Participants:
Series Code: TDY
Program Code: TDY018109A
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00:01 I want to spend my life
00:07 Mending broken people 00:12 I want to spend my life 00:18 Removing pain 00:23 Lord, let my words Let my words 00:29 Heal a heart that hurts 00:34 I want to spend my life 00:40 Mending broken people 00:45 I want to spend my life 00:51 Mending broken people 01:10 Hello, friends, welcome to 3ABN Today. 01:12 My name is John Lomacang 01:14 and I have to my left my co-pilot. 01:17 Good to have you here, honey. Yeah, I am so happy to be here. 01:19 I am excited about today's program. 01:21 Wow. It's gonna be a... 01:23 What will I say? 01:25 Eye opener. Eye opener. 01:26 Heart opener. Yeah. 01:28 Doors will be opened to victory. 01:31 Doors will be shut to defeat. 01:34 And we are so excited. 01:35 This is not a program that you wanna turn away. 01:38 You might like our outfits, 01:39 that's not why we want you to stay tuned 01:41 because this topic is very informative, 01:44 but a very serious topic, honey. 01:45 Yeah. 01:46 Very timely for our generation. Yes. 01:48 And so you might wanna gather your family together. 01:51 If you're married and your wife is home, 01:53 your husband is home, 01:55 hey, sit down together and listen to the program 01:57 because I am sure, right, honey? 02:00 I am positive. That what this topic is about. 02:02 Whether you're pastor, whether you're a lay member, 02:04 whether you are not involved in any kind of ministry, 02:07 you may have just become married, 02:09 you may have been married for a long time, 02:11 everybody is included in the program. 02:13 You may be a college student or high school student, 02:17 this topic covers every avenue. 02:20 I'm amazed. 02:21 We're not gonna cover all of it, 02:23 but we're gonna touch some very key areas today. 02:24 So, the program is called "Uncompromised." 02:28 We live in an uncompromised world, don't we? 02:31 In so many areas, 02:32 and we're not talking about financial compromising. 02:35 But you'll find out in just a moment so do stay tuned. 02:37 If you can, you might wanna hit the record button 02:40 so that you can share the program 02:42 and before we get to our music, 02:44 we wanna thank you for your prayers 02:46 and your financial support of this network. 02:48 3ABN is dedicated 02:49 to an undiluted three angels' messages 02:52 and this topic is undiluted because so many people are... 02:57 We're living in a world that's continually attacking us 03:00 morally, spiritually, socially, mentally 03:02 and this program talks about ways 03:04 that we can be victorious, obviously not on our own, 03:07 but through the Word of Christ 03:09 and through the power He makes available to us 03:11 uncompromised. 03:13 So thank you for all that you do for this network 03:14 but, honey, we have some music today. 03:17 Yeah, Message of Mercy. 03:19 So, what, is this a quintet? 03:20 This is five women, yeah. 03:22 Five women, they gonna be singing a song called 03:25 "Whispers to Your Heart." 04:12 There is a still small voice 04:17 That carries up of the worldly noise 04:24 He brings to you the knowledge of truth 04:30 Can you hear it? 04:33 When the Spirit whispers to your heart 04:40 Holy Spirit rain on us 04:47 Teach us to be holy 04:53 Comfort and sustain us 05:00 Fill us with grace and peace 05:07 There is a gentle one 05:12 A comforter sent from the Son 05:19 A messenger of an undying love 05:25 Can you hear it? 05:28 When the Spirit whispers to your heart 05:35 Holy Spirit rain on us 05:41 Teach us to be holy 05:48 Comfort and sustain us 05:54 Fill us with grace and peace 06:01 Inside and with all the blessings above 06:07 From the heavenly King From the heavenly King 06:11 The source of shelter 06:16 Holy Spirit rain on us 06:22 Teach us to be holy 06:28 Comfort and sustain us 06:35 Fill us with grace and peace 07:11 Holy Spirit rain on us 07:17 Teach us to be holy 07:24 Comfort and sustain us 07:30 Fill us with grace and peace 08:16 Thank you for that wonderful song. 08:18 Wasn't it nice, honey? Yes. 08:19 And this is a good transitional point 08:23 because we're talking about whispers to your heart. 08:27 But they're also whispers of the heart. 08:30 And right now we want to take an opportunity 08:32 to go ahead and introduce our guests today. 08:35 Don and Lisa Sawvel, 08:37 Sawvel, am I saying that correct? 08:39 Good to have you here. Yes. 08:40 Thanks for having us. 08:42 You know, this is not our first time meeting, 08:43 we met at, there was something... 08:45 At a church. At our church. 08:46 Your church, yes. That was the last year? 08:48 Well, one year ago. 08:49 One year ago. 08:51 Donna Willey gave a program. 08:52 Yeah. Yes. 08:54 But we're glad that you're here today 08:55 to talk about a very important topic. 08:57 The topic your ministry is called UNcompromised. 09:00 Yes. 09:02 And, but we want to find out kind of... 09:05 About you. 09:06 Yeah, find about you, tell us who you are, 09:07 where you're from, and kind of what you do right now? 09:10 Okay, we're very, we're very busy people. 09:13 We both work full time. 09:15 And we really have a ministry that's full time as well. 09:18 So... Wow. 09:19 It keeps us quite busy. 09:21 But I'm an actual truck driver, it's what I do every day. 09:24 Drive semi and do local work, 09:27 so that we can do our ministry in the evenings 09:30 and on weekends, 09:31 and Lisa, what do you do? 09:33 I am a physical therapy tech. 09:36 And what that really means right now 09:38 is that I work at the front desk. 09:40 So I love people. 09:42 And as long as I can be around people, 09:44 I'm happy, 09:45 and I wanna show them Jesus as much as I can. 09:49 So, yeah. 09:50 And I'm also on the women's ministry board 09:54 to the Michigan Conference 09:56 and that's where UNcompromised comes from. 09:58 I'm the purity facilitator for that ministry. 10:03 Okay. 10:04 What were you saying, honey? 