Participants: Yvonne Lewis (Host), Pr. Lionel Martell
Series Code: UBR
Program Code: UBR000092S
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00:01 Stay tuned to meet a pair of twins that dared to dream
00:03 of a better life... and found it. 00:06 My name is Yvonne Lewis 00:07 and you're watching Urban Report. 00:29 Hello! And welcome to Urban Report. 00:32 My guests today are Wayne and Dwayne Caines: 00:35 authors, speakers, and entrepreneurs. 00:38 Wayne is presently the CEO of Digicel Bermuda, 00:42 the largest telecommunications company on the island. 00:45 And Dwyane is the public relations manager 00:47 for the Bermuda Police Service. 00:49 Welcome to Urban Report Wayne and Dwayne. 00:52 Welcome and thanks for having us. 00:54 Thank you for the opportunity. 00:55 It is so great to have you here. 00:57 You guys have such an interesting story. 01:02 And it's interesting because I met Wayne 01:05 at Oakwood University, and Wayne had his book - 01:09 you guys' book - Double Vision. 01:12 This book is so good. 01:15 I recommend it to everybody to read. 01:18 It's funny, it's insightful, it's inspiring. 01:23 You guys have had quite an interesting journey. 01:26 So I'd like to talk to both of you 01:29 about your journey together 01:32 as well as your different personalities and just how you 01:37 grew up. So let's talk a little bit first about how you grew up, 01:40 where you grew up, and some of the experiences that you had. 01:45 Let's start with Wayne. 01:47 We live and were raised on the beautiful island of Bermuda 01:52 that is nestled in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean 01:56 right on the balmy shores in a very peaceful and loving island. 02:01 Dwayne and I were raised 02:02 in a Seventh-day Adventist household. 02:05 Our mother is from Jamaica, 02:06 and growing up in Bermuda she instilled the values 02:10 of our faith and discipline. 02:12 As you can imagine, we were young men - young twins - 02:16 in an island. We were mischievous. 02:17 We had a lot of fun. We enjoyed a lot of mayhem 02:22 and causing trouble in our local church. 02:25 We had a very firm Christian foundation. 02:29 And the reason why this is important - 02:30 and I'd like to just spend a minute here - 02:32 is because oftentimes we have a very unique faith. 02:36 As Seventh-day Adventist Christians, we were raised to 02:39 understand the importance of our faith. 02:41 We were taught to respect the Sabbath. 02:44 We were taught the importance of loving those in your 02:46 immediate circle. We had a complete understanding 02:50 of the discipline of our faith. 02:51 On the things that we could do and what we couldn't do 02:54 and how our character and reflecting the character 02:56 of Christ was very important for us... not only in our household 03:00 but in our community. Excuse me a second. So your home, then, 03:06 set the tone for your behavior in a sense? 03:10 Because your parents... you had a two-parent household... 03:13 you came from a strong Christian background. 03:16 Did your home then set the tone for your perspective 03:23 on your faith and education? 03:25 Here is what's interesting. My father wasn't an Adventist 03:28 until I was 13, so growing up my father 03:32 who grew up in North America - who grew up in New York - 03:35 he was growing up in New York City during the time of 03:39 Malcolm X. He was a man that was deeply connected to his culture, 03:44 the black culture. And so when he came back to Bermuda 03:47 after university in the United States of America 03:49 he was raised an Anglican but he was not a SDA. 03:54 My mother was a Seventh-day Adventist. 03:56 Our grandparents lived with us. 03:58 And she ensured that we were raised as Seventh-day Adventist 04:01 young men. 04:02 The thing that is very important 04:05 is that our parents - including my father - 04:08 had a very strong structure around us. 04:11 They ensured that we under- stood what it was to be 04:14 Christian young men but more importantly to 04:16 respect those around us. 04:17 Dwayne? Wayne speaks of what actually 04:21 took place in our lives. We had an active Christian 04:23 and a healthy Adventist environment. 04:26 But one of the things that makes our testimony unique: 04:28 with all of that around us we still found it important 04:32 to find trouble. And so anywhere there was trouble 04:35 unfortunately you found Wayne and I. 04:37 And within that very sacred cocoon 04:40 we often found ourselves at the epicenter of things that 04:43 were not necessarily in our best interest. 04:46 So our testimony sometimes... You remember the story of the 04:48 Prodigal Son. And everybody focused on the son who left 04:52 but there was a son that was in the home and still was 04:55 struggling. And he almost was... Everybody forgot about him 04:59 because he actually did the proverbial right thing. 