Urban Report

Isaiah Ministries, Founder

Three Angels Broadcasting Network

Program transcript

Participants: Yvonne Lewis (Host), Jason Bradley (Host), Eric Wilson


Series Code: UBR

Program Code: UBR000196A

00:01 So you think that martial arts are just about self defense?
00:04 Well, stay tuned to find out
00:05 what's really behind Martial arts
00:07 and eastern mysticism.
00:09 My name is Yvonne Lewis. And I am Jason Bradley.
00:11 And you are watching Urban Report.
00:37 Hello, and Welcome to Urban Report.
00:39 Our guest today is Eric Wilson,
00:41 former instructor in the martial arts of Qigong,
00:44 Bagua, and Tai-chi chuan.
00:47 Jason is with me. Yeah.
00:49 And we are going to explore the martial arts
00:51 and the force behind it.
00:53 Welcome to Urban Report, Eric.
00:55 It's a pleasure to meet you.
00:57 Before we start, we have a little clip
00:59 that just kind of sets this whole thing up,
01:01 and I want to air that clip.
01:02 Just take a look.
03:08 Wow. That was powerful. Yeah.
03:13 What got you involved in the martial arts?
03:17 Before we even go there,
03:18 lets talk about where you were born,
03:20 how you were raised,
03:22 all that and find out about your journey.
03:25 So where were you born and where did you grow up?
03:28 I was born in Orlando, Florida.
03:31 My parents were Seventh-day Adventist Christians,
03:34 so I was raised in a Christian home.
03:37 When I was probably five years old,
03:39 we moved up north to Virginia, Tennessee, North Carolina,
03:44 spent most of my life in that area on the east coast.
03:47 And were you an only child or did you have siblings?
03:50 No, I have a brother, seven years younger to me,
03:53 and we are very close, so, yes, madam.
03:55 Yeah, and so you were raised
03:58 by Seventh-day Adventist parents,
04:01 and so you grew up in a two parent household.
04:03 Yes, madam.
04:05 And then did it remained that way
04:07 or was there has been change, what happened in your life?
04:10 When I was 12-years-old
04:12 my parents went through separation and a divorce
04:15 and the enemy came into our home,
04:17 like it does in so many homes, and causes conflict.
04:22 And we don't even realize often that the conflict is with him,
04:26 not with one another.
04:28 So my parents were divorced, you know, when I was 12.
04:32 How did that make you feel when they got divorced?
04:37 It created doubt, it created insecurity,
04:43 it created a feeling of rejection,
04:46 as a young man, especially.
04:48 And I know its same for young women as well
04:51 but for young man especially,
04:53 a father figure, having a father,
04:56 a dad in a home is what gives you
04:58 and assures you of your purpose in life.
05:01 God has called all of us as sons and daughters of God,
05:05 and its true, a father and a mother,
05:07 that we are assured of that, that we're given a role.
05:13 And, so when my mom and dad were divorced
05:15 and my dad had to move away, I lost that, you know,
05:19 I was searching desperately for what is my purpose in life,
05:22 you know, what is my reason for being here.
05:25 And lot of times, young people, when they're searching that,
05:30 they look for role model.
05:31 It may be in Hollywood or it may be in sports
05:34 or it may be in the fashion industry,
05:37 but they are looking for someone
05:38 who look up to assure them of who they are
05:42 and their identity.
05:44 So for me, when I saw the man
05:47 that practicing the martial arts,
05:48 I saw what I was missing,
05:50 I saw the man that appear to be fearless,
05:52 they appear to be in control of every facet of their lives.
05:57 Nothing took them by surprise or caught them of God.
06:00 And I thought you know, that's what I want,
06:01 I want that kind of confidence,
06:03 I want that assurance in my life.
06:05 And I didn't realize that that assurance comes
06:08 from knowing who we are in Christ.
06:12 So, you, by the age of 14,
06:18 you were kind of searching for that mentor,
06:22 that role model, that hoping.
06:24 And in school, I guess at that time too,
06:28 you know, you go through like could bullied
06:31 or there can be...
06:33 Was that your situation as well?
06:35 Yes.
06:36 Men are trying to prove themselves,
06:39 especially young men.
06:40 So I had a number of men, young men that were you know,
06:44 trying to prove themselves and use me as their guinea pig.
06:49 So I told my mom, I said,
06:51 I really want to get started in martial arts.
06:53 And at first, my mom was very against it.
06:56 She couldn't explain why but she just felt in her heart
06:59 that something just was not right about it.
07:02 And anyway, I found out about a school
07:06 that was a "Christian martial arts school."
07:10 A Christian martial arts school,
07:11 I've never heard of such.
07:13 Well, yeah.
07:14 And like, back when I started, in 1983, 1984,
07:18 it was unheard off almost.
07:20 Now they're everywhere Christian martial art schools.
07:23 Yes, Christian yoga, Christian tai-chi.
07:26 I mean, it's everywhere.
07:27 What differentiates them from mainstream martial arts?
07:31 What do they do that differs?
07:34 They say the word "Jesus." That's about it?
07:38 I don't mean that derogatory, but often times you know,
07:42 it sort of like music.
07:44 What's Christian rock?
07:45 Or what's the difference between Christian rock
07:46 and regular rock?
07:48 Well, the words.
07:50 I'm going to do a yoga pose, or I'm going to meditate
07:53 but I'm going to meditate, I'm going to use Jesus' name.
07:58 So the school, I know that the intent was good,
08:01 they read Bible verses, you know,
08:04 they were some changes made in people's life.
08:06 But what was hard was is that, Jesus says,
08:09 if someone strikes you on one side of your face,
08:12 turn the cheek.
08:13 The martial art says, if someone swings at you,
08:16 block in counter.
08:17 So there's an opposition in the teaching.
08:21 One is completely against with the other,
08:24 the spirit is completely different.
08:26 One is a spirit of pride
08:28 and the other is the spirit of humility.
08:30 Well, and I'm going to explore that a little bit more
08:32 but let's go back for a second.
08:33 When you walked into that dojo for the first time,
08:36 what did you think?
08:38 Well, explain what a dojo is first of all
08:40 because some viewers might not know that.
08:42 And then explain how you felt when you walked into the dojo.
08:47 The first place my mother took me,
08:50 it was a Japanese school, which is a dojo.
08:53 It's a Japanese word and it means to us in American,
08:57 in English language, it means a training hall.
09:00 But if you look the word up in the Japanese
09:02 it actually has a much deeper meaning.
09:06 It means, up the place of enlightenment.
09:10 The Chinese word for that is Daochang.