10:06 And, Don, you were a pastor's kid, 10:07 weren't you? 10:08 Yes, I was raised a preacher's kid. 10:12 And my mom and dad are both gone now. 10:15 But as I grew up back in that era, 10:19 they moved pastors every one to two years. 10:22 They felt it was better to keep them 10:24 going from church to church 10:26 and that developed 10:29 something tough in my life. 10:30 I was an introvert 10:33 and to move to a new school each year 10:35 and to start over and all new friends 10:38 was not a good thing for me. 10:40 I went to eight schools in 12 years. 10:41 Wow. 10:43 So it was a tough start for me. 10:45 I was also a third child, so... 10:47 Middle. 10:48 Yeah, middle child 10:50 and I was picked on by my older siblings so. 10:54 Oh my, so you lived all over the US about basically? 10:57 Yes, yes. 10:59 Was raised in Michigan initially 11:01 and then went to the East Coast, 11:03 West Coast, back to the East Coast. 11:07 Definitely jumped around. 11:08 So your dad was almost like an itinerary preacher, 11:10 where are we gonna be next dad? 11:12 And the family was moving in that. 11:13 So that shock that you talked about 11:15 was something everybody was experiencing? 11:16 Yes. 11:18 So what did that do to you? 11:19 What did that created in your life? 11:21 Well, early on, 11:23 it created a lot of insecurities. 11:26 And by the time I was in my early teens, 11:30 I had discovered pornography, 11:33 and... 11:38 Satan makes me angry many times 11:40 when I see what he has done to a woman, 11:43 and my view of a woman as a man, 11:47 and how he has used that in this world. 11:49 But you know, 11:51 as much as God has a plan for every single one of us, 11:55 Satan does and he start studying us 11:57 from when we're first born. 11:59 And he was on a mission to destroy me 12:02 with my quietness 12:04 and being an introvert 12:06 and when I was introduced to pornography, 12:08 this was a way that I could go inside 12:11 and feel good about me. 12:12 Self-medicate. 12:14 And self-medicate myself 12:15 without having to interact with people. 12:18 And so he started this process in my life at an early age, 12:22 and which carried on into my first marriage 12:25 as well as my second marriage. 12:27 And so, so growing up 12:30 having this instability in your own life, 12:33 being the son of a pastor, 12:37 talk about how that affected your marriage 12:39 'cause you said that went, 12:41 that happened in my first marriage, 12:42 my second marriage? 12:44 My first marriage, it was all secret. 12:47 Of course, 12:48 this is not something you share with anyone. 12:51 And that's why people say, 12:54 well, what are you doing on a television program 12:56 that'll reach around the world? 12:58 It's because it's not about me anymore. 13:00 It's not about Lisa anymore. It's all about Jesus. 13:02 Amen. Amen. 13:04 It's all about His amazing grace. 13:06 But as a child, I wanted to make my dad happy, 13:11 as a preacher. 13:13 And yet, I had this sin developing in my life. 13:18 Rejection over and over, I felt, 13:21 and it just created a perfect atmosphere for Satan 13:26 to just take hold of me 13:28 and develop this in me to a depth 13:31 that was way too deep for me to even deal with. 13:36 And, you know, 13:37 I wanna use a scripture here in Proverbs. 13:42 Because early on, 13:43 if I had followed this scripture, 13:46 it's Proverbs 3:5-7 13:51 and I wish I had, as a young man, 13:54 being a pastor's kid had paid attention to these words. 13:59 And this is what it says, 14:00 starting with verse 5 in Proverbs 3, 14:02 "Trust in the Lord with all thine heart, 14:05 and lean not unto thine own understanding 14:09 in all thy ways acknowledge Him, 14:11 and He shall direct thy paths." 14:14 And then verse 7, 14:15 "Be not wise in thine own eyes, 14:19 fear the Lord and depart from evil." 14:22 You see, 14:23 too many times, we're wise in our own eyes. 14:26 We think, we've got it in control, 14:28 we know what should be done, 14:29 and how to take care of this issue. 14:32 And it's not true. Right. 14:34 We need to trust in the Lord fully. 14:36 And, you know, 14:38 women get into pornography as well. 14:41 I did get into a little pornography, 14:43 even as a teenager, 14:45 went to triple x movies with boyfriends. 14:49 And it never became an addiction to me. 14:52 But it is something 14:54 that even when Don and I first started dating, 14:56 I noticed that he had Playboy channel. 15:00 And I said, "Oh, again, let's watch that." 15:02 Yeah. 15:04 So, you know, 15:06 I was raised in an Adventist Church, 15:08 as an Adventist Christian, 15:09 and that stuff just comes in 15:12 and, you know, 15:13 it's almost like we separate God 15:17 as our spiritual Father, 15:19 and separate Him, 15:21 like from our sexuality all together. 15:24 And I really think that's because 15:26 when we're being raised in our families, 15:29 and this is happening everywhere, 15:31 we talk about God, 15:33 and we talk about His love and everything, 15:35 but we don't talk to our kids about sex. 15:39 We don't talk to them at all about, it's like, 15:41 no, just don't do it until you're married. 15:43 And that's all you get. 15:44 So we separate God out of that completely. 15:48 And 15:50 we feel like we can do whatever, 15:52 because God's not in that. 15:54 And the world will teach the kids if you don't, 15:57 the schools will teach them. 15:58 Yes. That's right. 15:59 It will teach them at a very young age now, 16:01 as kids having phones at four and five, 16:04 they are already on sites that they should not be on. 16:07 I saw a poster the other day that said, 16:09 "The devil has a plan for your children. 16:12 Do you?" Wow. 16:15 We have to have a plan for our children. 16:17 We have to teach them and train them 16:20 all about our purity, our sexual purity. 16:24 And, Don, you said it, 16:25 they have it on their phones today 16:29 and many children or teenagers, 16:31 whoever, they go to bed, 16:33 they have their phones with them. 16:34 Right. 