05:02 And Wayne and my testimony a lot of the times 05:05 are for Seventh-day Adventist young people who are in our 05:08 midst and they are still struggling with the critical 05:12 issues that affect youth all over the world. 05:15 They still are in our midst, 05:17 and if we don't focus on the critical issues that they're 05:20 facing, we think that they're OK just because they're around us, 05:25 just because they attend worship and they do everything 05:28 that we want to hear. So we had the morning watch. 05:32 We were members of Pathfinders. 05:34 Dwayne and I went from being pre-Pathfinders - Adventurers - 05:38 right up... Rangers. We did Youth Sabbath School. 05:43 Dwayne and I were very active in our faith 05:46 but we were still estranged from our faith. 05:49 We were very good in sports. 05:51 The majority... Yeah, finish your sentence. 05:54 The majority of the sports that we wanted to participate in 05:57 were held on Friday nights. 05:59 Our mother would not even consider it. 06:01 We were very good at what you would call soccer... 06:04 what we would call football here in Bermuda. 06:06 We couldn't be. We had our mother make sure 06:08 that we went to football training but guess what? 06:11 When it was for the match that was on a Sabbath morning 06:14 Dwayne and I could never play. 06:16 So here we were: two young men that were living in a community 06:18 a part of a faith, but we were being estranged from everything 06:21 and everyone because we were not able to be full participants. 06:25 And that has got to be a very frustrating thing 06:31 for young men who are active and successful in sports. 06:35 You know, if you're good at something and you can't 06:37 practice it, that's got to be very frustrating. 06:40 So I can imagine that now there's this dissonance here 06:43 between your faith and your ability in sports. 06:48 And I want to explore that, but I want to go back 06:51 for a second because you guys have given me 06:53 quite a bit of meat here to chew on. 06:55 First of all, you said that your dad 06:59 was a very strong man steeped in black culture 07:04 as a result of having been in New York 07:07 and Malcolm X and all of that. Sure. 07:09 Let's talk a little bit about the importance 07:14 of the father in the home. 07:16 What does that strong father give to his sons in the home? 07:22 When you look at some of the challenges that the African male 07:26 is having throughout the diaspora... not only in North 07:29 America but through the Caribbean and through Africa, 07:32 one thing that is clear is that the odds for a successful 07:36 and a thriving man are far greater if there is 07:39 a male in the home. If there is an emotionally-connected present 07:44 male in the home. We are... And we believe that a Christian 07:48 home - a two-parent home - is God's ideal. 07:51 We believe that having a Seventh-day Adventist father 07:54 in the home is a part of God's ideal plan. 07:56 So many times in the culture in the black community 08:00 we have men that are not active and present in our families. 08:04 And so oftentimes when a man wants to model 08:07 manhood, when we wants to see conflict resolved, 08:10 when we wants to be taught responsibility, 08:12 there are women that are teaching him those elements 08:15 of his past, of his future, and of his present. 08:18 And oftentimes when we see young men that are developing 08:22 spiritually they're looking for a model that is given to us 08:25 from a Biblical perspective. 08:26 If they cannot see the evi- dence in their immediate home, 08:29 they can see a chasm or a bit of a disconnect 08:33 in their lives. Oftentimes what was our saving grace: 08:37 in our faith in Bermuda we had a lot of elders, 08:40 we had a lot of deacons, we had a lot of Pathfinder 08:43 leaders, we had a lot of men including our father 08:46 that played a strong surrogate role. Now we realize 08:50 that was a good event. 08:53 As an Adventist, our system inadvertently 08:56 gave us our saving grace. 08:58 What does that mean? It allowed us to have men in our lives 09:03 that were Christian strong, grounded men 09:06 that were playing an active role in our lives. 09:09 And see... that is such a critical piece 09:12 because that is what's missing in our community today. 09:17 So many of our households are single-parent, female-run 09:22 households. And there are various reasons for that. 09:26 But it is so important for our men to know 09:30 that even if you don't have any children 09:34 our communities - our kids - need for active, engaged 09:39 men to step up to the plate and say: "Hey, I'm going to 09:42 mentor someone in church. " You just said you had 09:46 Pathfinder leaders and elders and deacons 09:48 that were there to help... to mentor you. 09:53 That's what we need in our churches. 