09:12 It has the same meaning, a place of enlightenment.
09:16 In Hindu religion, it would be a place of Nirvana.
09:20 Interesting.
09:21 Isn't it interesting, how here in this country,
09:25 we have taken in certain practices
09:29 thinking that they are harmless,
09:32 thinking that they are just you know,
09:34 self-defense or whatever,
09:36 but it's more than what we know,
09:40 more than what we know.
09:41 Well, you know, it's like those things
09:42 where they look great on their surface,
09:45 but as you dig deeper, you unveil or uncover the truth
09:51 and the meaning behind it.
09:53 I mean, it's even if you look at today
09:56 with all this togetherness and stuff like that,
09:59 how people want to all come together in terms of religion
10:03 and things of that nature.
10:05 What happens is
10:06 people are gonna end up compromising morals
10:09 and beliefs, and coming together,
10:12 which sounds great on the surface
10:14 but what are you giving up?
10:15 Are you giving up God's law to follow man's law
10:18 and man's idea or you know, just a come together?
10:23 Right, right, right. I remember with you, J.
10:27 I put you into karate, and without knowing, you know,
10:31 I was thinking, Eric, as you're talking about,
10:33 your mother was a bit reticent about taking you
10:37 to learn about self-defense and stuff.
10:41 Well, with J, I wanted to put him in there
10:43 because I want to make sure
10:45 that if anybody was trying to fight with him or something,
10:47 he would know how to defend himself.
10:50 And, well, J, you tell what happened with you
10:54 when I put you and took you out.
10:56 Well, okay.
10:58 So she put me into karate
11:00 and I went and was excited about it.
11:04 But then I noticed they had the statue in the front
11:07 and they want you to bow to a Buddha,
11:09 and then you know, you are bowing to each other,
11:12 it's a lot of bowing going on.
11:14 And my mom, when she saw that, she was like, no,
11:17 you are not bowing to anything, you know.
11:20 And she ended up pull me out not too long after that.
11:24 Oh, yeah, he never went back. Praise the Lord.
11:25 Because, I didn't...
11:27 when I walked in, I hadn't walked in before.
11:29 I would just drop him off and pick him up.
11:31 But I walked in this time with him,
11:34 and I saw everybody was bowing to a statue.
11:38 And I thought, oh, no, oh, no, no,
11:42 my son is not going to do that.
11:44 Was that your experience,
11:45 when you walked into that first training center,
11:50 dojo for the first time, did they have you bow,
11:54 bow to each other, bow to the statue?
11:56 What did you do when you walked in?
11:59 The first time that I went, we were just there visiting,
12:02 so we didn't have to go through you know,
12:04 that part of the ritual.
12:07 But if someone signs up,
12:09 it's very common even here in the states.
12:11 If it's a traditional school, you remove your shoes
12:14 when you step into the school or onto the mat,
12:17 you bow to the instructor, you bow towards the showmen
12:20 or the front of the dojo, the studio.
12:24 And that was one of the things that really,
12:27 I found after years of being in the martial arts was,
12:31 it made me compromise what God's word say.
12:35 God's word says, you know, "I am the Lord your God,
12:39 thy shall not bow down or serve anyone above me."
12:42 That's right.
12:44 Being at that martial arts, it doesn't really mean that.
12:46 I know that's what it says,
12:47 but that's not what it really means.
12:49 The martial art says
12:51 when you reach at certain level of achievement
12:53 that you are called the Sifu or a Sensei,
12:56 which means a master.
12:57 Jesus said, don't call any man master,
13:00 you have one master, even me.
13:03 Again, there's a compromise.
13:05 And then you know, I learned later on, you know,
13:08 when I stepped on to the training floor,
13:11 almost every martial arts studio
13:14 that's a traditional studio, you have to remove your shoes.
13:18 And I remember you know,
13:20 when I was at church reading about Moses,
13:22 when he appeared before the Lord at the burning bush,
13:24 and God told him, take off your shoes,
13:27 you're standing on holy ground.
13:29 And you know, but I did all these things
13:32 and it was like small steps.
13:34 Either you take one step and compromise,
13:36 and it's easier to take the next one.
13:38 And then you take another, and then you take another.
13:40 And pretty soon you're so far down the path
13:42 you can't find your way back out
13:43 nor do you even realize that you're in the wrong.
13:46 That's right.
13:48 So it was that way, it was very gradual.
13:50 And I didn't realize where it was leading me.
13:53 How long did you study? I was in it right at 25 years.
13:57 And far did you go?
14:00 The highest rank that I was awarded
14:03 was a 5th Dan in Chinese kung fu.
14:08 And then I had seven black belts
14:11 in combative styles
14:13 and then I also have instructor certification
14:15 in internal arts in Chinese medicines.
14:18 Explain that system to us. So you said a 5th Dan.
14:21 What is a 5th Dan
14:22 and what are the different levels?
14:24 Okay, and these vary dependant on whether it's Japanese style
14:28 or whether it's a Chinese style.
14:30 But as a general rule,
14:32 a 1st Dan is a first level black belt.
14:36 That means you just got your black belt.
14:38 And the masters will tell you,
14:39 that means you've mastered the basics.
14:41 It means you just got out of you know, the beginning,
14:44 you know the basics.
14:46 And for people that want to go past that,
14:49 they'll normally strive
14:51 to become what's known as a Sifu in Chinese
14:54 or a Sensei, which is an instructor.
14:57 Some schools, I mean,
14:59 you have to be a 2nd Dan or 3rd Dan.
15:01 Other schools, I mean, you can be promoted
15:03 to that right off the bat if the other instructor knows
15:06 that you're ready.
15:08 But the Dan or Dan ranks, they normally have,
15:11 most schools will have first through 10th Dan.
15:15 So you make black belt
15:16 and that's concerned first Dan,
15:18 and then there's a second Dan, a third Dan, a forth Dan.
15:21 And to reach the level of a master,
15:25 typically is a sixth Dan.
15:28 Normally, it's the number six
15:30 that they consider to be a master,
15:31 which I find interesting.
15:33 That is interesting.
15:34 Because six is the number of man.
15:36 Right.
15:37 And I know the last grandmaster that I trained under,
15:41 you know, he explained to me one time.
15:43 He said, "Eric," he said,
15:44 "For someone to achieve that rank,
15:47 to be recognized in traditional kung fu,"
15:49 which was my primary style back then,
15:52 "For someone to achieve a sixth Dan
15:55 there has to be a surrender to those powers,
15:59 there has to be a surrender."