16:36 Remember Dinzey s 16:37 when the kids would stay with us, 16:39 Idalia says, 16:40 "Make sure, take their phones from them at night." 16:42 Don't let them go to sleep with their phones. 16:44 Don't let it be in their rooms when they're sleeping. 16:45 Let them sleep. Yeah, right. 16:48 The generation today 16:50 has such a disadvantage 16:54 of Satan's attack against them 16:56 because of the availability of these things 17:00 in our society today. 17:02 It used to be, you had to go to a video store 17:04 and go to the back room 17:06 to find any kind of that type of material. 17:08 And now, 17:10 you can be alone there with your phone 17:12 and have it all. 17:14 I'm glad you brought that up 17:15 because what's happened today... 17:17 Excuse me, there is a speaker called Simon Sinek, 17:21 excuse me. 17:23 He speaks to young people primarily, 17:26 but to the generation 17:27 which we live, that's a better context. 17:30 And he says, 17:31 "How many people would give their 12 year old alcohol?" 17:35 How many would say, 17:36 "Here's the key, go to the alcohol cabinet. 17:39 Here's the key, go get the marijuana, 17:40 get the cigarettes, get the drugs." 17:42 The parents would, you know, 17:44 recoil at that very thought. 17:46 Right. 17:47 But he says, when you give them a cell phone, 17:49 you're saying to them, medicate yourself. 17:52 You're saying to them, 17:54 you have drink as much alcohol as you want, 17:56 do anything that you want to any limit you want. 17:59 And it's completely up to you. 18:00 And he said, that's the problem with our generation today. 18:03 So what you're talking about that affected you at a time 18:05 when these things were not available? 18:06 That's right. 18:08 Remember now, back in those days, 18:10 we didn't have the cell phones, 18:12 we didn't have all these kinds of devices, iPads 18:14 and things that are continually pouring media. 18:16 We were not raised with a computer in our own room. 18:18 Right. 18:20 I believe the devil knows that his time is short. 18:22 Yeah. Oh, yeah. 18:24 And he needs to use media, 18:25 you know, to speed up the... 18:27 Right. 18:29 And the televisions are getting larger. 18:30 Yeah. 18:32 And in the thousands of channels, 18:34 I got to watch TV one hour a day 18:38 if I did my homework... 18:39 Back when we were young. Growing up. 18:41 So I wasn't raised with that need 18:43 to be always watching TV. 18:45 But today, 18:46 it's coming from everywhere. 18:48 Right. And, but now... 18:50 Lisa, let's go to Lisa. Yeah. 18:53 She had a something very traumatic 18:55 happen in your life? 18:57 Yes. 19:00 Because I was dating Don 19:02 who was no longer following God, 19:04 he was doing everything 19:06 he could to drag me out of God's Church, 19:10 away from God 19:11 because he didn't want anything to do with God 19:13 and he actually told me, 19:15 like a second date. 19:17 He's like, you know, 19:18 I've been there, I've done that. 19:20 And I won't ever do that again, 19:22 meaning being a follower of God. 19:24 Big red flag. 19:26 So that was a red flag for me. 19:27 But I'm like, okay, you know... 19:29 Yeah, yeah. 19:30 Just taking everything so lightheartedly 19:33 instead of really seeing, are we spiritually, 19:37 you know, in together... 19:39 Compatible. Yeah, and we weren't at all. 19:42 But yes, 19:45 because of him pulling me and me allowing it 19:49 and I got pregnant before we were married. 19:53 And 19:57 that was pretty traumatic. 19:59 I wanted children, 20:00 and I just wanted to get married and have children. 20:03 That was my whole goal in life. 20:05 And I wanted to keep this child. 20:10 But there were prominent people in my life. 20:16 My husband, mostly that... 20:20 Wasn't husband yet but I was... 20:21 Yeah, my boyfriend. Prominent. 20:24 We talked about it, and he's like, 20:26 you know, it's just not the right time. 20:29 And because of me being a people pleaser, 20:32 I'm like, okay, 20:34 I'll have an abortion. 20:37 And it was... 20:40 Was he in agreement, both of you at the time? 20:42 Yeah. Yeah. 20:44 He wanted to have the abortion. 20:45 I actually was pushing her, 20:46 she really wanted to keep the baby. 20:48 And it was really me pushing her 20:50 that she agreed to it. 20:53 You already had children prior to this. 20:55 I had three... 20:57 And I remember telling him and crying, 20:59 it's like, 21:00 you gave your first wife three children, 21:02 and you won't even give me one. 21:06 And so I was pleading, 21:07 I was pleading with him to be able to keep my child. 21:13 So I promised her, I said, 21:15 we'll get married, and we'll have one child 21:18 in a couple of years. 21:21 So I, 21:24 yep, had the abortion 21:25 and I remember coming out into the waiting room 21:30 and like, I don't want anyone to know 21:33 how deeply this hurt me. 21:34 And so I just talked to all those feelings down and like, 21:39 I'm just, I just have to forget it 21:42 and tried to move on for many, many years. 21:46 And it was very, very difficult. 21:49 I was, 21:53 I was even re-baptized 21:55 and thinking that, 21:58 you know, if they just put me under the water, 22:01 then it's gonna stay there. 22:03 You know that pain, that sin is gonna stay there. 22:06 But it didn't work either. 22:08 It didn't, 22:10 I didn't find freedom from the pain of the abortion 22:13 and I'll never find complete. 22:18 There's always going to be that longing that... 22:19 That loss. 22:21 That loss is always gonna be there. 22:22 What could have happened if that child was still alive? 22:24 Yeah. 22:25 Right, but there's freedom in knowing that I am forgiven. 22:27 Amen. 22:29 And the pregnancy care center 22:30 actually had someone come to our church, 22:32 and she wanted, 22:34 you know, to have volunteers come 22:36 and so I went up to her 22:37 and I said, you know, I've had an abortion. 22:40 And I would, I think I could help, 22:43 you know, I would like to counsel women. 