09:55 Dwayne, how do you feel that that impacted your life? 09:59 Having a strong male figure in the home: how do you feel 10:02 that impacted you? Well I think one of the saving 10:05 graces to Wayne and my story is that we were undergirded by 10:09 men in our community who actually aided us 10:12 in our development. One of the things we talk about 10:14 in our faith a lot are men being present. 10:18 But there's one thing to be present and there is another 10:21 thing to be an active agent of change. 10:24 And in the generation that preceded us 10:26 yes there have been men that were present 10:28 but have you been actively open to watch your children 10:32 develop. Have you been emotionally vested? 10:35 Have you been a Christ-like representative of His love 10:39 in your home? So it's just not enough 10:42 to be present. We want you to be actively engaged in the 10:46 development of your children. 10:48 There was a generation of men who believed all they had to do 10:51 is be present and financially provide. 10:54 And we're now saying: "Gentlemen: right now 10:57 we need you to do more than just provide and more than just 11:00 tell our young people what they're doing wrong. " 11:03 We grew up in a generation of Adventist men 11:06 who... old-school Adventist: here are the rules. 11:08 Here's what you do and don't do. 11:10 This is a different generation 11:12 and while we do not want to sacrifice the beauty of our 11:15 faith and what we consider to be the foundation and the 11:18 bedrock of our faith... which are the guidelines that God has 11:21 given us. We believe relationship development 11:25 a. a relationship with God; 11:27 b. a relationship with your spouse 11:29 or the person... the significant representative of your love 11:33 in your family. And to pour into your children so they 11:36 actually like you and love you. 11:39 It is important to be firm; it is important to be fair. 11:42 But sometimes you just have to be a nice and pleasant person 11:46 to be around. That is so so good 11:50 and so true. You know, in listening to you guys... 11:54 First of all, like I said, I love this book. 11:57 And you give experiences and then at the end 12:02 of the chapter you kind of tie it in to a lesson 12:05 so that it's not just experience for experience' sake, 12:09 there is a lesson here for the reader. 12:12 There's a lesson here for the young person 12:14 to help to motive them on their journey to success. 12:18 So I really appreciate that about you. You guys express 12:21 yourselves so well. But in your book you talk about 12:25 how at first in your early years 12:29 you were not academically... 12:33 you weren't academically motivated 12:36 and so you guys were focusing on other things. 12:39 Tell us a little bit about those early years 12:41 and how you functioned academically. 12:44 The challenge that Dwayne and I had in school is that 12:48 we were full of energy. 12:51 We were undisciplined. We were much more focused on having fun 12:55 and enjoying ourselves than on our academic pursuits. 12:58 A lot of times when you look at the structure of the curriculum 13:01 and understanding where we were at that time 13:04 the teachers did not understand. 13:05 The classroom had about 20-25 young people in the classroom, 13:09 and so there were so many different factors that Dwayne 13:11 and I just found ourselves in a position that we were not 13:15 in an environment that was meeting our academic needs. 13:18 As a result of that, we started to struggle academically. 13:21 We looked at school as a place where we were not doing well 13:26 academically, so it was a place where we could show out, 13:29 have fun, and teachers found us very difficult to manage. 13:32 When we were in what is called middle school now 13:35 we were asked at the end of our first year in middle school 13:38 not to return to school. Can you imagine: 13:41 at 12 years old being formally asked not to return to school 13:45 in the fall? Our mother was besotted with grief. 13:48 She was at a turning point. 13:50 I would like to stop here for a second. 13:52 You have mothers that are doing their all, sacrificing, 13:55 working from can-see morning to can-see night 13:58 to make sure that the children get everything 14:00 and something like this happens. The teacher said to my mother 14:04 that not only did Dwayne and I not have the academic pedigree 14:07 to continue, that they ascribed the highest height that we would 14:11 achieve... She said that one of your sons would definitely 14:13 end up in prison and the highest that the other could go 14:16 he will be on the back of a trash truck. 