16:01 He said, "You can have technique," he said,
16:03 "But it's not technique that makes a master,
16:07 there's something spiritual
16:09 that has to be imparted to you."
16:10 Isn't that fascinating?
16:12 You see if you're at this level.
16:15 You don't know about this spiritual dimension.
16:17 You don't know
16:19 that that there's something else going on
16:22 underneath it.
16:23 It's as you continue
16:25 actually to get deeper and deeper into it
16:28 that you learned that there's something else going on here.
16:32 It's not just self-defense, it's a spiritual level too.
16:37 Let's unpack that a little bit more, Eric,
16:38 because you bring out some things
16:42 in your documentary that we are going to air,
16:44 by the grace of God on Dare to Dream.
16:46 We're going to show that clip a bit later.
16:49 You bring out some things in there about Dao
16:53 and about the circle.
16:55 I found that to be fascinating.
16:57 Let's talk a little bit more
16:58 about this spiritualistic aspect of the martial arts.
17:05 One of the, one of the first things
17:07 that I remember when I was training,
17:10 like, as a white belt,
17:12 as a beginner in the studio that I started in,
17:15 I would watch some of the men that had you know,
17:17 green belts or brown belts that had been there for,
17:19 you know, three years, or five years, or eight years,
17:22 or ten years.
17:23 And I would watch them when they would fight
17:26 or when they would kick the bag
17:27 or when they would do certain you know,
17:29 drills, and you could see the power that was there.
17:33 And then I would watch the grandmaster,
17:35 and I'll never forget something.
17:37 I remember one time
17:38 when he was talking to a group of the higher level students,
17:41 and he was talking to them about this energy
17:44 that is known as Chi,
17:46 or in the Japanese, they call it Ki,
17:48 like an aikido.
17:50 He was talking about this energy
17:52 that martial artists strove to access, to tap into.
17:58 And he said, "When you grab a hold of your opponent,"
18:01 he said, "It's not just physical muscle."
18:04 You can't just physically do things
18:08 because that will only go so far.
18:09 I mean, I can run my whole life
18:11 and I'm never going to be overrun 70 miles an hour,
18:14 right?
18:15 You know, because I'm not built to do that.
18:18 With a human being,
18:20 the human fist is not physically built to do things
18:26 that you see a lot of martial artists capable of doing.
18:29 And when he was demonstrating this to them,
18:31 I remember we had a training bagged.
18:33 It was like 150 pound training bag.
18:36 And it's hanging you know, and he reached over
18:40 and he grabbed that with one hand
18:42 and he picked it up and he shook it with one hand.
18:46 And it was like, all of us were just dumbstruck, you know.
18:50 How did he picked that up with one hand
18:52 like it was featherweight?
18:55 And then he said, "That's what you got to know
18:57 how to tap into, that's what..."
18:59 So this carrot was constantly dangled in front of the,
19:04 the students that have been initiated,
19:06 the ones that have been there for a few years.
19:09 There's always that carrot.
19:10 They say, if you want more
19:12 you just got to take another step,
19:14 another compromise.
19:17 And that's the thing, you don't have a sense...
19:21 when you first get into it you have no idea
19:23 how far you're going to drift.
19:26 Because Satan is very crafty,
19:29 he just takes you just a little step at a time,
19:33 a little step at a time.
19:34 Were you going to say something, J?
19:35 Yeah.
19:37 We talked prior to this program
19:38 and you were you were talking about Chi,
19:41 and when you get to a certain level
19:43 how you're teaching different levels,
19:46 different things about Chi.
19:47 Will you touch on that?
19:52 What is your, definition of Chi?
19:55 Let me give you the definition that I was given
19:58 by one of the grandmasters I'd trained under.
20:01 I went to see him to learn from him
20:04 that weekend and he only taught black belts.
20:07 You could come to him from any style, any style,
20:11 it didn't matter, and so I went to learn,
20:13 and he would take you and begin training you.
20:15 Even if he had never been in that style
20:17 he could teach you how to make your style better,
20:20 how to make your abilities better.
20:22 And I asked him one time, I said, you know,
20:26 "How do you know what this person knows,
20:30 how do you help them?"
20:31 And he said, "Eric," he said, "all martial arts
20:34 find the roots at the Shaolin Temple."
20:37 And he said, "What was it that Shaolin Temple taught?"
20:41 He said, "If you see Taekwondo and you Tai-Chi,
20:45 and you see you know, yoga,
20:47 and you see Taoist exercises,
20:49 and you see you know, Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu or aikido,
20:53 if all of them find the roots at the Shaolin temple."
20:57 He said, "What was that they taught?"
20:59 Because all of these look
21:00 like they're so different from one another."
21:03 And I didn't know the answer, but I was very intrigued,
21:06 I wanted to know.
21:07 What is the common thread
21:09 that's woven throughout all of these different arts?
21:13 And I'll never forget, he drew a diagram
21:16 and he showed all these arts, almost like a family tree.
21:19 He showed all of these paths,
21:21 how they all went back to Shaolin,
21:24 and then at Shaolin, he took the marker
21:26 and he put a big E, and he circled it.
21:29 He said, "That's what they taught.
21:31 Energy, Chi."
21:34 And he said, "That's what they want to share
21:37 with the world."
21:38 He said, "Now when a beginner comes to me," he said,
21:42 "you teach a beginner that Chi is this internal strength
21:44 that's already inside you,
21:46 you just have to learn how to tap into it and use it."
21:49 And they do that with yoga, they do it with Tai-Chi,
21:51 they do it with aikido, meditation, whatever,
21:55 didn't matter what you call it.
21:57 He says, "Now for an intermediate student,
22:00 we tell them that Chi is a breath."
22:03 That's why you do the deep breathing exercises
22:05 that's why the meditation and, the chanting, the mantras.
22:12 He said, "Now for the advanced student,"
22:14 he said, "for someone that's past black belt,"
22:17 he said, "you reveal to them what Chi really is.
22:21 Chi is spirit."
22:24 And when he said that to me, you know,
22:27 alarm bells were going off.
22:29 But unfortunately, I mean, I turned my ear,
22:31 I didn't want to hear what God was trying to tell me.
22:34 And it was, it wasn't long after that
22:38 that I went to visit him for some one-on-one training.
22:42 And I'll never forget this, when this happened,
22:45 I was there in the studio, in a martial art studio
22:48 and he and I were talking,
22:50 and one of the young black belts,
22:52 younger man came in.
22:53 And he was carrying this big piece of artwork
22:56 that was covered in brown paper,
22:57 you know, wrapped you know, with string.
23:00 And the grandmaster was really excited.