22:45 And she said, "Have you ever gone 22:47 through post abortion healing?" 22:49 And I said, "No, but I'm fine." 22:52 Yeah. 22:54 And so, I went through a book that it wasn't Adventist, 22:59 but there is so much scripture in there. 23:03 And it went through all the phases 23:05 that someone that has, has had an abortion, 23:07 or even a miscarriage, 23:09 goes through the anger and all of it, 23:12 and just Bible scripture. 23:16 And I finally found God. 23:18 Amen. 23:20 I found God and I saw God's character, 23:22 that He wasn't standing above me judging me. 23:25 No. 23:26 And I learned that He was actually in that room with me, 23:29 as I was aborting His child, 23:32 my child, He was there for me, 23:35 because He knew what pain was gonna follow. 23:39 And then He also was there for His child 23:41 that He had a purpose 23:42 for that I was rejecting and giving up. 23:47 Wow. 23:49 So that, and so now taking that, 23:50 you guys putting this whole thing together, 23:53 you don't want God, he just, 23:55 that works for you, 23:57 but just not a road, I'm gonna go down. 23:58 You know, 24:00 I'm not gonna let this impact my life. 24:04 If religion is for you, great. 24:07 Okay, the abortion's behind us. 24:10 Let's just go ahead 24:11 and, then but now carrying that new burden, 24:17 you still, 24:18 there was another hit to come in your marriage, 24:20 talk about that? 24:22 Well, 24:23 as we entered into marriage 24:26 and Lisa didn't know that of my addiction 24:30 even though we had watched things together, 24:33 she didn't know I was addicted to pornography. 24:36 But as we entered into this marriage, 24:38 she immediately felt rejection. 24:41 You see, pornography teaches you to conquer 24:46 and once you've conquered this, 24:48 then you move on to the next. 24:50 Well, once I had conquered her as a wife, 24:53 I no longer desired her sexually. 24:56 I could take care of myself. 24:57 I was trained that from when I was young, 24:59 to take care of myself. 25:02 And so I started rejecting her over and over, 25:06 her mom had told her you don't ever turn a man away. 25:08 Well, her man was turning her away. 25:11 And so those first years, she just felt so rejected 25:16 and the challenge is, me, 25:21 I'm feeling, I hate myself, actually. 25:26 Someone that is addicted to pornography 25:28 realizes how filthy they are, 25:31 how much they're into themselves, 25:34 and you really develop a hate for yourself. 25:38 And you plead as I got back to God, 25:44 and after one year, 25:46 we were married, I actually was re-baptized. 25:49 Amen. 25:51 And started "a walk with God." 25:54 But you cannot walk with God 25:57 and carry this heavy suitcase of sin 26:02 that you don't want to let go off. 26:04 That's right. Wow. 26:05 And you see, I didn't wanna, 26:07 I wasn't ready to let go of that. 26:08 And so I'm carrying this heavy suitcase 26:10 and trying to start to walk with God 26:13 and still treating my wife terribly. 26:17 We had our son at two years as I had promised her. 26:20 You did have your son. Yes. 26:22 And that in itself was a trauma to Lisa. 26:28 Tell them about when you had him 26:31 and what you were thinking just before you had him? 26:34 Yeah, I had a lot of nightmares when I was pregnant. 26:40 I dreamed that the baby before him had 26:45 written on my womb that I was here first 26:48 and just a lot of guilt and so on. 26:52 In my dream, when my child was born, 26:54 he came out with like a look of disgust. 26:57 Like, you're my mother, you know, after what you did, 27:01 but I'll tell you when they laid 27:02 that precious child on my chest. 27:05 Oh! What joy? 27:07 And he was looking up at me with his squinty little eyes. 27:11 I heard about grace all my life, 27:13 but I never understood it until that moment 27:16 when my child is looking at his mama. 27:20 And he's just a perfect, beautiful child 27:23 and he became the love of my life 27:27 because the love of my life wasn't there for me. 27:32 I was being rejected by him. 27:34 So my son became the love of my life. 27:37 Wow. 27:39 So that's another distortion in our marriage. 27:43 Did you know about the pornography then? 27:45 No. 27:47 No, I knew there was some masturbation going on 27:50 or something, you know, but I, I didn't understand it all. 27:55 I didn't understand why he was rejecting me. 27:58 And I actually developed a hate towards him. 28:03 I already came into the marriage 28:05 with a chip on my shoulder because of the abortion. 28:08 And then now, 28:10 I'm like, what's wrong with me? 28:12 You know, why? 28:13 Why are you turning me away? 28:15 And I couldn't understand those things. 28:17 I felt so unloved and unwanted. 28:20 And that's not what I saw with my parents. 28:23 My parents are the most loving couple, 28:25 you know, always kissing on each other 28:27 and everything. 28:28 And it's like, that's what I want. 28:31 That's what I want. Yes. 28:33 You know? 28:34 And, but after 14 years of the rejection 28:40 and the demeaning attitude because he hated himself. 28:44 So how he, 28:46 you know, how could he betray that for me? 28:49 You know, you brought up a very powerful point out. 28:52 As a pastor, I'm thinking about this, 28:53 all these scriptures going through my mind. 28:55 And this incapability of loving your wife, 28:58 the Bible says, he that loveth his wife loveth himself. 29:01 But you hated yourself. Yeah. 29:03 So you couldn't even think, I don't love myself, 29:05 so why would I love her? 29:07 It's a reciprocal. It's a reciprocal blessing. 29:10 If you extend that love, 29:11 it's an evidence that you love yourself, 29:13 but you didn't love yourself so you couldn't even extend it. 29:15 So you're locked in this prison of guilt. 29:18 And you're carrying the suitcase 29:20 as you refer to it, 29:21 of the practices and habits that you don't want to let go. 29:25 And you're sensing the rejection 29:27 and the only saving grace is, 29:29 I have a baby that I could love. 29:31 But still, there's an emptiness in your life. 29:34 Let's fast forward now and find out where the... 29:39 Wheels came off? 29:40 Where the balloon popped, where the wheels came off. 29:43 Yeah, because now it had to come to a head somewhere. 