11:56 they were experiencing and begin to decide that, 11:58 oh, I must be gay or I'm gay or I like this, 12:01 I'm gonna go forward in this. 12:03 And so, there's a lot of choice 12:04 with regards to carrying out the behavior, 12:07 not always a choice on what the temptation is. 12:11 Fortunately or unfortunately for me, 12:14 I was never molested. 12:16 And so, I remember as early as six years old, 12:19 knowing that I was different from other boys, 12:21 I recognized that there was something distant 12:25 between me and the other boys in my neighborhood. 12:28 And I think that what that did 12:29 is that's what created this, this question for me, 12:32 where did this come from, 12:33 why is it that I wasn't, you know, 12:35 like other little boys in my neighborhood. 12:37 So, even though it wasn't sexualized for me because, 12:39 I was never molested, 12:41 it was something 12:43 that was a constant nagging question in my mind. 12:45 I though that God had made a mistake. 12:47 I really thought that I was meant to be a girl, 12:49 especially, I was surrounded by women. 12:51 And I certainly didn't relate to my dad or to masculinity. 12:55 So, so as I was searching for this, one of the... 12:59 situations, I know for you Wayne, you know, 13:02 a little bit of your history 13:03 and I want you to elaborate was 13:05 about while you were in vitro, 13:07 your mother was determined 13:08 that she was going to have a girl. 13:10 Is there an influence that goes on prenatally 13:13 before a child is born by the actions of the mother 13:17 and things that the mother incurs? 13:18 What are your thoughts on that? 13:20 Well, I can't reference the exact study, 13:23 but I know the study exists that, 13:24 that has taken place 13:26 that women have a hormonal influence between that... 13:30 like usually between like 12th and 14th week of pregnancy. 13:34 And depending on what their psychological 13:37 presence is during that time, 13:40 and what they're feeling, 13:41 it can have great impact on the fetus. 13:44 And, they've done studies to say that they think that 13:47 this might even help the fetus decide 13:50 what gender it's going to be attracted to 13:53 when the child is born. 13:55 Again, I would say, 13:56 I think anything is really possible 13:59 in this world because of the, 14:01 the influence that the prince has been given, 14:05 the prince of darkness has been given on this world 14:07 to try to tempt us to believe 14:10 a different way than what God would have us believe. 14:13 And yet God has given this his word for us to go to, 14:16 to search out the truth 14:18 and that's why there will be a people, 14:21 not the whole world, 14:22 but a people who will come apart from the world, 14:25 who will see that, 14:27 regardless of the temptations that are put upon them, 14:30 that they have a choice to surrender those temptations 14:34 and God has promised them healing. 14:36 And if I abide in Christ, I can experience that healing, 14:40 and that healing may come about gradually 14:43 or it may come about for some people more instantaneously. 14:47 It depends on that person's relationship 14:49 and their intimacy with Jesus Christ, 14:51 and what God's plan is versus what my plan is. 14:54 I just need to surrender to Him. 14:55 Okay. 14:56 So on that line, I know that 14:59 Dr. Taylor will talk about this woman that was, 15:02 she had a son who's about 12 years old 15:04 and he was obsessed with suicide. 15:06 He wanted to hang himself constantly, 15:08 a 12 year old boy. 15:10 And so, she went to the psychologist 15:12 and was explaining the situation 15:14 and Dr. Taylor asked this women, 15:16 "Can you describe to me, you know, you're... 15:19 your child's early years?" 15:21 Or whatever. 15:22 Nothing traumatic nothing had happened 15:23 and she said, "Well, how about you're pregnancy? 15:25 What kind of pregnancy did you have?" 15:27 and she said, "Well, I had a normal delivery." 15:29 Talked about that the pregnancy, 15:31 it was full term. 15:32 And she said, "Well then, did anything traumatic happen 15:35 while you were pregnant?" 