23:03 And I don't call him that, I got to be careful,
23:06 I don't call him that because that's what I think of him.
23:08 He's just a man but I'm giving a reference.
23:10 Right, right.
23:12 But this grandmaster,
23:13 he was so excited about receiving this artwork.
23:16 And so he took the paper off of it
23:18 and he put this out there and says,
23:19 "This really beautiful piece of Chinese calligraphy.
23:23 And you know, you look at it,
23:25 and I knew what some of the Chinese symbols were
23:27 in calligraphy, but not all, I couldn't read Chinese.
23:31 And so the young black belt left
23:33 and we were there alone in the studio,
23:36 and I asked the grandmaster, I said,
23:39 "What does it mean?"
23:41 And he got this look on his face,
23:43 and I could tell that the enemy,
23:46 the dragon was influencing him, how to avoid it.
23:52 And he said, "What it means in English is,
23:58 it's the devil that's in the details."
24:01 Wow.
24:02 And when he said that,
24:07 I mean, didn't know what to say,
24:08 because there was no getting around that.
24:10 And it was like the Lord was in his mercy,
24:12 he was trying desperately to set me free.
24:16 And in my mind, what I said was,
24:19 okay, he may believe that
24:21 but I don't have to go that far.
24:23 You know, I'm not going to, it doesn't mean that to me,
24:26 you know, when we meditate, I know what she's meditate to
24:29 but I'm meditating to Jesus.
24:32 That's what I did.
24:33 Eric, I did almost the same thing,
24:35 because a lot of you know my journey
24:38 with eastern medicine, traditional Chinese medicine.
24:41 And I did a lot of the same thing.
24:43 Once you've gotten to a certain place
24:47 and you start finding out a little bit more,
24:49 and a little bit more,
24:51 you have one or two choices to make.
24:53 You either say, "Oh, I'm way I'm out too far," or you say,
24:58 "I don't embrace that, this is where I am,
25:02 I am a Christian, I'm not into that eastern thing,
25:05 so I'm going to just put that aside."
25:08 So I know exactly what you're saying
25:11 that you reached that point and really the Lord was,
25:15 he was reaching out to me almost tears in my eyes
25:18 as you were talking, because I know
25:19 he was trying to get your attention
25:22 and show you where you were.
25:24 But by this point you were so immersed it
25:28 that you made rationalizations for it.
25:31 Yes.
25:32 So how did these little compromises
25:37 and rationalizations,
25:38 how did that affect your family?
25:41 By this time I would imagine
25:42 that you have a family, you're married.
25:45 How did your studying the martial arts
25:47 affect your family?
25:50 Probably the greatest way that I noticed from myself
25:53 that the training in the martial arts,
25:57 and it wasn't just martial arts,
25:59 but it was also some of the other arts
26:01 that I had begun learning.
26:02 You know, the internal arts like Tai-chi, or Bagua,
26:05 or Qigong.
26:07 The focus was inward.
26:09 So you know, someone that practices Tie-Chi,
26:12 you're always taught in that class how do you feel.
26:16 You know, so instead of being faith in God's word,
26:18 it's feeling.
26:19 In yoga, your focus is inward. How does this make you feel?
26:23 Are you breathing right
26:24 or are you feeling that in the right place?
26:26 Well, looking inward, the focus is on self,
26:30 in the martial arts the focus is on self.
26:33 If you open the yellow page ad, anywhere in the country,
26:37 you'll see one main description, self,
26:41 self-esteem, self-discipline, self-control, self-defense.
26:46 Everything's focuses on self rather than on others.
26:51 So what happened was
26:52 I started noticing in my family,
26:54 in my marriage that my focus was on self,
26:58 it was on me rather than on how can I please my wife,
27:01 how can I sacrifice myself
27:04 on behalf of my family, my wife,
27:06 my children, and others.
27:08 My focus was on me, I want to take care of me.
27:12 And that developed kind of correlated with your,
27:18 the deeper you got into the martial arts,
27:20 the more into self you became?
27:23 Yes, Yes.
27:24 And, and that's amazing too
27:26 because like there's a lot of the yoga websites now,
27:30 when you look,
27:31 they'll have a picture of the Buddha.
27:34 And they'll have a picture, you know, and they'll say,
27:37 "Yoga is the study of self,
27:39 it's the realization of the greater self within."
27:43 And you think, wow,
27:44 I mean, has the Lord not warned us of this?
27:46 And you know, yoga is creeping into churches,
27:51 and schools, and there's just this big push.
27:55 I'm working now on my second little booklet,
27:58 my first one was, What's Wrong with Acupuncture?
28:01 Because I was involved in that for years.
28:04 And now I'm working on one, What's Wrong with Yoga?"
28:07 Praise the Lord.
28:08 Praise the Lord, because people think that it's harmless,
28:12 it's just them stretching and breathing, and it's not.
28:15 What do you say is wrong with yoga?
28:18 The part that is the most,
28:23 the thing that should give us the most clear warning
28:26 is what the word yoga literally means.
28:29 When you look at the word yoga up, in Hindu, Sanskrit,
28:33 if you go to any Hindu dictionary
28:35 or any yoga website,
28:36 they are open about what yoga is.
28:39 The word yoga literally means to yoke to
28:42 or be joined to Brahma,
28:45 which is another name for the Hindu Gods collectively.
28:48 And it's a counterfeit.
28:51 Jesus said, "Come unto me all you that labor
28:53 and are heavy laden,
28:55 take my yoke upon you and learn of me."
28:58 But these pagan disciplines are saying,
29:01 "Become yoked to Brahma,
29:03 become yoked or join to these Hindu Gods."
29:07 So that that's the first clue that it's not a good thing.
29:10 Absolutely.
29:12 It's interesting because all of these things
29:13 are the opposite of Christianity,
29:15 like you were saying a lot of self, self, self, self
29:19 and then feelings.
29:20 We're taught to operate off principles not feelings.
29:23 Amen. So that's very interesting.
29:26 And then it's interesting that it's, the whole thing
29:28 is seems like in terms of martial arts
29:31 that it's based off deception, right?
29:34 So you are supposed to teach a certain thing
29:36 to different levels.
29:38 So you tell them that okay, this Chi is just energy,
29:41 it's just the life force.
29:43 Then it becomes breathing.
29:44 Then you know, later what was the third thing?
29:47 Then it becomes a spirit.
29:49 Then it becomes spirit, so then you really find out
29:52 once you've already got deep enough.
29:56 So I find that to be very interesting,
30:00 almost like gone back to the garden.