29:45 Yeah. Yeah. 29:47 It was tough. 29:49 You know, the interesting thing is, 29:52 Lisa and I wore such a good mask, 29:57 that everyone in our church surroundings thought 30:00 we were the happiest couple ever. 30:03 Wow. 30:05 And yet, we are so divided and so dysfunctional and... 30:10 I came to a point where I wanted to kill myself, 30:13 because if he wasn't gonna die, 30:18 where I would get freedom. 30:20 I mean, that's really what I was thinking is like 30:22 if you would just die then I could be free. 30:24 I don't, 'cause we're not supposed to divorce, right? 30:27 Till death do you apart type of thing 30:29 was going around on your head. 30:30 Yes, it was and when I came to the point of thinking suicide, 30:36 the only thing that stopped me was the love of my life, 30:39 my son, you know, and my family, of course, 30:42 but I knew that I needed help. 30:46 So I talked with a Christian lady. 30:48 And she said, "Honey, 30:50 your husband's addicted to pornography." 30:53 And I'm like, "What?" 30:54 You know, and what a stronghold that is in a man's life 31:00 that he probably would choose pornography 31:03 rather than staying with his wife 31:05 because of that is such a stronghold. 31:08 And so she goes, you probably should just separate, 31:11 you know, and let, you know, healing take place. 31:15 Well, I took that as that's my key. 31:17 I'm gonna go home and I'm gonna tell him, 31:19 I'm gonna divorce him. 31:20 Oh. 31:22 So I went home 31:23 and drop the news on him and said, 31:24 "I want a divorce." 31:26 And how did he feel when? 31:28 How did you feel, Don, when you heard that? 31:30 What did you think? 31:31 Just before you answer, I wanna just... 31:33 Yes, go ahead. Point something. 31:34 Lisa wasn't looking to fix it? 31:37 No. Right? 31:38 Lisa just wanted out. 31:39 She was done. She was done. 31:41 So the key that the lady was sharing with you 31:42 about healing it and making it work. 31:44 Just separate for a while, work on the issues 31:45 and let the Lord heal you guys to come, 31:47 but you had come to the end of your rope. 31:49 You said, I just want out of here. 31:51 I want him dead. 31:52 I'm either gonna die or he's gonna die. 31:54 Yeah. 31:55 But if you could give me a key to get out, I got the key, 31:56 so I'm gonna go ahead and lower the boom. 31:58 And that's what you... 31:59 You didn't go home for healing, 32:01 you went home for, I'm out of here. 32:02 Yeah. 32:03 Because I tried to be his Holy Spirit for years 32:05 and that didn't work. 32:06 Okay. That's a very important point. 32:08 Yeah. 32:09 The day that she dropped that bomb on me, 32:13 having already been through a divorce 32:16 after 12 years of marriage, 32:19 knowing that it was a big part of me 32:21 because of the life I was living in the dark. 32:26 I had pled with Lisa and before we got married up, 32:30 I made her promise that she would never leave me. 32:33 And that was always a fear that I lived with, 32:36 especially because I knew myself 32:38 and what I was involved with 32:41 and in that constant fear 32:42 and when she told me that it was over. 32:46 She was the love of my life. 32:48 Even though I was mistreating her, 32:51 rejecting her, demeaning her, 32:55 and women have a real hard time understanding this. 32:59 But this is a Satan's design to mess you up so bad that 33:05 yet I loved her so much and yet, 33:07 I treated her so badly. 33:10 And so when she told me that 33:11 she might as well have just taken a knife 33:13 and stuck it in my heart 33:15 because I could not live without her. 33:18 We've been together 14 years 33:20 and as I walked away from the home that night, 33:24 and I actually went, 33:26 walked out to a bridge over the highway 33:28 and I was gonna end my life, 33:30 I did not see that 33:31 I could continue on without her. 33:34 She's the only one that loved me. 33:37 And as I was there 33:40 contemplating suicide on the bridge, 33:46 that's when I heard a still small voice 33:52 and Jesus said, "Don, I love you. 33:56 Don, I will take care of you, I will walk with you, 33:59 I will help you through this." 34:01 Amen. 34:02 And I am like, I can't go on without her. 34:08 He said, "Don, we will get through this, 34:10 I'll carry you." 34:11 Yes. 34:14 And I listened to Him 34:17 and as I turned away from that bridge that night, 34:22 my life changed. 34:28 I started a new walk with Him. 34:30 Amen. 34:31 And as we separated and I moved out of the house, 34:35 and I would spend time on my knees 34:37 at night talking with God 34:39 and I say, 34:40 God, show me who I am. 34:44 Show me who I really am. 34:45 And if you pray that prayer, 34:47 He will show you who you really are. 34:49 And he showed me 34:52 how I had mistreated her so much, 34:55 how I'd been so selfish 34:57 and so focused on me all my life, 35:00 and how I'd hurt her so deeply through the abortion 35:04 and through my constant rejection of her. 35:07 And I would just weep on my knees 35:11 and plead with Him to change me. 35:13 Make me a new person. 35:16 And so He started that process that summer 35:20 of changing me as I walked with Him 35:24 and as the summer progressed, that suitcase got lighter. 35:27 Amen. Amen. 35:29 And lighter 35:32 because that is the only thing 35:35 that can replace the sin in our lives 35:39 that Satan wants us to bask in... 35:43 That's right. Is Christ. 35:44 That's right. 35:46 As Christ comes in, sin has to go out. 35:48 That's right. That's right. 35:50 I'd like to share a little bit about 35:52 what I did during the summer. 35:54 Because I changed too at that point, 35:56 I became cold, cold hearted 36:00 and I went to another pastor 36:03 because I just didn't feel like I had that key 36:06 that I could divorce still in my heart, 36:09 and so I went and talked to another pastor, 36:13 and I shared my story. 