14:19 Those were the... that was what my mother was told: 14:21 that's the most she should expect from Dwayne and I. 14:24 My... now can you? Oh... 14:27 Hearing those words had to pierce the heart of your mom, 14:32 number one, and also I'm sure it didn't do... 14:35 If you guys heard this, it didn't do much for your 14:38 self-esteem either. What we recognize now is that 14:41 life and death is in the power of our tongue and our actions. 14:45 Yes. And it's actually a responsibility of our teachers. 14:49 Teachers are called of God. 14:51 And just like we hear of ministers 14:53 not everyone can be a teacher. Teachers are there to inspire. 14:57 The beautiful thing about what transpired 14:59 in Wayne and my life was my mother took us out of 15:03 public school. And let's be very clear: 15:05 there are phenomenal teachers in the public schools. 15:07 The school that we were at was just not a good fit for us. 15:11 And what we recognize is my mother recognized 15:14 she had to get us in a smaller environment. 15:16 And she put us in the Christian school. It's called Bermuda 15:20 Institute. We affectionally call it BI... which is a SDA school. 15:25 Now what happened when we went to BI, it was a much 15:28 relaxed environment. We had teachers that we could 15:31 model our lives after. They had worship, 15:33 and we were able to relax and be ourselves. 15:36 And what took place over the next four years was 15:39 a slow transformation of confidence. 15:43 Now the confidence came, ironically, because we had 15:46 teachers in the school that believed in us. 15:48 One gentlemen - he's actually passed on now - 15:50 his name was Mandell Hill. 15:53 Mandell Hill was at the time 22 years old 15:55 and he had just graduated from Oakwood College. 15:59 And he came back as a history teacher. 16:02 And he was somebody that Wayne and I could relate to. 16:06 And in seeing him, we recognized that his success was something 16:11 that we could model. And watching his life, 16:15 watching his leadership, watching his spirituality 16:17 became a very key step in our development forward. 16:21 You know, excuse me one second Wayne. I'm going to bring you 16:23 back in, but what you said Dwayne. It's so important 16:28 for parents to know that the school that their children 16:31 or their child is in might be a great school 16:35 but it's not necessarily a good fit for that student, 16:40 for that child. And that's a really great point 16:43 because parents often... You know, you want your kid 16:45 to get a really good education so you put that child 16:48 into a certain environment. But it might not be the right 16:52 environment for that child. 16:55 And so you guys were taken from that Warwick School 16:59 if I recall correctly, Warwick School 17:01 and put into BI, and everything kind of changed 17:05 because it was a good fit for you. 17:08 Not just the religious aspects of it, which are critical, 17:12 but also academically. It sounds as though 17:15 it was... You said it was a more relaxed atmosphere. 17:19 It was... They had worship. 17:21 It just was a better fit. 17:23 And I think that's a very important point 17:25 for parents to hear. It's not that this is an indictment 17:30 on public school so much as it is this Adventist school 17:34 was a better fit for you. 17:36 Here's what we learned even about children today: 17:39 you have to be so in tune with God 17:43 that you become in tune with your child. 17:46 And we're advocating: be so in love with God and your child 17:51 that you understand the needs of your children. 17:55 Oftentimes we put our children in environments 17:58 that we think are the best for them, but we don't take 18:01 into consideration the specific needs, the learning styles, 18:06 the cultural nuances of an environment. 18:10 What we're saying is be so in tune with your child: 18:13 their learning style, their playing style, 18:15 everything around them, and then ask God to give you the wisdom 18:19 and the power and the discernment to create spaces... 18:23 safe spaces. That safe space is at church. 18:26 That safe space in the community. 18:28 The pen of inspiration - Ellen Gould Harmon White - 18:32 she says education is "the harmonious development 18:35 of the mental, the physical, and the spiritual. " 18:38 So that means that an institution is a school. 18:42 But when you envelop your child in a healthy 18:45 environment where they can be themselves 18:48 culturally, physically, spiritually, 18:50 then they have education. So we are advocates 18:54 of finding the best environment for your child to succeed, 18:59 to be a representation of Christ's love, mercy. 19:02 For them to be helpful in their community. 19:05 For them to be helpful in their environment. 