30:02 It is, and it's funny that you use that analogy
30:05 because when you look at what they teach
30:09 in any of these eastern mystical arts,
30:13 I was asked one time, you know,
30:16 what is it, if you could sum up in one sentence,
30:19 what's the danger of any of these eastern practices?
30:23 It's one thing.
30:25 It undermines faith in God's word.
30:29 And let me share, you just said it.
30:32 They put feeling instead of faith in God's word,
30:35 instead of principle.
30:37 This is what God says, I'm going to walk forward
30:39 because he said this, he's promised this.
30:42 But do I feel that way?
30:43 So you're taught to rely on how you feel
30:46 rather than what you know to be right
30:48 from the word of God.
30:49 And in my life, in the martial arts
30:52 as well as the other arts, traditional Chinese medicine
30:55 or the qigong or whatever,
30:57 that principle was the same that was what was compromised.
31:02 So as I began to yield to what these eastern arts
31:08 were telling me to do, taking my shoes off, bowing,
31:11 calling the man Sifu or master or grandmaster,
31:14 when God's word says don't do that.
31:17 They got easier to compromise.
31:19 And when the enemy came into my wife and I's life,
31:23 as he attacks so many marriages,
31:26 God's word says, this is how you do it.
31:29 I hate divorce.
31:31 I have no will that anyone ever goes through that
31:34 because I know the damage it does.
31:37 And then I'm used to looking inwardly,
31:42 how does this make me feel?
31:44 You know, well, I don't care if that's what God's word says.
31:48 May be he didn't even really mean that.
31:49 I can remember
31:51 when the devil first brought the thought
31:53 to my mind about,
31:54 this is not going to work, you know,
31:56 I'll just need to split up.
31:57 You were made for one another.
31:59 It's like, I went through this scriptures for months
32:02 looking up every single word that I can find,
32:04 every promise, every commanded by God
32:07 that had to do with marriage.
32:09 And it's like I couldn't find anything to give me an out.
32:13 And it's not that I wanted to get divorced
32:15 but it was like I had been taught for all those years
32:19 to top to fight physically,
32:23 even though the Word of God says,
32:25 "That the weapons of our warfare are not carnal,
32:27 they're not fleshly."
32:29 So when my marriage came under attack
32:31 instead of getting on my knees
32:33 and using the sword of the Spirit,
32:36 I was trying to do it in my own strength.
32:38 And I failed miserably,
32:40 and I felt like I couldn't achieve,
32:42 I couldn't do the right thing.
32:45 You know, I would say, I'm going to bite my tongue,
32:46 I'm not going to say that.
32:48 The next thing I knew I'm opening my mouth
32:49 and I'm saying something that,
32:51 you know, I shouldn't say that hurt my wife.
32:53 So it got to a point where I just said,
32:55 you know I can't do this anymore,
32:57 I can't live this way anymore.
32:59 And I walked away from my wife and my family.
33:02 And you know, I was hurting,
33:05 but I hurt them so much greater.
33:08 But all of that came about because of one simple thing,
33:12 not having faith
33:14 that God will do exactly what he's promised.
33:18 So was your wife,
33:20 when you were studying the martial arts and all that,
33:23 was she noticing the changes in you over the years
33:27 as a result of that or did she,
33:29 does she have a connect the two things?
33:33 She didn't, when we were, when we were still together
33:38 because we wound up going through a separation
33:40 and divorce.
33:42 She saw the changes but she didn't realize
33:46 that there were spiritual forces
33:48 that were working to bring those changes about,
33:51 fallen angels.
33:52 I mean, demons or devils, whatever you want to call them.
33:56 They have an active role in so many people's lives
34:00 and she didn't realize
34:02 that that's what was causing the conflict.
34:05 You know, Ephesians 6 tells us
34:07 that we wrestle not against flesh and blood
34:09 but against principalities and powers.
34:11 That's not just the people that are rule in the world,
34:14 it's the people that are in our homes.
34:16 Like demons. Yeah.
34:18 And we open the door for them
34:21 to the certain things within our lives
34:23 that open the door for them to come in.
34:25 That's right, that's right. Absolutely.
34:27 So by my permission they were entering into our lives.
34:31 And I'll give an example
34:33 the word martial art is the art of war.
34:36 It literally means martial, war, art, the art of war.
34:41 And you think,
34:43 is that what I wanted to teach my children?
34:45 That's the fruit of what that training will do.
34:48 They say it's self-discipline and self-control
34:51 but what you're actually gonna have
34:53 is you're gonna have someone who's very proud,
34:55 independent, un-submissive, selfish,
35:00 self-centered, controlling.
35:03 All of those fruits of warfare, in my wife and I's life,
35:09 one of the things that first struck her,
35:13 it was right after we had separated,
35:15 I don't know if we were divorced yet or not.
35:17 But the Lord showed her something, she had a dream.
35:21 And she said, in this dream she saw,
35:25 the higher level people that were there at the school,
35:27 that I was training with, you know the green belts,
35:30 brown belts, black belts.
35:31 And she said, "We were linked arm and arm together,"
35:37 and she said, "she looked and she could see us,"
35:40 and then she said, "she saw on the outside, the wives,
35:45 and the mothers, and the children.
35:46 And she said, "We were getting closer in this circle,
35:51 was being pulled tighter,
35:52 and the families were being pushed to the outside."
35:57 And I remember her telling me that dream
35:59 and I sort of just dismissed it,
36:02 I didn't want to hear it when she told me,
36:03 I wasn't, my eyes weren't opened to hear or to see.
36:08 And but the Lord is very merciful.
36:11 How did he get your attention?
36:15 One night I was teaching a class,
36:18 this was after my wife and I had been divorced for sometime.
36:25 I was teaching a class, and it was a Bagua class,
36:28 and I was teaching a beginning level group,
36:31 so we were going through the motions very slowly,
36:33 it's similar to Tai-Chi.
36:35 And I was leading them
36:37 in what's called a form or a Kata.
36:40 And I was leading this group of men and women
36:44 and we were walking slowly in this circle,
36:47 and we were doing these certain mudras,
36:49 these hand movements,
36:50 and we were focusing internally on our breathing
36:54 and focusing on moving this "energy" through our body.
37:00 And while we were doing this I looked
37:02 and were moving no faster than this,
37:04 everything that we were doing was slow motion.
37:07 And as I was doing it a looked in the eyes
37:11 of you know, those 12, 13, 14 people that were there,
37:14 however many.
37:16 And it's like they were in a trance, they were gone,
37:19 and they were drenched in sweat.
37:22 And a thought popped into my head,
37:25 we have not done anything that is Callisthenic.