36:15 And he said, "Lisa, I hear your story. 36:18 But I want you to go home 36:19 and I want you to pray that God will change Don's heart. 36:22 And then I want you to pray 36:24 that God will change your heart." 36:26 So I'm like, "Okay, I can do that, 36:28 I can do these things and then I can divorce him." 36:31 So I get down on my knees that night and I prayed, 36:34 God, please change Don's heart, 36:38 but I couldn't pray for God to change my heart. 36:41 Because I knew what God wanted. 36:43 I knew God wanted me to stay with my husband 36:45 because he pleaded for me to stay with him. 36:48 He wasn't like I thought, he really wanted me. 36:51 Yes. 36:52 But I could not, 36:53 I did not want to be his wife anymore. 36:55 He hurt me too much. 36:57 So all summer long, 36:58 I pray that God would change Don's heart, 37:00 and I couldn't pray that He would change my heart. 37:03 So my heart wasn't being changed by God, 37:05 but it was by the devil, 37:07 because my heart was getting colder and colder. 37:12 I thought that I would just step off of God's path 37:17 and walk my own path until I divorced Don. 37:20 And then when I'm divorced, 37:21 then I'll come back to God's path 37:23 and say, Oh, God, I'm sorry, 37:25 maybe I shouldn't have divorced him but too late. 37:27 That's really what I had in my head 37:29 that I was gonna do. 37:31 And one day when Don was gone, 37:37 when he had our son for the weekend, 37:40 he brought him back 37:41 and the words came out of my mouth. 37:43 Do you want to take a walk? 37:44 And I'm thinking, "Why did I just say that?" 37:47 Where did that come from? 37:48 But I know that there was a lot of intercessory prayer 37:50 going on for us as well. 37:52 So God used this donkey 37:55 and made me speak and Don had a lot to share. 38:00 So as we're out walking around our neighborhood, 38:02 he's sharing all the things 38:04 that God has been showing to him. 38:07 And he said, you know, 38:09 Lisa, I'm so sorry for putting you through that abortion. 38:11 It was so selfish of me. 38:12 I should have been there for you. 38:15 And he said, we should have a memorial service for our child. 38:19 And I'm like, "No," 38:21 you know, I took care of that long ago. 38:23 I mean, I was cold, you are not getting in, Don. 38:26 That's what I was telling him. 38:28 And he just kept sharing his heart. 38:31 And the last thing that he said to me 38:33 is what changed me. 38:36 He said, Lisa, 38:38 you brought me back to God. 38:41 And I see you going away from God. 38:44 He said, even if we don't get back together, 38:47 don't lose your walk with God. 38:51 And that took me back, I'm like, Oh. 38:54 Yeah. 38:55 He really does care about me. 38:57 And in my head, I'm thinking, 39:00 what other man would I ever find 39:02 that would care about my salvation like that? 39:07 So that night, I got down on my knees. 39:09 And I prayed that God would change Don's heart. 39:14 I could see that He had been doing just that. 39:17 And then I asked God, 39:19 "Please change my heart too." 39:22 I could see how cold I had gotten. 39:25 I wanted Jesus back in my life again. 39:28 Amen. 39:30 And within 24 hours, 39:33 I went to Don's work, 39:35 had a pretty dress on, 39:38 and I said, "I really want you to come back home, 39:40 I'm willing to make this work." 39:42 Wow. 39:44 And it wasn't everything's perfect, 39:48 but you know, I praise God that he's not a God 39:50 that just makes things just happen just perfect. 39:53 Because it's that journey of our growth 39:57 and it was our journey with, 39:58 our growth with God 40:00 that brought us back together with us 40:02 spending time on our knees and in God's Word. 40:06 We were getting strength from Jesus. 40:08 And that is where it continued to bring us closer together 40:12 as we get closer to God. 40:14 Wow. 40:16 And so now then he's back home. Yes. 40:19 You're all in committed to make it work. 40:22 Amen. Yes. 40:23 Well, now this is kind of a rhetorical question. 40:27 Did it work? Yes, it did. 40:29 Your son must have been so happy. 40:31 Oh, yes. 40:32 We've been married for 32 years. 40:33 Praise God. 40:35 Our son said that he had plans to run away 40:39 if we were to divorce. 40:41 Wow. 40:42 And I as a mother thought that I was protecting our son 40:46 from his father. 40:48 And I had no idea that children do not want divorce. 40:53 No. 40:54 Even when you think that you're doing them a favor, 40:56 you're not. 40:58 Wow. 40:59 I wanna pause 'cause you know, 41:00 I know you've been watching this, 41:02 probably this been very emotional. 41:03 I'm sitting here trying to be the strong man, 41:05 everybody's weeping in tears, 41:06 have surely come up to my throat. 41:09 But what is being talked about 41:10 what Don and Lisa are talking about 41:12 are the real factors of life, 41:15 the real issues of life. 41:18 You know, we could have sugar coated this thing and said, 41:20 "Well, you know, everything happened, 41:22 just prayer is gonna change overnight." 41:24 But as Lisa just pointed out, and Don is in total agreement, 41:27 and we are too, 41:28 it's all about the journey. 41:30 It's not always the destination. 41:31 It's about the journey. 41:32 And they have a ministry now called Uncompromised, 41:35 and right now I want to show you 41:37 a brief video clip 41:39 as to why this ministry is important. 41:42 And then we're gonna talk about the book briefly 41:44 with the time we have remaining. 41:45 And then we're gonna also let you know 41:47 how you can get in touch with Don and Lisa 41:48 because they do travel to churches 41:50 and wherever they are invited to help people, 41:54 schools to help people 41:55 that are maybe one to one 41:57 as a husband and wife in this situation, 41:59 or churches, or wherever they'd like to be invited. 