19:07 And why this is real to us is that my brother Dwayne's 19:11 daughters go to Bermuda Institute 19:13 which is a Seventh-day Adventist school here in Bermuda. 19:16 My daughter goes to boarding school at Kingsway College 19:20 which is a SDA boarding school right outside of Toronto. 19:24 Now I realized that Bermuda Institute was not a perfect fit 19:29 for my daughter. I wanted her to be at this age - 19:32 17 years old - I wanted her to be in a Christian environment. 19:36 I want her to continue to develop. 19:37 My wife and I had to go outside of what we thought was our 19:40 comfort zone and find a school. 19:42 We looked in North America; we looked in the Caribbean. 19:44 We found a school. Kingsway College is an Adventist 19:48 high school in Toronto that was an excellent fit for her 19:52 so she can understand how... Something that I did share 19:57 and I want to just reiterate it now with your leave 19:59 is that I found out late in life that I had dyslexia. 20:05 And something that we have to understand is that 20:08 Dwayne and I later in life had to take responsibility 20:11 for our playing around... for us not being serious. 20:13 We couldn't blame the school. 20:15 We couldn't blame our parents. 20:16 There became a point in our personal and academic lives 20:20 where we were just shocking and jiving and playing the monkey. 20:24 We had to settle down and realize that if we were to 20:28 make a difference in the world that we had to get focused 20:31 academically. No father, no son, no school, 20:36 no element... No one could do that. 20:38 We had to do that, come to that realization on our own. 20:41 Wayne: this is so, so, so important because you 20:46 cannot live a life of blaming everybody else 20:50 for whatever... our issues. 20:55 Nobody denies that there are issues: 20:57 systemic racism... you know... disproportionate incarceration. 21:01 All of that stuff. We know that. 21:03 But what about our responsibility? 21:06 What about our personal responsibility? 21:09 This is so good because people need to understand 21:13 that it's not just about what somebody did to me. No! 21:17 What am I doing to make my life better? 21:21 How am I assuming responsibility for my life? 21:24 So that is so critical. At what point did you guys 21:27 decide that you had to do that? 21:30 It's a very important point. 21:32 We were at Oakwood University. Oakwood University is a small 21:36 Adventist university nestled in the awesome confines of 21:39 Huntsville, Alabama. 21:40 Dwayne and I left Bermuda undisciplined, but our parents 21:44 wanted us to go to university and we landed at Oakwood. 21:47 Once we landed at Oakwood it was a perfect environment 21:49 for us: small classrooms, dedicated teachers, 21:52 strong academic environment. 21:54 When we got to Oakwood something socially happened. 21:57 The guys around us and the girls around us 21:59 they loved to have fun just as much as us 22:02 but they were focused in school. 22:03 And so we wanted to take part of leadership and be in the... 22:07 I joined the Aeolians, and you couldn't be a part of 22:09 the Aeolians if you didn't have a certain GPA. 22:11 The girls that were gorgeous... they just didn't want to be 22:13 around a guy that was on academic probation. 22:15 And so... It always comes down to the woman. 22:21 I noticed that in the book... that women played a large role 22:25 when... with the way you guys were going. 22:28 The French say cherchez la femme. 22:31 Find a woman, yes? If you oftentimes... 22:34 Dwayne and I are no strangers so we don't want to tell 22:37 a disingenuous story. Dwayne and I were not angels. 22:40 We were not academically focused. But let me share 22:42 something with you. Two things that a person must 22:44 have if they're going to go and change the trajectory 22:47 of their life. Number 1: they have to have passion 22:50 about something and they have to find a purpose. 22:52 What is passion? What do we talk about when 22:54 we're talking about passion? We're talking about something... 22:56 we're talking about something that is God-seed in your life. 23:00 The French also call it the raison d'être: 23:02 the reason for being. 23:03 There has to be something that gets you and motivates you. 23:06 After you've found what you're passionate about 23:08 you have to ask God to show you a purpose. 23:11 What was I put on the planet to do? 23:14 Why am I on this earth? 23:16 So many times you find people that are passionless. 23:19 They do not have a purpose. 23:20 And so they go flailing and purposeless, aimlessly 23:24 walking through life. God has given us a spiritual purpose. 23:27 We know what is our ultimate responsibility 23:30 and that is to tell somebody else about Him. 23:32 How was Dwayne and I? How would we take our gifts? 23:37 Dwayne was very good with people, so he always could talk 23:40 and "Oh, you are a great speaker. " 23:41 I wanted to be a lawyer. 