15:36 And she started to share the story 15:38 that, she was driving home one day, 15:40 and her father actually stayed with her other children. 15:42 You know, babysat while she'd be working. 15:44 And as she approached the drive way 15:46 and hit the garage door opener, 15:48 what happened is the garage door open, 15:50 you know, opened 15:51 and she saw her father and he had hung himself. 15:54 The 12 year old boy jumped to his feet 15:56 and he exclaimed "That's it, that's it. 15:59 All I ever thought of is this man hanging." 16:02 And he had never heard the story 16:04 of how his grandfather died. 16:05 This was the first time that he heard that story 16:07 and as they processed the suicide of her father 16:10 that she witnessed while he was in vitro, 16:12 they reorganized the influence of what the mother experienced 16:16 it was also passed to the son. 16:17 And so, Wayne, in particular, 16:20 you're story I think resonates with, 16:22 with some of the same characteristics 16:24 and could you explain 16:25 or maybe elaborate a little bit more about that. 16:27 Well, when you arrive 16:30 having been not wanted from birth, 16:33 you can imagine the conditioning 16:35 is already there. 16:36 And the first two years, you know, 16:39 I was on Air Force Base. 16:41 So my father was always away that gave, you know, 16:44 ample time for my mother to abuse me. 16:47 And before I was two years old 16:49 my mother had broken my arm in two different places. 16:52 So it wasn't going to be natural for me 16:55 to be running into the arms of a woman, and saying, 16:58 "I love you, I love you." 16:59 I wanted to go to the arms of a man 17:02 who provided strength and power 17:05 and compassion and shelter, safety... 17:09 Yes. 17:11 And so, that, that you know, 17:14 that preconditions you to begin to, 17:18 to seek that out in your life. 17:20 And it's such a strong impact at such a very young age 17:24 that it's hard to, to let a division come in over. 17:28 And so, because the church community really didn't know 17:32 how to reach out to me, you know, 17:34 I went for many, many years before that pattern of, 17:37 of the false identity or being drawn to something 17:42 that God didn't intend for me to be drawn to, 17:45 He wants me to have right relationships with men. 17:48 But He didn't want me to have 17:49 the intimate relationships that I came to have 17:52 because it was the only way 17:53 I seem to be able to relate and find comfort. 17:57 I wasn't going to find that comfort in a woman. 18:00 All right. Can say something? Yes. 18:02 I think it's really, really important to establish 18:06 how the actions of the parent will affect the child. 18:11 I have real good, 18:14 I'm gonna call my favorite writer made the statement. 18:17 It says, "When parents and children meet 18:19 at the final reckoning, 18:21 what a scene will be presented! 18:24 Thousands of children who have been slaved 18:27 to appetite and debasing vice, 18:31 whose lives are moral wrecks, 18:34 will stand face to faith with the parents 18:36 who made them what they are. 18:39 Who but the parents must bear this faithful responsibility? 18:43 Did the Lord make these youth corrupt? 18:46 Oh, no! 18:47 Who, then, has done this fearful work? 18:50 Where not the sins of the parents transmitted 18:54 to the children in perverted appetites and passions?" 19:00 We all talk about our family tree. 19:05 But the Lord gave me inspiration about, 19:09 talking about our sexual tree. 19:12 You know, the Bible talked about two becoming one. 19:15 And I'll tell people, 19:17 those individuals that you get involved with sexually, 19:21 I thought of God's will, 19:23 we'll have a impact eventually on the children that you bear. 19:28 Take someone who has been sexually active. 19:31 There's no telling what type of demonic influences 19:36 or inherited family tendencies 19:40 are now being brought into their marriage relationship 19:43 and consequently, their offspring. 19:45 So, based upon this information 19:47 that this author is trying to establish, 19:51 there is a very viable anticipation 19:56 of sinful activity of the parent 19:59 being passed on to the child. 20:01 So this is powerful. 