42:03 So now look at this video 42:04 and we'll come back on the other side of it 42:06 and share some thoughts with you. 42:17 Over 16,000 young adults 42:19 find out that they have a form of STI every day. 42:24 Christian teens think that to remain a virgin, 42:27 they can do everything except intercourse. 42:30 The two out of three divorces in the US 42:32 including in Christian families 42:34 had something to do with pornography or sexuality. 42:37 51% of Christian pastors 42:40 admit that cyber porn has been a temptation 42:44 and 37% admit that 42:47 they have been addicted in the past. 42:50 50% of Christian men and 28% of Christian women 42:54 are addicted to pornography. 42:56 Teens that believe in virginity 42:58 until marriage are just as likely to contract STI 43:02 as a fellow peers. 43:05 To be able to hear him say 43:08 that he was in pornography and this and that. 43:11 And they were able, with God's help 43:15 to save their marriage 43:17 and to get the evil out 43:19 and become one again... 43:24 made me believe in now in my own heart 43:27 that there is a chance in my own life 43:30 that I can and will have love 43:33 and know what love is by man. 43:36 UNcompromised is a program 43:38 that is sponsored by the Michigan Conference 43:41 to address and train men and women of all ages 43:45 and young people about purity. 43:48 So we as Christians want to stand 43:51 and defend God's Church. 43:53 This is a revolving ministry 43:55 that we're just discovering new ways 43:57 that we should be changing this up, 43:59 They share in a very meaningful 44:01 and transparent way their struggle, 44:04 their journey. 44:05 I've taken the mask off, I'm not proud who I was, 44:09 but I am proud who I am. 44:10 Nobody's too young to understand this 44:13 and to learn from scripture, 44:15 what God's plan is. 44:17 And He allows us to experience the freshest experiences. 44:21 He allows us to taste the freshest tastes, 44:24 the most pungent of aromas 44:27 in a combination that only God intended for, 44:31 that God allows for and has the best for us 44:34 because He created us. 44:36 Could it be why that this is where God says, 44:39 "Taste and see that the Lord is good." 44:41 I mean, this is a existential encounter with God. 44:47 So maybe sometimes 44:48 we just have to submit our judgment calls, 44:51 submit our intellect, 44:53 just submit our taste buds 44:56 to enjoy what the Lord, 44:58 our Creator intended us to experience. 45:00 Teach purity to all of our members 45:03 and for us to be prepared for the Lord soon coming. 45:07 We've just watched the Holy Spirit work 45:08 in an awesome way. 45:10 I've been with alcoholics. 45:11 I've been with sexual abusers. 45:16 And I'm compact. 45:17 UNcompromised means it stops now. 45:39 Powerful video clip. Yes, it was. 45:42 But it's just... It's reality. 45:44 It's a reality but it's just a drop in the bucket 45:46 as to the various places that Don and Lisa had been 45:50 in doing seminars 45:51 and night to night counseling. 45:53 You mentioned, both of you mentioned 45:54 that you counsel pretty much 45:55 almost every night of the week. 45:57 Yes. 45:59 We get pretty busy sometimes. 46:00 Okay, sure. Now then book. 46:02 You have a book that is entitled 46:04 "God's Heart Call to Inner Peace." 46:07 It's an amazing workbook 46:09 but tell us about this booklet. 46:11 Tell us about this book, actually, 46:13 is the number of pages here, 46:14 about 200 pages almost. 46:16 And tell us what role this plays in your ministry? 46:21 It was written by Bruce and Dorothy Hayward, 46:23 wasn't written by us, they compiled it, 46:26 and it's a very powerful book 46:28 because if you look at the table of contents there. 46:32 One of the early pages, 46:33 you'll listen to these chapters live in trust, 46:36 surrender fear, live in humility, 46:38 surrender pride, live in forgiveness, 46:41 surrender bitterness, 46:43 live in obedience, surrender rebellion 46:45 and so all of these issues 46:47 every one of us deal with every day in our lives 46:50 whether it's pride, whether it's fears, 46:52 whether it's bitterness 46:54 and how do we deal with those? 46:57 And so, Lisa and I use this book 46:59 especially for couples, 47:01 as we're going through their challenges in their life 47:05 as their marriage is on the verge of splitting. 47:08 And, obviously, 47:10 God has brought us together to help others to not split. 47:15 And so that is our mission. 47:17 But I wanna share one tool that we share, 47:20 specifically with people, 47:22 and it's called a weapon card, 47:24 Scripture weapon card. 47:26 And, so how do we defeat Satan 47:29 when he's on the attack? 47:31 And I wanna use an example of what I did. 47:36 I carry these with me all the time. 47:40 My yellow card is actually the stronghold is lust. 47:44 And it has a prayer and a scripture. 47:47 When Jesus was here on earth, 47:49 and Satan was attacking Him, 47:51 the Son of God, Himself, 47:54 what did he used to defeat Satan? 47:55 The Word of God. 47:57 It is written. It is written. 47:58 So who am to walk out in the world today, 48:02 and Satan attacks and I expect to just 48:05 kind of brush him off some way 48:07 unless I use the Word of God to defeat him. 48:10 That's right. 48:11 That's what these cards are about. 48:12 So we keep these with us, he keeps it in his pants. 48:15 So I'll use a quick story. 48:17 I was going to Walmart, 48:18 needed to pick up some printer ink for my printer. 48:21 And I parked and I'm walking through the front doors. 48:24 And just as the doors open, here comes a woman walking 48:28 across in front of me scantily dressed, 48:30 didn't have enough on even for Walmart 48:33 and walking through. 48:35 And so instantly, I reached in my pocket. 48:39 And it's yellow. 48:40 I know which card it is. 48:42 And I pull out my card. 48:44 And I'm walking still through Walmart looking over my card. 48:47 As I'm walking through the aisle, 48:49 I know where the ink is at. 48:51 And I read my prayer. 