37:29 Why are they sweating?
37:31 I mean, physically, physiologically,
37:33 that doesn't make sense.
37:35 Why are they drenched in sweat, and we're moving this slow?
37:40 And at that moment I remember, it was,
37:44 I felt like I was taken above.
37:47 It's like I was looking down from 20 feet above
37:50 where we were,
37:52 and I could see what I was doing,
37:53 I could see our students and I saw a pattern.
38:00 You know it's like somebody,
38:01 when a farmer goes out in this field
38:02 and there's a crop circle, what does he see?
38:05 It's a mess, who did this to my corn?
38:08 When the guy flies over that morning in the airplane,
38:10 he's like who did that design on the ground?
38:14 He doesn't see a mess, he can see what it really is.
38:17 And the Lord was allowing me to see from his perspective.
38:22 And when the class was over, I went to a piece of paper
38:25 and I drew what that looked like,
38:27 and it was a circle with a dot in the center,
38:30 a focal point or a bull's eye.
38:33 And all the sudden, it was like there was a flash in my mind
38:36 of that picture that, it's called enso,
38:40 that picture of that circle with that dot in the middle.
38:43 Through all the literature, all the books that I had,
38:46 didn't matter if they were Chinese or Japanese or Hindu,
38:50 Aikido, Kung-Fu, Shaolin, even Filipino.
38:55 I remembered seeing that in the books in my library.
38:59 And that night I went home, to my apartment
39:02 and I started pulling those books out,
39:05 looking for that symbol.
39:06 And after I found it in so many different places,
39:09 I went online and looked,
39:11 and I saw what that symbol really meant.
39:14 And I began, the Lord began to cause me
39:17 to understand the powers that were behind
39:20 when I was practicing.
39:23 And I thought, you know, how do I tell my students this?
39:25 I mean, they're going to resist.
39:27 You tell somebody a new truth and the wall goes up.
39:29 What does the symbol mean? I'll tell you in a second.
39:31 Okay, okay go ahead, go ahead.
39:33 I got to tell you how...
39:34 Okay, okay go ahead.
39:37 So I went to my advanced class the next week,
39:40 we had a special group of people
39:41 that met on a certain night, 10 o'clock at night
39:44 after all the other classes were done,
39:46 and we had a closed door class,
39:48 where I taught them about the secret stuff
39:50 in martial arts, you know, Chi and Energy.
39:53 And I told my son, I have homework for you.
39:56 I said, "I want you to,"
39:57 I drew that symbol on the board, I said,
40:00 "I want you to find out what this symbol means."
40:02 I said, "I don't care where you look,
40:04 you can look in Babylonian, Egyptian Hieroglyphs,
40:08 you can look in witchcraft, you can look in Tattoo books,
40:11 you can look in martial arts."
40:12 I said, "I don't care where you find that symbol,
40:14 find that symbol and find the meaning for me."
40:16 And the symbol is a circle, within a circle.
40:20 It's a circle with a dot in the center.
40:22 A circle with a dot.
40:24 It can be, doesn't matter the size of the dot,
40:25 it's just a circle within a circle.
40:28 And, anyway, so left on with that,
40:31 didn't make a big issue out of it.
40:33 They all came back the next week for that class
40:36 and you could have heard a pin drop
40:38 when I walked in.
40:40 Nobody was talking. Everybody was just silent.
40:43 And I asked them I said,
40:45 "Okay," I said, "Who wants to go first?"
40:47 And one by one they began to get up
40:50 and share what they found and what their sources were.
40:53 And they were from all kinds of sources.
40:56 But all of them had the same answer.
40:58 All of these high level students
41:00 had the same answer.
41:02 The symbol is the symbol for the Sun God.
41:06 It was the original symbol of the Yin and Yang.
41:09 You know we see a Yin and Yang, which is part white,
41:11 part black, a little bit a wide in the dark place
41:15 and a little bit of black in the light place.
41:17 That symbol originally was just a circle.
41:20 And then the Dao said,
41:21 "It's really a circle with a dot in the center."
41:23 And then they said,
41:25 "No, it's really a symbol with a Yin and Yang.
41:29 And now we're seeing that change one more time
41:31 to where it's actually three,
41:35 there's a division into three spheres.
41:39 But they all found it.
41:40 So I didn't have to tell them what I had found,
41:44 they found it.
41:45 The Sun God.
41:48 I hope that our viewers are picking up
41:52 on what this really is, this is not...
41:55 Again, there are surface things
41:58 and then there are latent, a cult, hidden things.
42:03 And the Lord would have us to know
42:06 what is really behind this eastern mysticism.
42:11 Remember, in the Bible
42:12 how people will worship famous Sun,
42:15 God hated that.
42:17 And now it's all through the martial arts,
42:20 the Yin and the Yang, you know,
42:22 the whole concept of blending...
42:25 The light with dark.
42:27 Light with darkness, good and evil.
42:29 It's like God never called this to--
42:31 we are to eschew evil.
42:32 Amen.
42:33 But God, but,
42:36 God, would have us to know that this is what's going on
42:42 out there so that we can be equipped,
42:44 we can be equipped and well furnished.
42:46 Now, what about if you, is there any way to separate,
42:50 let's say you want to learn self-defense techniques.
42:53 Like how can you separate,
42:55 or can you even separate the spiritual component
42:59 from the actual physical part?
43:02 That's a good question,
43:04 and we have a lot of Christians,
43:05 especially men that ask that.
43:07 Because you know, as a man,
43:09 we ought to protect our families,
43:10 we are to protect the helpless.
43:15 What I have found
43:17 and I encourage every man and woman
43:19 that's listening, you know, seek the Lord personally
43:22 for they answer of this question.
43:24 I'm going to share with you what the Lord has shown me.
43:28 The idea, let's take for example of our military.
43:32 Right now our military is being trained
43:34 in a lot of the different eastern arts.
43:37 Our police officers are being trained heavily in the Chinese,
43:42 and the Japanese, and the Filipino martial arts.
43:47 We did not see military or law enforcement
43:52 using these arts until after World War II,
43:55 when our troops came home from Asia,
43:59 from Okinawa.
44:00 When, when our troops went to Okinawa,
44:02 they saw all these little masters, you know,
44:04 some of them only 4.8 foot, 5 foot tall,
44:08 they could do the seemly miraculous things,
44:11 and they were enthralled.
44:13 And they came back
44:15 and they brought that with them.
44:16 And then the Orient
44:17 begin to send more masters over here
44:20 to introduce you know, these eastern techniques.
44:24 Because with the eastern techniques
44:26 comes the eastern philosophy.