20:03 Imagine me in 52 years old is 20:05 and the question that's been burning in my heart 20:07 since I was a six year old boy, 20:09 we've been able to substantiate 20:10 that there is a hereditary tendency. 20:14 At this point what I'd like to do 20:15 is now talk about the redemptive part. 20:17 How is it that we can break this cycle? 20:20 The entire plan of salvation is about this very thing. 20:23 For all sin, for every issue as God, 20:27 in His love reaches out to His children, 20:30 and they begin to respond to that drawing power, 20:33 He creates in their heart an enmity for sin. 20:37 Genesis 3:15, talks about the 20:39 "enmity between thee and the women." 20:41 He's talking to Satan. 20:42 So as we respond 20:44 that drawing power of Jesus and His love, 20:47 we start developing a hatred for who we are, 20:52 for the sin in our lives 20:53 and we find ourselves disgusting. 20:56 I know in my case, 20:57 I developed a disgust for my life. 21:01 And always hurting people 21:03 and in the shame and the stigma. 21:05 And with that, 21:07 and then we come to the Lord and we say, 21:09 "Lord, take this thing from me. 21:11 I don't like this. I don't like who I am." 21:14 And His whole plan is to, to redeem us from our sins. 21:18 In Jeremiah chapter 3, we read that, 21:21 "If we will only acknowledge." 21:22 He says, "Only acknowledge thine iniquity. 21:26 And I will heal your backsliding." 21:28 So in my case, 21:30 I finally came to the realization 21:32 that I'm dealing with the sin issue here. 21:34 And, it doesn't matter, where it came from, 21:37 sin is a mystery in itself 21:40 and so rather than excuse it and explain it 21:43 and try to analyze it, He says, 21:45 just acknowledge you're dealing with a sin issue. 21:48 And once we do that 21:49 and we come and acknowledge that this is a sin issue, 21:51 can you help me overcome this sin. 21:54 Jesus came to save his people from their sins. 21:56 Yes. 21:58 And, with that understanding and we go to Him, 22:00 then we have these beautiful promises 22:02 throughout the Bible 22:04 about how He can help us overcome 22:06 and if we're, if are using that excuse 22:10 that "I was just born this way." 22:11 I love it when Jesus says, "Well, then be born again." 22:14 Amen. 22:15 And now we can no longer blame our heredity, 22:17 because now we're sons and daughters of God. 22:20 Are we going to blame God because we're gay? 22:22 And a lot of people do. 22:24 They say, "God made me this way." 22:25 No, God wants you to be born again 22:28 and then start over. 22:30 And then you have His divine nature to draw upon, 22:33 you think about His nature as your heredity now 22:36 rather than that of your past. 22:38 And the Bible gives so many guidelines, you know, 22:42 "Let this mind to be in you, 22:44 which was also in Christ Jesus." 22:46 In 1 Corinthians 6:9-11. 22:49 Verse 11, especially, 22:51 when Paul is telling the Corinthians, 22:53 "And such were some of you. But ye are washed." 22:56 Yes. "Ye are sanctified." 22:58 That's right. 22:59 "Ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, 23:00 and by the Spirit of our God." 23:03 The Bible is filled with texts. 23:05 It tells us that these, whatever it is, 23:07 it can be a past issue. 23:09 It does not have to be your identity, 23:11 it does not have to be your present. 23:13 II Corinthians 5:17. 23:15 "Therefore if any man be in Christ, 23:17 he is a new creature." 23:19 We all love that text, 23:21 because we claim that we are new creatures in Christ, 23:24 we are new creations. 23:25 New motives, the, 23:27 the new birth consists of new motives, 23:30 new tastes and new tendencies. 23:33 It is a process. But it happens. 23:36 Yeah, we develop that genuine conversion changes 23:40 both hereditary and cultivated. 23:43 And I say even created tendencies, 23:46 which are wrong. 23:47 So this is what the plan of salvation is all about. 23:51 And that's what we're here to share. 23:53 We have been there, we have been on that bad, 23:56 that dark side and by God's grace, 24:00 we are new creatures in Christ. 