48:52 Lord, I am your child and I want all of my thoughts, 48:55 desires and actions to please Christ, 48:58 I renounce Satan's desire for me to focus on lust. 49:02 I choose to yield to Christ. 49:05 Amen. 49:06 And then my scripture Job 31:1, 49:08 "I have made a covenant with my eyes 49:11 not to look on a woman to lust after her in my heart." 49:15 Amen. 49:16 As I get done with my card. Yes. 49:18 I have arrived at my ink. 49:21 Where do you think the temptation is? 49:22 It's gone. It's gone. 49:24 Behind you. 49:25 As soon as I have taken action 49:27 on God's Word, 49:29 Satan runs. 49:30 That's right. That's right. 49:32 And so we have to have this ability 49:35 to defeat Satan with the Word of God alone. 49:37 That's right. 49:39 And that's why we have scripture weapon cards. 49:41 Another stronghold is bitterness. 49:43 And one time I was at church 49:47 and people will say different things. 49:51 That kind of, kind of, get you, 49:53 you know, get you upset a little bit. 49:55 Well, I went into the sanctuary, 49:57 sat down and church service was starting, 50:00 and I'm sitting there going over my mind 50:02 what people have said to me, 50:03 and I'm getting more and more bitter. 50:05 And I don't keep my bitterness 50:07 or my scripture weapon cards with me very well. 50:09 I have to dig through my purse too much. 50:12 But I knew my husband was sitting there 50:14 and I knew he had a bitterness card. 50:16 So I'm like, Honey, do you have your bitterness card? 50:19 Now you make each color a different thing? 50:21 Yeah, each stronghold is a different color 50:23 so you know which one it is. 50:25 So you can quickly... Let's hold this. 50:26 Hold these up. Hold up the cards. 50:28 Hold that bitterness card up, you're on the right hand. 50:29 Now what happened when he gave that to you? 50:31 This is what. Now the blue one means what? 50:33 Whatever you wanted to mean. 50:35 Okay, I got you. 50:36 So I read this, Lord, I am your child, 50:38 and I choose for you to remove all bitterness 50:41 and anger from me. 50:42 I renounce Satan's desire to control me. 50:45 I want all my thoughts to reflect Christ alone. 50:48 And then I read the scripture. 50:50 And that's Ephesians 4:30-32, 50:53 "Grieve not the Holy Spirit of God, 50:55 whereby we are sealed unto the day of redemption. 50:58 Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamor, 51:02 and evil speaking be put away from you. 51:05 Forgive one another, 51:06 even as God has forgiven you for Christ's sake." 51:10 And immediately my heart, I mean, I was weeping, 51:13 I could feel the tears welling up in my eyes. 51:16 My heart was being melted by God's Word. 51:20 And all that bitterness was gone. 51:22 So what I'm hearing you say, 51:23 and this is something that's very important. 51:25 A lot of times people think about the arsenal 51:28 that we can use, 51:30 but they don't use it at the moment it's needed. 51:31 That's right. Okay. 51:33 Because when you go to church 51:34 and the sermon is being preached 51:36 and everything good is being said 51:37 and you're singing songs to the glory of God, 51:39 the devil is waiting outside 51:40 because he doesn't want to be in that place of praise. 51:42 He doesn't wanna hear that sermon. 51:43 He doesn't want to be in that Sabbath School Bible Study. 51:45 He doesn't want to be there. 51:47 But he's waiting outside for you on the battlefield, 51:49 which is really the mind 51:50 and every situation that you encounter. 51:52 And so what you're in essence saying 51:54 to those watching or listen to the program 51:56 is call on the Lord while He is near, 52:00 seek Him while He may be found, 52:01 call upon the Lord while He is near. 52:03 So you think at that moment 52:06 is when the battle is at his thickest. 52:08 Get the best weapon and what's the best weapon? 52:10 You're at the crossroads. God's Word. 52:12 You have to choose one way or the other. 52:14 Say it again, Lisa. 52:15 You're right at the crossroads, and you have a choice. 52:17 Am I gonna go this way or I'm gonna go this way? 52:19 Yes. Wow. 52:20 And it's that quick of a decision too, 52:22 you know, you have to make that decision. 52:24 Otherwise, if you go the other, if 52:26 you don't make a decision, 52:27 you're automatically gonna go towards that stronghold and... 52:31 Wow. 52:32 If I had waited two seconds, 52:34 and looked at the temptation again, 52:37 I would have failed. 52:39 Instead, I instantly knew what I choose, God. 52:44 And so I reached for the card. 52:46 That's right. And defeat Satan. 52:47 And that's why I trust my husband. 52:49 Amen. 52:51 Because I know that he's a godly man, 52:52 he's seeking after God. 52:54 And if he wasn't spending that time with God every day, 52:57 then I would, 52:59 I would not have the trust that I have for him now. 53:01 Amen, amen. So. 53:03 These weapon cards are available on our website. 53:06 And we're gonna let our viewers and listeners know 53:08 where that's going to be. 53:09 You know, we're about to go 53:11 to our news break here in just a moment. 53:13 But, honey, this is, this material, 53:15 we have to have you come to our church. 53:17 Have to. We'd love to. 53:19 And do a seminar for the men and for the women, 53:21 for the families. 53:22 And I know they're those of you that are saying, 53:23 "Man, where are people like this when we need them." 53:27 We're going to take a short news break 53:29 and on the other side of the news break, 53:32 we're gonna let you know by the way 53:33 before that news break, how to get this information. 53:36 The website is where you can reach 53:38 Don and Lisa is alifelikechrist.org. 53:43 Alifelikechrist.org, 53:48 there is on the bottom of your screen, 53:49 and on that website, their phone number 53:51 and their email and their contact information 53:54 on how you can get in touch with them 53:55 to invite them is listed there. 53:57 But tight after the news break, 53:58 we'll come back with a few closing thoughts. |
Revised 2021-07-27