44:28 Yin and Yang, every art,
44:31 no matter whether it's Chinese medicine
44:32 or yoga or Tai-Chi or Reiki or kung-fu,
44:38 it doesn't matter.
44:39 Every one of those arts,
44:41 their philosophy is based on Yin and Yang,
44:44 the blending of light and darkness.
44:46 Now with self-defense, and I'll give you an example.
44:50 I cannot find the phrase self-defense
44:53 anywhere in Scripture.
44:55 I can find, I can find hundreds of places
44:59 where it says, "The Lord is my defense."
45:01 And I'll share with you why I respond with that.
45:05 I remember one day when my stepfather,
45:07 and he is a God-fearing man.
45:09 He came to visit with my mom and my family had left
45:15 and he and I were there alone.
45:16 And he came into the office and he said, he said, "Eric,
45:19 let me ask you a question now that your wife's not here."
45:22 He said, "Now I know you got out of the martial arts,"
45:25 he said, "I know God you know, called you out of that."
45:27 And he said, "But if someone broke into your house tonight
45:32 and they were going to hurt your wife and children,"
45:35 he said, "You'd use those martial arts techniques
45:39 to defend your family, wouldn't you?"
45:41 And the moment he started the question
45:42 I knew where it was going, and I was praying,
45:45 I was like, Lord, I need an answer,
45:47 not my answer, I need your answer.
45:49 What is your answer?
45:51 And the Lord gave me that answer.
45:53 And I told him, I said, "Wayne," I said,
45:56 "I know you're a man of God,
45:57 I know you believe the Bible, don't you?"
45:59 And he said, "Yes."
46:01 And I said, "Right here, in Psalm 34:7-8,
46:06 there's a promise that's given us."
46:08 The Lord says, "The angel of the Lord
46:12 encamps round about them
46:15 that fear Him and delivers them.
46:19 Blessed is the man that trust within him.
46:22 Oh, taste and see that the Lord is good."
46:26 And I said, "You know what,"
46:27 I said, "I'm not saying that God is going to condemn someone
46:31 who uses a gun or that uses a baseball bat
46:34 or uses pepper spray.
46:37 That's not what I'm saying."
46:38 I said, "But what I have decided in my life
46:40 is I want to walk on a path of faith.
46:44 I want to walk as I see Peter, and James,
46:46 and John, and Paul.
46:48 And I can't find one account of them
46:50 ever having to defend themselves
46:52 in the New Testament."
46:55 Now I did have someone bring it to me one time
46:57 to question, the Old Testament.
46:59 Well, God sent the children of Israel
47:01 into the land of Canaan, and he said,
47:02 wipe out man, woman, and child, and what about that?
47:06 And I was like,
47:07 okay, that's a good question Lord, you know.
47:09 What your answer to that?
47:11 And a friend of mine have a little light studios,
47:13 just happened to have that answer.
47:15 And he called me one day and he shared it with me.
47:17 He said, "Eric did you ever notice
47:19 that when the children of Israel
47:21 were sent into the land of Canaan,
47:22 what the Lord told them?"
47:24 I said, I mean, no, I didn't.
47:27 He said, it actually says, you won't have to fight
47:30 because I'm going to send the hornets in the bees in,
47:33 in front of you
47:34 and they will drive out the inhabitants of the land.
47:37 But you know what,
47:39 they didn't trust God to do what he said he would do.
47:41 So God said, "Okay, if you're going to have to go to Plan B,
47:44 then I'll help you.
47:46 But I want plan A."
47:48 So, you know, when it comes to self-defense,
47:52 when Jesus said, turn the other cheek,
47:54 he's not talking about somebody
47:56 that's trying to murder you or your family.
47:58 He's talking about you and I have an issue,
48:00 or you and some man has an issue,
48:02 and there's pride involved, and I'm trying to show you up
48:05 or you're trying to show me up.
48:07 Jesus was like, take the blow.
48:09 I mean, it's not going to kill you,
48:10 get knocked down, it's not going to kill you.
48:13 So that's what that means
48:14 when it talks about turn the other cheek.
48:16 You know, defending your family,
48:18 I encourage each of us
48:20 because of the days we're living in,
48:22 to learn how to take hold of his promises
48:25 and not let go because he cannot lie.
48:29 So if someone is, 'cause this question
48:31 had crossed my mind earlier.
48:33 If after 24, 25 years of practicing that,
48:38 if someone approached you from the back
48:40 and just grabbed you,
48:42 would you just instinctively go into a defensive mode,
48:46 just because that's kind of, that was where you were?
48:50 Do you kind of instinctively respond to that or,
48:55 'cause you might not even have a chance
48:57 to cognitively go there.
48:59 I'm just, you know what I mean, like...
49:01 Like a reflex. Like a reflex.
49:02 Okay, and that's I'm glad you brought that up.
49:07 One of the grandmasters I trained with, there were two.
49:10 The first one, he told me something he said, "Eric,"
49:12 he said, "you never want there to be a thought in a fight."
49:17 He said, "If you think
49:18 while you're fighting you've already lost."
49:21 We were taught in the Chinese system,
49:23 in kung-fu, you've got to become the animal.
49:26 If you're a tiger stylist, you have to become,
49:31 you have to allow that spirit of the tiger
49:34 to take possession of you.
49:35 And they weren't really you know,
49:38 in a nice way, you know.
49:40 You want to become like that tiger,
49:42 and that inspires you with, wow,
49:44 they're ferocious and they're brave.
49:46 And they let that go for a while.
49:48 But after you get past black belt
49:50 or right at, they tell you, you have to become it.
49:53 You don't pretend anymore. We go through the motions.
49:57 Like in the Chinese system, you know,
49:59 you would do motions like a tiger
50:01 or stance like a tiger.
50:03 But we do that because you're going through those motions
50:06 to make it easier to allow that spirit to come in.
50:11 So on a self-defense, you know, viewpoint,
50:16 when we look at that and you think,
50:19 how do I defend myself against somebody?
50:21 You know, are those reactions going to come back?
50:26 Walking away from martial arts is not like walking away from,
50:29 okay, I'm not going to go clubbing anymore,
50:31 I'm not going to listen to rock 'n' roll music.
50:34 There were spirits that had been there
50:36 influencing my life for those 25 years,
50:40 those had to be cast out of my life.
50:44 And when the Lord, you know, set me free from that.
50:47 I remember, I kept a couple of boxes that had rank,
50:52 and certificates, and all these pictures,
50:55 and videos, and books and all that junk.
50:58 And one day the Lord spoke to me and he was like,
51:00 how long are you going to keep that stuff?