23:43 You ask: "How could I be a lawyer 23:44 if I didn't get good grades? " 23:46 I was very passionate about the community. 23:48 Rodney King... I think it was 1991 23:51 Rodney King had some difficulty in California 23:55 and they had a big unrest on our campus. 23:57 And I was one of the student leaders that brought the campus 24:00 together and we had a march. It was at that point 24:03 where He nitched me like the burning bush. 24:05 God showed me what He can do through Dwayne and I 24:08 if we got focused. If I, with laser-like focus, 24:11 started to dedicate myself not only to kingdom building - 24:16 i.e. getting myself and others ready for the kingdom - 24:18 but I had to be very serious about my academic studies. 24:21 I had to occupy the space that I was in 24:24 and give glory to God through my academics. 24:26 I had to be able to - after getting diagnosed with 24:29 dyslexia - stop feeling sorry for yourself. 24:31 So you have dyslexia... so what? 24:33 I had to find a passion of academics and a plan 24:37 and something that worked well for me and get over myself. 24:40 And get out of my way and stop making excuses 24:42 for myself so I could ultimately see my purpose fulfilled 24:46 through God's destiny. So... Oh, this is so good. 24:49 So: passion, and purpose, and a plan. 24:53 Yes. Three P's: passion, purpose, and a plan. 24:57 You had to have all of those to move forward. 25:00 Because it makes no sense to just have passion 25:04 when you don't know what you're passionate for. 25:06 What are you going to do with it? Where is it going to go? 25:08 But God will let you know. I call it... 25:11 Here on Dare to Dream we call it walking in your divine destiny. 25:14 I've seen it. When you know what you're supposed to do 25:17 and you're doing that, there's nothing better than that. 25:21 Do you agree, Dwayne? 25:22 I certainly second what he is saying. 25:25 I think right now we have a lot of young men, particularly 25:28 young black men around the world, who are just not walking 25:30 with a purpose and they feel sorry for themselves 25:34 and they are surrounded by individuals who are caught up 25:37 in that same position. And it breeds a level of despondency 25:41 which actually can be infectious 25:43 just like things that are positive are. 25:45 What we're saying is that you don't have to be a product 25:48 of your circumstances and that if you dare to dream 25:51 find a Christ-driven purpose. 25:53 Because some people have a purpose, but it's not 25:56 Christ-centered. Remember, if your motives are pure... 25:59 I was told to take advantage of opportunity 26:03 but never to take advantage of people. 26:05 Keep your motive pure; keep your divine purpose in step 26:09 with God's plan. The great Wintley Phipps said 26:13 "You don't have to compromise to be recognized. " 26:16 Stay within God's purpose. He can bless you if you stay 26:19 faithful to Him. Oftentimes we see what 26:23 the quick-fix brings. But God said if you stay 26:26 faithful to Me, He is faithful and just to do just what He says 26:30 and that is to provide you with the blessings of your heart. 26:34 But you must be faithful. Absolutely... absolutely. 26:37 I want to put up your website because 26:40 you guys are such an inspiration. 26:43 I know that there are different churches 26:46 around the country and actually around the world 26:49 that people will be watching and they're going to want to 26:52 invite you to come to their churches. Do you have? 26:55 In 30 seconds, do you both have 26:58 a thought for a young man that's struggling right now? 27:02 If you are a young man or a young woman and you find 27:06 yourself in a position where you feel as if 27:09 you don't matter, if you feel as if everything 27:12 is going against you, if you feel that you can't 27:14 talk to your parents and that being a SDA is actually a joke, 27:18 how can this church that was started in 1844 27:21 actually make a difference in my life? 27:23 Dwayne and I have been exactly where you have been. 27:26 We stopped depending on the church to change our lives. 27:31 We stopped blaming our elders and our deacons 27:34 and we realized that we had a responsibility 27:37 in developing ourselves and pushing ourselves 27:40 through God to make a difference in our life. 27:42 That's great. Dwayne, what do you think? 27:44 God wants men... He wants bold, strong men 27:48 who are ready for this time who are willing to stand. 27:51 He needs us to be a representative of His truth, 27:55 mercy, and love. 27:56 Praise the Lord! Thank you so much for being with us. 27:59 And thank you for joining us. 28:01 Join us next time... it just wouldn't be the same 28:03 without you. |
Revised 2023-10-10