24:01 We don't identify anymore 24:04 with the sin and with the temptation, 24:06 but with the power of God 24:08 to save even the homosexuals from his sin. 24:11 Amen. Amen. 24:13 Amen. 24:14 Yeah, you know I love 24:15 the beauty of the acknowledgment 24:17 because the acknowledgment is in the repentance 24:20 and recognizing in our sinful selves 24:23 that the only hope, the only redemption 24:25 is through Jesus Christ. 24:27 So when I surrender, when I fall upon him 24:30 that I can claim to be 24:32 that new creation in Jesus Christ, 24:33 because He has given me a new start, 24:36 regardless of my sinful nature. 24:37 Wow, powerful. 24:39 For me personally, I remember during that time, 24:42 I started to read the book, "Ministry of Healing" 24:44 which is in my opinion, the textbook for overcoming. 24:48 And even just on the first page it talks about 24:50 that the same Jesus that came 2,000 years ago 24:53 is the same Jesus today, who healed man completely. 24:57 It said, "Anyone they came to Jesus Christ, 24:59 never left halfway healed. 25:02 That He healed them completely in mind, body and spirit." 25:06 And when I read those words, 25:07 I started to apply that to myself 25:09 and knew that that was a promise 25:11 that I could glean and to say, 25:12 I started to recognize that if Jesus, 25:16 was telling me that my lifestyle 25:17 was an abomination, 25:18 He better have the answer or He's no Savior at all. 25:21 Amen. 25:22 You know the Bible talks, describes Jesus, 25:25 in a number of ways. 25:26 "He's the Alpha and the Omega." 25:28 Well, that's like the alphabet A to Z. 25:30 "The beginning and the end, the first and the last." 25:34 And when you couple that 25:36 with the text in Philippians 2:13 25:38 that it is God, which work within us, 25:41 to will and to do of His good behavior... 25:44 His good pleasure, well, He's not a quitter. 25:47 He's the Alpha and Omega, 25:49 what He starts in us, He will finish. 25:52 And, Philippians 1:6, I think there it said, 25:54 "We can be confident of this very thing 25:57 that He which has begun a good work in you." 26:00 Yes. Even the homosexual. 26:02 That's right. 26:03 "Will, perform it until the day of Jesus Christ." 26:05 Amen. 26:07 And so, it is through His righteousness, 26:08 as He covers us with His righteousness 26:11 and as He works out that righteousness in us, 26:13 He will not give up on us. 26:16 He can perform that good work in us. 26:20 Very good. Amen. 26:22 So, I think what we've really tried to establish here, 26:25 we want to reach not only those in church culture 26:28 that that say, "That this was a choice." 26:31 That, Gentlemen, was it ever a choice? 26:33 Did you choose to be gay? 26:35 We chose to give into the temptation. 26:37 Okay. 26:39 And, of course, 26:40 that could be a very lengthy discussion in itself. 26:42 But, what I came to understand is 26:44 when I realized there was a way out, 26:47 if I did not take the way out, 26:49 then I chose to be gay. 26:51 But I chose to come out of that. 26:54 And so yes, choice is very much involved. 26:57 But it also, if... 26:59 for my own experience which is all I can speak from. 27:02 I was on this train track into it 27:04 and I didn't know how to get help. 27:06 I knew I needed help. 27:08 But didn't know how to get help and so, 27:10 I can honestly say, it wasn't a choice 27:12 that I consciously made. 27:13 I felt like I had no other. 27:15 And so, what we're trying to relate 27:16 to is in church culture, 27:18 to recognize that people who struggle with homosexuality 27:21 may not know how to get off of that train too, 27:24 and so, by establishing some of the hereditary factors 27:27 and some of the environmental issues, 27:29 we're hoping to not only educate church culture 27:31 into how to receive homosexuals and to minister to them, 27:35 but also for the homosexuals who may be struggling 27:38 to help them to identify with where this may have begun. 27:42 So, Gentlemen, thank you for your time very much 27:44 and again, Elder King, 27:46 for coming and for my colleagues, 27:49 Wayne and for Ron and this is Pure Choices 27:52 and we hope that 27:53 you'll come back and join us again. |
Revised 2016-02-11