51:03 I said, why, I may need that, Lord, you know,
51:04 one day to show people.
51:06 And God was like, burn it,
51:08 because you still haven't closed the door.
51:11 So what I did was, I photocopied everything
51:13 that need to be photocopied,
51:15 and I went outside my family and we lit a nice bonfire.
51:19 And it was amazing because when we did this,
51:23 I was burning the belts, and burning certificates.
51:26 And certificates on parchment paper,
51:27 you know, it's just paper.
51:29 You'd stick a green belt certificate in there
51:31 and it was gone.
51:33 And I put the first black belt certificate in there,
51:36 in kung-fu, and it took probably 10 or 15 minutes
51:39 for that one piece of paper to burn.
51:42 It sat there in the middle of a bonfire
51:44 that was you know, four feet tall
51:47 and it sizzled and smoked, but would not catch fire.
51:51 And my son even noticed it,
51:53 he was like, "Dad, what what's wrong with that?
51:55 Why would it not burn?"
51:57 And same thing, when I put that first black belt in there.
52:00 I mean, it took forever for that thing to burn.
52:03 And the other belts, it was like there were gone.
52:06 But God told me, he said, Eric, he said,
52:08 when you come out of it, are you willing for me
52:11 to deliver you from all the gifts
52:13 that you've gained?
52:15 And I remember the verse in the Bible, it says,
52:17 'If any man be in Christ Jesus he is a new creation.
52:21 Old things are passed away,
52:23 behold, all things are become new."
52:25 And I wrestled with that for a few days and I was like,
52:28 I'm willing for you to take those gifts.
52:30 I'm willing for you to take those memories,
52:32 and I forsake them.
52:34 And so now if somebody comes up
52:35 and they grab a hold of me,
52:37 they're just grabbing a hold of just a nobody.
52:40 I'm 47 year old, nobody.
52:43 Well, that's amazing, your story is amazing.
52:45 And we are planning to air,
52:48 you have a documentary really, a two part series
52:52 that we want to air on Dare to Dream.
52:54 We want to show a clip from that in just a second,
52:57 but your story is just amazing, and we thank you so much.
53:01 Let's show that clip
53:02 so that viewers can see what's going to be on that.
53:20 I remember my first introduction
53:22 to the martial arts.
53:24 I was only about four or five years old,
53:27 as I watched in amazement as a little oriental man
53:30 perform seemingly impossible feats of skill and power.
53:34 A seed was planted that day,
53:37 a seed which grew silently within in my heart
53:39 for the next 10 years of my young life.
53:43 I never forgot the exhibition that I had seen that day,
53:46 and I dreamed of the possibility
53:48 of doing those things,
53:49 which I had watched the little old Asian man
53:52 demonstrate with such ease.
53:55 But little did I realize the darkness
53:56 into which this path I was now following would lead.
54:00 Nor the lives that my decision that day
54:02 would influence and forever change.
54:06 Today, the martial arts are looked upon as sport,
54:09 as self-defense, help, and fitness,
54:12 and often as a form of artistic expression.
54:15 But is this the way it is always been?
54:18 Who are these men and women who dedicate their lives
54:21 to these arts and amaze onlookers
54:24 with their incredible feats
54:25 of almost superhuman strength and speed?
54:29 How are these abilities attained?
54:31 And from whence comes the philosophies
54:33 and spiritual teachings which permeate practices?
54:37 Why do we see such a growing influence
54:40 of Eastern philosophy and mystical practices
54:42 within the Christian church over the last 10 years?
54:45 Are these practices focused merely on athletic ability?
54:49 Or are they being used to prepare mankind
54:52 for the coming of a world teacher
54:54 and a 1,000 years of peace?
54:57 Are these eastern mystical arts,
54:59 based merely on human talent and ability?
55:02 Or is there something much darker
55:04 and more elusive working behind the scenes?
55:09 Wow! The Dragon Revealed.
55:12 That's, it's an amazing documentary.
55:14 And Eric, and Little Light Studios
55:17 have given us permission to share it with you.
55:20 So check your listing, your schedule
55:22 to see when it's going to air
55:24 because we're going to air it on Sabbath afternoons,
55:27 on Saturday, for those you don't know
55:28 when the Sabbath is.
55:30 The Seventh-day of the week, Saturday.
55:32 We're going to start airing it on the Sabbath,
55:34 Saturday afternoon.
55:35 So check your schedule to see when it's going to air.
55:40 Excellent.
55:41 So, Eric, what would you tell our viewers
55:43 in one minute or so.
55:45 What would you tell the viewer
55:47 who has been involved in the martial arts,
55:52 how can they detach from it?
55:54 What can they do to get away from it?
55:57 Tell them, please look into that camera
55:59 and talk to our viewer about their journey.
56:03 What I would do for anyone
56:06 that this had involvement in these arts,
56:08 whether it be martial arts, or Tie-Chi or yoga,
56:12 just seek from God's word first the truth.
56:16 Lord, does this line up with your word?
56:19 Once you've done that, all it takes is surrender.
56:22 The moment that we go to Christ and we say,
56:25 I'm so sorry what I did,
56:26 I didn't know this was ignorant.
56:29 I didn't know when I was involved in it.
56:31 Ask Him to forgive you,
56:33 tell him that you want to surrender
56:35 and be completely his.
56:37 And the moment you do that,
56:39 that moment he will set you free.
56:42 We so appreciate you and your ministry.
56:45 Tell us, give us your website so that people can find you.
56:49 Our website is IsaiahMinistries.wordpress.com.
56:54 And we'd be happy to answer questions
56:56 or to also send help if someone would like help or prayer.
56:59 Oh, that's great.
57:01 Thank you so for being with us. It is a pleasure to meet you.
57:03 And you too, J. You too.
57:05 Matthew 7:17-20 says,
57:07 "Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit
57:10 but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
57:14 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit
57:17 neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
57:20 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down
57:23 and cast into the fire.
57:25 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them."
57:28 So we ask you today,
57:30 what is the root of the tree that you are developing?
57:35 Is it a corrupt tree
57:38 or is it good fruit that's gonna be born
57:41 from a good root?
57:44 Check and see what you're studying,
57:46 make sure that you're in the will of God.
57:49 God has a plan for you, He's not gonna let you down.
57:53 So thank you so much for joining us.
57:55 Thank you, Jason. And you're welcome, mother.
57:57 Thank you again, Eric. This was a blessing.
58:00 Join us next time 'cause you know what,
58:02 it's just wouldn't be the same without you.


Revised 2016-08-22